What bikes check all of these boxes?

[gbarfoot]

Friend is looking for bikes that fit these needs.....what is the list of bikes available in the US that fit the bill.

Reliable motor and other elec components
Good range-600w battery or more
Ability to add range with a bolt on extender
Ability to easily remove and swap main battery if needed
Ability to derestrict without huge worry of voiding warranty
Good value for specd components

It seems the list of bikes that fits this bill is small but interested to see what it is.
Thanks

 

[KeithR]

I suspect - given that derestriction is a de facto warranty-killer across the board (the best you can hope for is that they don't notice - but the motor manufacturers have put a lot of effort into being able to identify derestriction "hacks") - that no such bike exists.

 

[gbarfoot]

Yeah from what I can tell the new ep8 is the most aggressive in trying to track it.....I guess what I'm describing is using a planet 3 mechanical device (which reduces mileage count) or a plug in unit that isn't recorded by the software. Things that are less likely detectable.....some scenarios like the ep8 seem like a no go as they are actively trying to trace such an action.

 

[gbarfoot]

Yeah from what I can tell the new ep8 is the most aggressive in trying to track it.....I guess what I'm describing is using a planet 3 mechanical device (which reduces mileage count) or a plug in unit that isn't recorded by the software. Things that are less likely detectable and could potentially go unnoticed or looked past depending on the situation...obviously if you play the game you need to be ok with the consequences.....some scenarios like the ep8 seem like a no go as they are actively trying to trace such an action.

 

[KeithR]

Things that are less likely detectable

I'm not so sure - it would be really easy to use the GPS chip in the motor to track actual speed, and if the speed didn't match the what was recorded from the magnet and sensor, it's a red flag: if the on-bike sensor shows you're doing 15 and the GPS shows 25, something's not right.

The bottom line is this: however you choose to derestrict your bike, you're risking the warranty. An earlier-gen bike/motor is more likely to lack the latest detection algorithms, and it'll probably be out of warranty too - that's how I would go.

But then you're unlikely to get the big battery, and I don't know of any older bikes that are extender-compatible...

 

[Steve G H]

Whilst I see why a manufacturer would want to monitor its motors for cheat devices that would put additional strain on them I can't understand why a small increase to 20mph would bother them . That is after all the speed limit in the States and I'm not aware it reduces any standard warranty. Its almost like they are policing the regulations, could you imagine a car manufacturer doing that ?! National speed limit is 70 mph therefore your car won't go any faster . I guess its a complicated matter with various opinions and repercussions in law because tuning is never that simple and wouldn't be limited to just 20mph , but would be nice to have the option .

 

[Zimmerframe]

MIG-S - E-Bike All Mountain - E-Mtb by Ducati

The agile, high-performance and fun All Mountain, designed to tackle any trail and ensure maximum fun in all conditions. For 2022, the E-Mtb is renewed in its aesthetics with an unprecedented sporty livery designed by Aldo Drudi and takes a further evolutionary step.

www.ducati.com

I think is as close as you can get to your list.

E8000 motor is easy to de-restrict to 32kph. So usable, but not stupid !??! (though everyone will have their opinion, I'm just trying to answer your question).

Reliable ?!? Depends .... it's an e-bike and we're still in the early days ... so it's all relative.

You can't add batteries, but it's external so you can swap batteries.

Good value and IMO looks cool.

 

[ThierryGTLTS]

I ignore it's a 29” front and 27,5” rear, not so common.

Thierry

 

[gbarfoot]

I will add orbea wild and giant trance x to this list just to keep this on topic....possibly the Rocky Mountains too

 

[KeithR]

Whilst I see why a manufacturer would want to monitor its motors for cheat devices that would put additional strain on them I can't understand why a small increase to 20mph would bother them

The law has obliged them to get excessively involved in this stuff: I agree with you that they have no obvious vested interest in cramping our style, but legally they have to be seen to be putting a stop to it, to the best of their abilities.

It's actually about what they need to do in order to sell ebikes as "bicycles+" - if they're seen to ignore loopholes that would allow users to exceed the cut-off - thereby arguably taking the bike into speed pedelec territory - they risk losing their ability to sell ebikes without extra legal conditions like registration, licenses, tax etc. being attached.

 

[R120]

Orbea, Scott, Haibike and Simplon all make bikes with the Bosch Gen 4, 625wh removable batteries, and range extenders that take battery total up to over 900wh +

Mondraker and Norco make bikes with the Shimano System, and range extenders, but batteries are non removable

Rockymopuntain for left field choice, with extender you can get 1000wh, however main battery not removable.

Specilized Levo, you can get Trailwatts range extender batteries and take range up to 900wh+, battery easily removable.

Plenty of choice out there.

 

[Hamina]

Whilst I see why a manufacturer would want to monitor its motors for cheat devices that would put additional strain on them I can't understand why a small increase to 20mph would bother them .

From the motor point of view riding assisted over 25kmh makes none additional stress to it.

 

[KeithR]

I will add orbea rise

Nobody has any idea whether the Shimano EP8 (especially a "tweaked" one like the one in the Rise) is realistically capable of any kind of derestriction - it's too new.

 

[KeithR]

Plenty of choice out there.

None that confidently satisfy this criterion though:

Ability to derestrict without huge worry of voiding warranty

Accept that the warranty is at risk anyway, and the options increase exponentially - but if this is a deal-breaker, the OP's buddy is fishing a shallow pond...

 

[gbarfoot]

Meant orbea wild. Sorry.

 

[gbarfoot]

For deristrict it's more a question of which ones are least likely to be an obvious warranty killer....don't get too hung up on that....ep8 is likely out, yamaha seems pretty easy and not as likely to throw red flags. That's all.

He just wants to be able to up the cutoff limit so the motor continues close to where the gearing ends....that's it

 

[R120]

None that confidently satisfy this criterion though:


Accept that the warranty is at risk anyway, and the options increase exponentially - but if this is a deal-breaker, the OP's buddy is fishing a shallow pond...

Orbea, Haibike, Scott and Simplon do - all have good value build versions available of various models, removable big batteries, extender capability, and can be derestricted (though obviously the associated risks of doing so are down to the owner)

 

[routrax]

For deristrict it's more a question of which ones are least likely to be an obvious warranty killer....don't get too hung up on that....ep8 is likely out, yamaha seems pretty easy and not as likely to throw red flags. That's all.

He just wants to be able to up the cutoff limit so the motor continues close to where the gearing ends....that's it

I reckon it'll be a warranty killer for every manufacturer if it needs to back for work. Maybe buy used and no warranty, no problem...

 

[maynard]

2nd hand merida e160

 

[Elover]

I had a mark 3 bosch motor get noisy just under two years and took to a local bosch dealer, checked it over and sent back for warranty... A few months later, my mate had the same and took his there... They rang him following day and said come and pick it up, we are not touching it as it has been tampered with... Both our bikes ran the badd ass speed box... Some how his showed up amd mine didnt... You take your chances i guess ?

 

[Elover]

Would add one thing... The actual work that was needed on my bike being the bearings is about £100 for a shop to do... Bosch just decided rather than do this, that they would replace the complete motor. I love my bike de restricted as the Mark 3 is soooo draggy over 15mph, that I can ride my manual hardtail faster on alot of the flats and decents in my local area on dry trails. What ever bike I get in the future, im sure I will probably de restrict as I think it just releases the bikes true qualitys. And I think Bosch and Shimano are generally pretty reliable, obviously you get all the bad stories on forums, but I guess there are thousands upon thousands of happy customers out there.

 

[gbarfoot]

That drag is exactly the reason to consider a derestrict. I hear the Ep8 has very little drag above cutoff so maybe in that scenario it's less of a concern

 

[geehaw]

Me

2nd hand merida e160

Merida doesn't sell bikes in USA so pretty impossible to find.