What happens when...

[Doug Stampfer]

Kia ora all. I can see an emtb in my future however would like some feedback. A few years ago I got rid of my motorcycles - both running ones & projects as with their ongoing maintenance & costs, they began to own me. Emtbs are relatively new & although I can't see the frame wheels & suspension changing much on them (they've got the mtb geometry, wheel sizes, suspension platforms etc pretty much nailed nowadays) it's the batteries & motors that make me twitch. There doesn't seem to me to be a generic battery style amongst all the brands.

I like the look of the Trek & Focus integrated batteries however what happens when they crap themselves? Is a battery life expected to last more than 3 years? If I'm throwing down some serious money on one I don't really want to find out that they have changed the shape & position of the batteries & my bike has become a parts orphan... I'm sure this topic has been raised before.

 

[Blackbird]

You basically have a few camps, some use model specific battery's such as Specialised and others use motor specific battery's such as Bosch and Yamaha.

Specialised for instance has (90% sure here) backwards compatability for models dating at least 5 years back in their turbo models.

Bosch just introduced a new style of battery, the intube model, but have no plans to replace the standard frame model since they leave it up to the bike manufacturer what model they want to use (or both at the same time). Also the older style of battery for models dating back to 2011 are still available.

Next up you can have battery's rebuilt, the battery in an ebike is usally just a collection of smaller battery's and they can be replaced by certain businesses or private persons.

tl, dr:
Battery's are used for a very long time, and they can be rebuilt.
If you go with a name brand it wont be a problem.

 

[R120]

The answer is there is no guarantee, and for sure the evolution of the ebike will continue apace over the next few years. The battery are and always will be a part that needs replacing over time - how often spends on how much you ride. Common consensus amongst most brands is that 1000 charge cycles is what you will get before the battery starts to become an issue, so depending on how much you ride you could get anywhere from 2 to 5 years out of one. However the reality is that the next big jump in ebikes is going to be battery sizes and capacity, with the most likely step being larger capacities out of same sized batteries, and it would be surprising if these were not retro compatible.

Now if you are hedging your bets, the bikes that use standard shimano/bosch batteries are probably the least likely to be affected by battery changes, as it is likely that any new batteries will be designed to work with existing systems. However those bikes which use more proprietary/custom batteries, are more likely to be the ones where it may not be possible to fit an improved product, thought still likely you can get a replacement product.

Built in batteries, whilst looking slick, are not actually the best solution for everyone. Take the Focus batteries, if you don't have the ability to charge the barttery where you keep the bike, then owning a Focus is going to be a PITA. I like to be able to easily take the battery out, and charge/store it indoors, so it isn't effected but the cold and other factors - that rules a Focus out for me.

 

[Japuserid]

In the past three years of owning and riding e-bikes, it has been my experience that the most common cause of intermittent fault / failure / poor running problems are, most often, simply the result of poor battery and or other related wiring connections. Either caused by water and dirt ingress or just oxidization of the connectors over time. So out of a group of 6 bikes that I have direct knowledge of, I would say that all of them have suffered from this at some point or other and to varying degrees.

This means that those who have a clip on or semi integrated type battery will find it a whole lot easier to clean their connections than those who have a fully integrated battery.

The other problem with integrated batteries is about storage and charging. If you don't have a heated garage in the winter months and you have to store your bike and your fully integrated battery in the cold, then your battery will suffer from degradation of the cells from the prolonged cold storage and will hold less charge than if it were charged at room temperature.

So IMHO clip on or semi integrated battery designs really will, over time, be a lot easier to live with.

 

[Doug Stampfer]

Thanks for your replies. I can see how one could get paralysis by analysis ?.
The other issue raised by a mate was water crossings/ wet tracks. Any issues so far with water getting in?

 

[Carlos Muralhas]

I took a long time deciding also because of this having had an eBike (for commuting) in the past that uninstalled due to battery dying and being a very proprietary system which cost an arm and a leg to get a new battery on a system with 4 years. I decided that was a no no.

Finally last month, after 2 years watching eMTbs grow I decided on Merida eOne-Sisty 900e because I love the looks of it but also because it’s a Shimano E8000 motor with an semi.integrated external shimano battery which I can easily now find online.

What I would love to have from shimano in 2019 are smaller lighter batteries with somewhat less capacity (375Wh as focus is doing) because most local rides use much less than 504wh. I want to buy a second battery but would prefer a lighter one. That external battery could also use it’s smaller size to have a way (maybe a rail system?) to put an water bottle on it or some space for tubes, tools, food... that would had functionality on eMTBs where there is no space for that with the current external batteries.

 

[Blackbird]

My haibike has a easily removed internal downtube battery with a rail system to attach a range extender for a second battery. Giving 1000wh total maximum. It does not save any weight though. I'm still waiting on my range extender because the supply is very limited at the moment.

 

[eFat]

The other issue raised by a mate was water crossings/ wet tracks. Any issues so far with water getting in?

Water crossing as with the motor under water may lead to issues. More mechanical (bearings) than electric I would think.

In the right conditions, something like this may happened: All new lighter, 'Brose Drive S Mag' motor announed
But there is clearly something wrong with the design of the housing of the motor here.

 

[OldBean]

Whilst I love my Focus Jam the BIG downside which I did not realise when I bought it is the non removability of the battery........winter storage and charging whilst away from home could be a problem....but looking at the pace of development in this area it wont be long before my bike with dream spec comes along.
Lighter,more power, more battery life,style,short cranks and nonderailler shift and of course removable batt.
Dream on
Have fun

 

[R120]

This is an interesting concept

Freeflow Electric Bike

 

[R120]

More Info

e-bike-transmission

 

[eFat]

This is an interesting concept
Freeflow Electric Bike

I like this spec!

Sensors Weight: seat post load cell