YT Decoy thread part 2

[Marc]

So it turns out the decoy does have to go back to Europe rather than to a local shimano service centre?

Told him Wilared said in Robs interview they chose Shimano because of the Shimano Service Centers ... no answer so far. Is Lifka the only service/support guy at YT!?

 

[Nasty Nick]

Yep 100% Grip 2 version on my bike[/QUOTE]

Glad to see you guys got the grip 2!

 

[Nasty Nick]

What is your goal for the fork? What’s your ride fantasy (fully pinned in the gnar, boosting secret gaps at the park, 100k epics, etc)?

No doubt the fork is crazy smooth now, and with the open bath damper the maintenance intervals are huge. But I’m more of a smash every lip, huck to flat, try to snap a berm style of rider so I need a higher spring rate. I had to go through a few springs to find the right one, which was costly and being a little over sprung means I lost some of the plushness. And there is the weight, my base decoy, fully coiled with pedals is over 55 lbs. So for me I think a better upgrade may have been a modified air spring like the DSD Runt. But don’t get me wrong I’m very happy with the set up too. I’d suggest cooling the rear and maybe a damper upgrade like the hc97 first.

Funny I met those guys from that review at the bike park and did a wife swap with nick. I found his levo to be a lot more flickable and “normal” when jumping. The weight difference was very noticeable.

Thanks for your feedback. I currently have a Push 11/6 on the back and wanted to bump my Lyrik up to 180mm and try a mod from one of these companies. I'll look at the Runt and HC97. I was also even considering a 180mm Boxxer. I believe the axle to crown on a 180mm Boxxer is the same as a 170mm Lyrik. Boxxer weight should be comparable to a 35/36mm SC fork with the Smashpot. Also the upcoming Manitou Mezzer with it's 37mm stanchions has my eye. Would like to see some feedback on that fork.

It's being used in Colorado front range gnar, everything from blues to double blacks -- very rocky, dry, loose. Even with the coil on there I find the bike to still be playful and I've been doing little bonus jump lines etc. Might be the shorter chainstays and wheelbase compared to my other steed (Pole Evolink 158). Sadly, not as much bike park action as I was hoping as I just called Trestle bike park (best park around) and they don't allow ebikes. Not a huge deal, as I do still love the Evolink.

Have you found any other mods to the Decoy to be hugely worth-while? I'm also about to throw a -2 degree headset in mine and run it in the high position.

That’s pretty smart. Vital says the 29” boxer is 2,615 g and my yari w/ avalanche and smashpot is 2,637 without the axle. Like you said you can run it at 180 mm travel and have the same a2c as a 170 Lyrik. I’m sure it’d help in the really steep chunk out there. Do it!!!

As far as other mods, just looking forward to swapping out the saddle and brakes. The LSS is really cool on fast smooth sections too!

 

[Lee Dove]

So it turns out the decoy does have to go back to Europe rather than to a local shimano service centre?

If the Service center could have fixed it with Shimano parts then it could have been done local. It looks like it needed some YT specific stuff and YT would not send those but may do in the future I suppose.

 

[R120]

Perhaps its the fact the battery is not a Shimano one? The problems that crop up most often with Shimano systems all seem to be related to battery issues where the battery being used is not a Shimano one, e.g Focus, Norco and now YT.

As its a YT specific battery I can't see that owners have any other option but to send it back to them.

 

[Marc]

The battery is shimano certified. And my issues are not battery related. So why would YT want my bike back instead of having a shimano center have a look at my motor? Its 1km away from my house...

Btw. My bike has no problems. I recorded a run today and my bike is quieter than all the youtube videos show. So I am simply not used to an ebike motor and its "natural" noises... and they wanted me to ship the bike back to germany.

 

[Lee Dove]

Would you be able to post a pic of your beast?

If you read further up you will see my bike is back in Germany although according to YT it may be back in the next coouple of days. Why do you want a picture ? It looks must like all the other pro models. Maybe you don't believe my observation on the fork?

 

[steve_sordy]

Ref customer service: I suspect that there is a problem caused by the German culture. In my experience (of working all over Europe and with many nationalities), the Germans respect authority and defer to formally acknowledged expertise. So qualified engineers are "Herr Docktor Ingeneur". Your boss is your boss because he knows more than you and has earned his right to be there, so if he says jump...

This manifests itself in the procedures for dealing with complaints. If the battery is exhibiting problems, the battery expert will have written a process for testing and identifying faults and what to do with them. That expert will also have delivered the immortal line that 95% of battery problems are fixed by a new battery. The Germans also have their own views about those who are not German. They count for less, not much less, but enough to make a difference. So when a British dealer reports back that after a week of testing that the battery charger is faulty and is the reason why the battery is not charging, backed up by reports from all over the world with similar conclusions, what do the Germans do? They refer to their expert who says 95% of battery problems are fixed by replacing the battery! So I got a new £600 battery instead of a £70 charger! Was the problem fixed? Who knows, because the dealer gave me an old model charger that does not have the fault. The dealer has the same view about the German suppler as I do.

Back to the YT problem. The process is to return the bike because they don't trust anyone else to do the diagnosis. They follow the written down procedures (compiled by the experts, so not challenged by the lower qualified technicians). Result is "There was no error, so we assume the bike is in perfect condition". Completely missing the point that nobody is going to send their bike back at personal cost and of course being without a bike for weeks, unless there really is something wrong somewhere!

This lack of customer-focused service will run them down in the end.

 

[Jamsxr]

The Propain bike looks nice but what cells are used in the new Shimano battery, possibly 18650 ? I could be wrong but I think YT uses a better cell 21700 , that's why their standard pack is 540. So to me the Shimano battery is already behind as far as technology goes. The YT also charges quicker. 90 % charge in 3 hrs. 100 % in 3.5 to 4 hours. Shimano is 5 hrs to 100 %. Also a carbon frame vs aluminum. YT bikes are on the market around the world but September for the Propain, and will it even be available worldwide? If YT is having such a high demand for their bike and can barley fill orders, how would Ekano do? There is no other bike available right now that compares to the Decoy for materials used, components included and the overall cost. This is a great time to be a E-bike rider with all these new bikes coming. How long will YT be one of if not the best lowest cost high end Performance E-Mountain bike? We shall see.

Disagree, the YT is an awesome bike but it doesn’t give you anything over a load of bikes on the market. I’m a YT owner and I like the brand, but I get the impression they’re becoming a little arrogant.

I went the Commencal EMTB route, as for me, it was a better value bike. 30 min of charging time means nothing...

 

[mitch1808]

Disagree, the YT is an awesome bike but it doesn’t give you anything over a load of bikes on the market. I’m a YT owner and I like the brand, but I get the impression they’re becoming a little arrogant.

I went the Commencal EMTB route, as for me, it was a better value bike. 30 min of charging time mean nothing...

I think all in all, considering components, aesthetic, price YT and canyon are still among the best options. But I agree they are all getting very close with propain commencal and others

 

[06z]

Disagree, the YT is an awesome bike but it doesn’t give you anything over a load of bikes on the market. I’m a YT owner and I like the brand, but I get the impression they’re becoming a little arrogant.

If it doesnt give you anything over a load of bikes, Please tell me where I can get a full carbon 160mm travel frame, Carbon wheels, full Factory Fox suspension, Di2, 21700 cells in the battery, Sram Code rsc brakes, Renthal etc... For $6999 U S dollars.

 

[Jamsxr]

If it doesnt give you anything over a load of bikes, Please tell me where I can get a full carbon 160mm travel frame, Carbon wheels, full Factory Fox suspension, Di2, 21700 cells in the battery, Sram Code rsc brakes, Renthal etc... For $6999 U S dollars.

? if you’re looking for a spec that’s all good... The Meta Power is 22kg, Fox factory, XT brakes, Eagle, e8000, etc.. and is significantly cheaper... I’m going to be no faster on the YT, but to be fair, it will charge 30 min quicker....

I’m not denying the YT looks better and is an amazing bike, it just cracks me up the amount EMTB owners who kid themselves into thinking their bikes are the “best”... If money was no issue, I would have a number of rigs in the garage, not just one...

 

[R120]

If it doesnt give you anything over a load of bikes, Please tell me where I can get a full carbon 160mm travel frame, Carbon wheels, full Factory Fox suspension, Di2, 21700 cells in the battery, Sram Code rsc brakes, Renthal etc... For $6999 U S dollars.

I think the point is that's its just one of many good bikes on the market at the moment, it doesn't bring anything game changing to the table.

I love the look of it, and the spec, but is it a better bike in any way to actually ride and own than my E-Sommett? No

 

[06z]

? if you’re looking for a spec that’s all good... The Meta Power is 22kg, Fox factory, XT brakes, Eagle, e8000, etc.. and is significantly cheaper... I’m going to be no faster on the YT, but to be fair, it will charge 30 min quicker....

I’m not denying the YT looks better and is an amazing bike, it just cracks me up the amount EMTB owners who kid themselves into thinking their bikes are the “best”... If money was no issue, I would have a number of rigs in the garage, not just one...

I'm not denying that Commencal makes a great bike for a fair price. But I am comparing the 2020 Commencal Meta Power 29 which has no weight spec listed and is $ 6299 US Dollars. But it has a aluminum frame and a battery made with the 18650 cells, Yt uses 21700 cells. I did not say this is the Best bike, What I am saying is as of today, you get the most for your money with a top of the line Decoy.

 

[06z]

I think the point is that's its just one of many good bikes on the market at the moment, it doesn't bring anything game changing to the table.

I love the look of it, and the spec, but is it a better bike in any way to actually ride and own than my E-Sommett? No

So what didn't you like about the Decoy when you rode it?

 

[06z]

I think all in all, considering components, aesthetic, price YT and canyon are still among the best options. But I agree they are all getting very close with propain commencal and others

I don't know if Canyon E-Bikes are available in the US? I can find their non e-bikes, but are their e-bikes available in the US?

 

[Nasty Nick]

I think all in all, considering components, aesthetic, price YT and canyon are still among the best options. But I agree they are all getting very close with propain commencal and others

I don't know if Canyon E-Bikes are available in the US? I can find their non e-bikes, but are their e-bikes available in the US?

Not yet

 

[Jamsxr]

I'm not denying that Commencal makes a great bike for a fair price. But I am comparing the 2020 Commencal Meta Power 29 which has no weight spec listed and is $ 6299 US Dollars. But it has a aluminum frame and a battery made with the 18650 cells, Yt uses 21700 cells. I did not say this is the Best bike, What I am saying is as of today, you get the most for your money with a top of the line Decoy.

I was talking about the 2019 Meta with the external battery. Fox factory all round etc. coming in at £4K.

My point is there is no best eBike whether we’re talking value or performance.

 

[R120]

So what didn't you like about the Decoy when you rode it?

I haven't ridden it, and like I said I think its a great bike, my point was its one of many great bikes now available, but what I look at when buying a bike is the fundamental elements like geometry and with an EMTB the motor and controls, and from that perspective it doesn't bring anything new to the market.

I actually had one on order, but cancelled it, as I realised the only reason I was buying it was for aesthetic reasons.

If I didn't already have an EMTB it would probably be top of my list with the new Commencal, with the Commencal 29'r probably just shading it as I prefer the geo and spec on that.

 

[Chieftain]

It's very frustrating what's going on! Usually YT guys were very open and helpful whenever you needed.
I bought 3 bikes from them alone, besides, all the guys in my group bought YT and that's why when I ordered Decoy, the YT was pretty repulsive with the clients.
They delayed my order for 2 months, I received only standard mail, say a robot answers me. At week 26, the one who passed had to get the bike! No ... has not arrived, no delivery track I have. So I'm staying for 2 weeks!
We are talking here for a lot of money, locked in YT, they use this money and I ride in the air instead of the bike!
At the last mail they did not even have to respond!
It is clear that they are out of all points of view, very many delivery delays, service problems ..... not acceptable! I think there has been a lot of frustration among the employees especially because they are out of the situation and probably work overtime, but that does not have to affect me as a client, I do not have to care! I paid 4600 euros for 2 months and I do not have the object at home!
And I'm thinking of writing to Markus Flossmann, maybe it's stupid ... I do not know !!

I was looking at the yt but its a good bike for the money but not if you can't ride it and the support is going to be garbage.

I'm not denying that Commencal makes a great bike for a fair price. But I am comparing the 2020 Commencal Meta Power 29 which has no weight spec listed and is $ 6299 US Dollars. But it has a aluminum frame and a battery made with the 18650 cells, Yt uses 21700 cells. I did not say this is the Best bike, What I am saying is as of today, you get the most for your money with a top of the line Decoy.

Commencal have proved that alloy can be as good as carbon

 

[Marc]

I don‘t see the point of this discussion in the YT section of this forum. If you don‘t want a YT and don‘t own a YT thats fine, go on.

but are we now really at the aluminum is as good as carbon point? or the german culture issues? please...

lets talk about YT decoy bikes please. If you want to talk about something else there is the general and review section and a commencal thread is there too.

if I thought there is better bike at the moment I would have bought it. thank you.

I love my Decoy. why? because how it rides and handles not because of specs, looks, materials or because its german.

 

[Chieftain]

I don‘t see the point of this discussion in the YT section of this forum. If you don‘t want a YT and don‘t own a YT thats fine, go on.

but are we now really at the aluminum is as good as carbon point? or the german culture issues? please...

lets talk about YT decoy bikes please. If you want to talk about something else there is the general and review section and a commencal thread is there too.

if I thought there is better bike at the moment I would have bought it. thank you.

I love my Decoy. why? because how it rides and handles not because of specs, looks, materials or because its german.

 

[Chieftain]

I am ready to buy a emtb and have YT at the top of the list. I too won't just buy a bike just on spec or what is fashionable hence the alloy comment. This is going to be a lot of money to me and I want to get it right. I hope that YT can get it right as I want a bike that I can ride with good backup if there is issues. looking on the forum is one one way I have of gauging the bikes reliability and yt's attitude to there new decoy customers.

 

[Marc]

I have a full Bike workshop so support is not that important for me but I do understand the argument. and on the decoy we have motors and batteries that are not self-serviceable. YT is small and seems a bit overwhelmed at the moment.

still the bike is a beast.

 

[Polaris]

I think all in all, considering components, aesthetic, price YT and canyon are still among the best options. But I agree they are all getting very close with propain commencal and others

Canyon was easily thrown out for me when comparing spec v's value against the e-sommet. There was no competition, especially when you could easily get a discount on the vitus as well. I have milled over getting the Decoy only because it looks so bloody good but its not worth the cost of divorce

 

[steve_sordy]

I don‘t see the point of this discussion in the YT section of this forum. If you don‘t want a YT and don‘t own a YT thats fine, go on.

but are we now really at the aluminum is as good as carbon point? or the german culture issues? please...

lets talk about YT decoy bikes please. If you want to talk about something else there is the general and review section and a commencal thread is there too.

if I thought there is better bike at the moment I would have bought it. thank you.

I love my Decoy. why? because how it rides and handles not because of specs, looks, materials or because its german.

My belief was that this YT Decoy thread is not just for fanboys, but for people that are possible buyers of the Decoy and are looking for views from people that own them or have experience of YT's customer service. They want honest views, good as well as bad. Irrespective of the value for money, it's still a lot of money to shell out and people want to gather as much information as possible before taking the plunge.
I don't have a Decoy, but I did have a Capra until very recently. The bike was fantastic, but it was late in delivery and I had not one word from YT despite several appeals for information. I am very pleased to report that I never needed to test YT's customer service any further because the bike was faultless right up until the day I sold it.

 

[Marc]

My belief was that this YT Decoy thread is not just for fanboys, but for people that are possible buyers of the Decoy and are looking for views from people that own them or have experience of YT's customer service.

thats what everybody wants and that has nothing to do with the latest couple of posts.

its just exaggerated. two users (including myself) have had customer support - now everybody is telling it is bad and a reason not to buy the bike? that there is an issue with batteries? just because one user had an issue?

why is it that every reviewer of the decoy is stoked about it? But guys that never rode a decoy are telling people in here to better buy commencals, Vitus (a brand that is absolutely non existent outside GB)?

thats just unfair - and I reported my issues with the Decoy a few posts back, so I am no fanboy whatsoever. imo this thread should be about YT, not about alternatives. I want to read user experiences about YT, about the Decoy, about YT support - good or bad.

just to add another issue:

my SDG dropper is bad, its sticky at the top and just moves after a few trys. I tried to in- and decrease the cable tension but its still bad.

 

[Nasty Nick]

Fwiw I found the sdg dropper to be really nice. Mine has light lever action, fast smooth movement and soft top out. Maybe the cable on yours is pinched somewhere?

 

[Jedipip]

300 miles in to ownership. The dropper on the Pro is excellent. Better than a Reverb, light, fast, accurate.

I’ve managed to get an E43 code (battery or motor heat management) through pedalling hard, in heat, uphill, in boost, but only after perhaps 10 minutes of beasting it.

The cable grommets are OK but need TLC to keep in place. I’ve lost a twin cable oval one inside the frame/motor housing that looks like it’ll be fun to get back out.

It can run tyres down into single figure PSI and not dink rims.

The battery is much better than you think it will be.

It’s an animal. I love it and will defo recommend it.

YT after sales support has always been good. I’d quite like people who haven’t got one, or think there’s better bikes (there is, there will be, go fill your shed with them!) to get a Spesh or one of the new 2020 ‘Bosch’ bikes-they look awesome and you should get one, leave those of us crazy enough to trust YT in splendid rarity on the trails!

 

[mitch1808]

Told him Wilared said in Robs interview they chose Shimano because of the Shimano Service Centers ... no answer so far. Is Lifka the only service/support guy at YT!?

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Thanks for sharing pics of your beauty, anybody else want to ake us dream by sharing pics of theirs?