You may be right. My shock is probably not a big as your shock. I’m gonna stick to breaking eggs. ?
Would you be interested in Energy Harvesting on your E-Bike?
- Thread starter MunnsyBiker
- Start date
I think the gains we will see in range will come from more efficient motors / battery technology. But I think we are talking 5-10 years before any big breakthroughs in this tech.
Or even Graphene technology, if the price goes down.
You'd need to go one step up on what he basic physics are giving you.
Think heat exchangers.
Think Dyson fan thingy (actually a Toshiba invention from the 80's) Air based, but could you apply this to fluids to get say 15* more out of what's there ?
Ultimately, the amount of base energy recoverable is so small, it literally isn't worth it. You'd get more from a thermoelectric generator stuffed in the saddle.
Think heat exchangers.
Think Dyson fan thingy (actually a Toshiba invention from the 80's) Air based, but could you apply this to fluids to get say 15* more out of what's there ?
Ultimately, the amount of base energy recoverable is so small, it literally isn't worth it. You'd get more from a thermoelectric generator stuffed in the saddle.
He is wise, despite his youth and the appearance he may have starred in Zoolander.
Here's an article on the subject for interest - it may make an interesting thesis but in practical terms it's no more than a few pedal strokes.
" In a vehicle with a sprung mass of 2 t and an assumed average movement of only 5 mm/m" Sounds like the average ebiker ..
I’m discarding the perpetual-energy-machine idea and starting to analyze ancient drawings such as Plato.
At the moment with the available tech is a solution looking for a problem.
One of the problems for me in the industry is that with a lot of the new bikes EMTB's brands seem to be determined to add more and more crap to them, from electronic suspension, built in telemetry, ABS, bluetooth speakers probably too!
What we should be looking at is simplifying and streamlining.
There will come a time when it may be viable, but perhaps a better angle would be to see what could a dynamo hub do? Is their a possibility, most likely within the commuter market, for some sort of dynamo systems to recharge on the go?
One of the problems for me in the industry is that with a lot of the new bikes EMTB's brands seem to be determined to add more and more crap to them, from electronic suspension, built in telemetry, ABS, bluetooth speakers probably too!
What we should be looking at is simplifying and streamlining.
There will come a time when it may be viable, but perhaps a better angle would be to see what could a dynamo hub do? Is their a possibility, most likely within the commuter market, for some sort of dynamo systems to recharge on the go?
Finally we know why the sommet is so light ! You don't have bar tube tweeters and saddle sub woofer as standard ???? It's so common it's not even mentioned on most specs these days.
Every credit though, he was out riding at 8:30 am .. and he does always say he wants to simplify his cockpit ..
HYDROGEN
Hydrogen is a clean fuel that, when consumed in a fuel cell, produces only water. Hydrogen can be produced from a variety of domestic resources, such as natural gas, nuclear power, biomass, and renewable power like solar and wind. These qualities make it an attractive fuel option for transportation and electricity generation applications.
Several companies in the past have showcased their plans to use hydrogen fuel cell technology to power a bicycle. Recently, Chinese company Pearl Hydrogen became the latest company to showcase the idea, at a recent technology convention in Shanghaimart. The 20″ wheel prototype weighs 32kg and is powered by a PEM fuel cell and brushless electric motor.
this is the only problem i can see
Hydrogen is a clean fuel that, when consumed in a fuel cell, produces only water. Hydrogen can be produced from a variety of domestic resources, such as natural gas, nuclear power, biomass, and renewable power like solar and wind. These qualities make it an attractive fuel option for transportation and electricity generation applications.
Several companies in the past have showcased their plans to use hydrogen fuel cell technology to power a bicycle. Recently, Chinese company Pearl Hydrogen became the latest company to showcase the idea, at a recent technology convention in Shanghaimart. The 20″ wheel prototype weighs 32kg and is powered by a PEM fuel cell and brushless electric motor.
this is the only problem i can see
Believe me when I say, I have had very very very strong active regen braking on a 50kg E dirt bike that produced 40amps of energy on initial grab of regen (all recorded) which would then taper off as the bike slowed. The rear wheel would actively try and reverse. I needed very strong custom made steel torque arm bolts so the wheel would not tear/twist away from the horizontal dropout. The return in energy was feck all. Over a two hour ride, using over 28ah of battery it would return about 1ah into the pack.
As said earlier by Rob, the gains in energy, weight, efficiency are in development of the chemistry of the cells, and not in regen.
However, regen does not add any weight to a system, but is usually only attainable with direct drive hub motor, and not geared motors, so you are unlikely to see them in middrive emtb's.
As said earlier by Rob, the gains in energy, weight, efficiency are in development of the chemistry of the cells, and not in regen.
However, regen does not add any weight to a system, but is usually only attainable with direct drive hub motor, and not geared motors, so you are unlikely to see them in middrive emtb's.
You've removed the bell and replaced it with a bell icon ?
Apps are so much lighter nowadays. Very clever idea.
I'm more a pit early and go for a beer kinda guy ...
OK, so thinking about this over a beer, you can't just use either hydraulics or air as they are as you won't get enough from it in terms of WH. So you'd have to use the coanda effect or something to try and get more out of what you have to induce fluid induction. If you managed to invent something to do this at this scale, then I'm not sure if would fit in the fork/shock so would need a piggy back/or hydraulic/air hose to your coanda effect device. As this is all going to be tiny you'll need to get as much out of it as possible so you'll probably need to invoke some form of fluid entrainment to drag every WH you can out of it to overcome all your efficiency losses of making the system in the first place. Each bit you add, potentially removes the advantage of adding it as everything is so small, so friction losses and so on counteract anything you might gain.
Theoretically, you might get a 7-10* gain .. But then where do you put things and would you get those gains real world on such a small scale ? You'd also need clever valving so you gain on up and down strokes.
Not easy !
Theoretically, you might get a 7-10* gain .. But then where do you put things and would you get those gains real world on such a small scale ? You'd also need clever valving so you gain on up and down strokes.
Not easy !
steve_sordy
Wedding Crasher
It will probably be more energy efficient to reduce the weight of bike and rider!
I used to be able to do that calculation.
Edit: In fact unless the gizmos are light, there would be as much energy consumed in moving them about (along and up and down) as it would generate.
I used to be able to do that calculation.
Edit: In fact unless the gizmos are light, there would be as much energy consumed in moving them about (along and up and down) as it would generate.
Pdoz
E*POWAH Elite World Champion
Nah, the trick is to harvest the energy from emtb riders keyboards.
Every km of riding creates 500 wh of keyboard activity
Every km of riding creates 500 wh of keyboard activity
How much knowledge of mtb suspension fork and shock design and function do you presently have?
Would you agree that in order for shock and fork dampers to be used to give back a worthwhile amount of storable energy they'd need completely re-designed.
MTB suspension is fairly decent at present but there's always room for improvement but not so much for a reduce in performance
Beekeeper
🍯Honey Monster🍯
I believe rotors can become red hot when cycling downhill. How about cracking an egg on one and enjoying a tasty fried snack.
that’s my kind of energy regeneration ?
that’s my kind of energy regeneration ?
and what percentage of that 5w could you realistically trickle charge back into the battery while the bike is ridden? Say 50%?
Remember shocks only heat up a lot on longer descents. most of the riding time is still spent on relatively smooth climbs. and plenty riders choose to lock their shock out.
Emtb rides are rarely any longer than 2hours actual riding time so all that tech and cost and hastle would be for a measly 5wh (1%) extra battery range?
You do realise many Emtb riders give away between 50-100w to a normal XC bike on climbs simply because they've choosen to run the most agressive, soft compound, heavy strong casing tyres... often with inserts and usually at pretty low pressures?
wildsau2
Active member
another thread destroyed by our two forum queens.
Just seen this
You've gained less than 160metres for a fully drained battery ride if we are talking actual hilly mountainbiking routes. (3-4000ft of elevation)
If you're lucky it might be the difference between one more trip to the trail centre coffee shop from the car park
Do you actually ride mtb?
Er... No you haven't
You've gained less than 160metres for a fully drained battery ride if we are talking actual hilly mountainbiking routes. (3-4000ft of elevation)
If you're lucky it might be the difference between one more trip to the trail centre coffee shop from the car park
Do you actually ride mtb?
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and your valued input has been stellar?
?
Whilst I'm sure they appreciate the virtual promotion to royalty, I'm not sure that's anyway to talk politely about Rob or R120.
In what degree of centuries are we calling "Modern" ?Have you ridden a modern one?
things have moved on a little
I'll play safe with "no" ..
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