Walk Assist - so random

[robguide]

My partner has an MTB guiding/coaching business. She took 7 folk up Cader Idris last weekend. 4 folk had issues with Walk Assist/Mode. Either not working at all or random . A variety of bikes and systems. Some of it appears to be electronic but it’s also difficult to hold the button on steep, rocky terrain- or mountains as we call them!
We’d be interested to hear about other people’s experience

 

[The EMF]

My partner has an MTB guiding/coaching business. She took 7 folk up Cader Idris last weekend. 4 folk had issues with Walk Assist/Mode. Either not working at all or random . A variety of bikes and systems. Some of it appears to be electronic but it’s also difficult to hold the button on steep, rocky terrain- or mountains as we call them!
We’d be interested to hear about other people’s experience

 

[The EMF]

Totally agree. I have small hands for a bloke and I find the walk mode on my Whyte is very iffy. Don’t get much relief on steep loose pushes……Or maybe it’s just me

 

[Stihldog]

Regular “walk-mode” users here.
I climb trails and I’m occasionally faced with a rock drop that I cannot climb. I usually choose a go-around route but that can lead to bad terrain.

Walk-mode is helpful but I still need to push the heavy bike while the rear tire spins for traction. Before the update, this mode would immediately start at 6km per hour. Felt like a rocket.

Since the update, walk-mode starts at 4km per hour and progresses to 6km per hour in about 5 seconds. I also activate the “go” button when needed during this event.

The walk-mode depletes in about 15-20 seconds when the button is not depressed. It takes a bit of coordination but I think I got it figured out now.

The walk-mode is on the Fuel EXE also but I find I don’t need it as much (lighter bike).

The controls on the Fuel EXE are not as nice as the Kiox controller.

 

[B1rdie]

I can say that shimano activated with shifter works very well while bosch, activated with push button, is worthless.

 

[The EMF]

Regular “walk-mode” users here.
I climb trails and I’m occasionally faced with a rock drop that I cannot climb. I usually choose a go-around route but that can lead to bad terrain.

Walk-mode is helpful but I still need to push the heavy bike while the rear tire spins for traction. Before the update, this mode would immediately start at 6km per hour. Felt like a rocket.

Since the update, walk-mode starts at 4km per hour and progresses to 6km per hour in about 5 seconds. I also activate the “go” button when needed during this event.

The walk-mode depletes in about 15-20 seconds when the button is not depressed. It takes a bit of coordination but I think I got it figured out now.

The walk-mode is on the Fuel EXE also but I find I don’t need it as much (lighter bike).

The controls on the Fuel EXE are not as nice as the Kiox controller.

I’m still using the “state of the Ark” Purion and it’s a bit clumsy

 

[Stihldog]

I can say that shimano activated with shifter works very well while bosch, activated with push button, is worthless.

There’s definitely room for improvement on the Bosch control but I generally use the walk-mode for less than a minute for each ride. It’s nice to have when you need it though.

 

[RustyIron]

She took 7 folk up Cader Idris last weekend. 4 folk had issues with Walk Assist/Mode. Either not working at all or random . A variety of bikes and systems. Some of it appears to be electronic but it’s also difficult to hold the button on steep, rocky terrain

Yes, I completely agree: Using Walk Mode is difficult on terrain that is so steep and rocky that I can't ride it.

While I don't know your wife's clients, I've seen some people who have never used Walk Mode until they're teetering on a chunky rock face. "Uh... which button do you push again? Do you have to hold it in? The top button or bottom?" Apparently their daily lives are too busy or they are just uninterested in figuring it out in their front yard, like everyone else. In my opinion, it's best to figure out your gear before you really need it.

I've run both Shimano and Bosch systems. Their felt power characteristics are dependent on the gear the bike is in as well as movement of the bike. I've found the Shimano to need more bike movement to maintain power. The amount of power is sometimes less than I want. The Bosch system provides more power, especially at slow or stalled speeds. Sometimes it's hard to control and is sufficient to lift the front wheel.

 

[arTNC]

There's a lengthy thread somewhere on here about issues with the Bosch Walk mode, but I don't see it now. My Gen II Trek Rail with Purion display seems to perform in walk mode flawlessly. Remember, if you didn't already know, that walk mode performs differently depending on what gear you're in. Being in lower gear results in quite a slow walk speed/power. Higher gear results in a stronger walk power.

If it's steep and hard, I tend to use 4th or 5th rear cog. My walk mode will almost pull me up the climb in some cases which for me really helps when you're trying to step over rocks and such. I like a strong walk mode with a little speed. My "dumb generation" Purion display seems to provide a walk mode that lets you go as slow as you want or as aggressive as you want. That's been my experience at least.

But this site is full of complaints about the Bosch walk mode for some reason, so maybe it's down to what display/software system your bike has. Many of the complaints seem to have come after a software update too.

 

[B1rdie]

There’s definitely room for improvement on the Bosch control but I generally use the walk-mode for less than a minute for each ride. It’s nice to have when you need it though.

Problem is that when you really need the walk mode, bosch push button does not work.
Two situations:
On very rough rocky and loamy ground, after fording rivers and needing to climb short cliffs where I needed to watch each step carefully, keeping the finger placed on top of a sensitive push button with the right amount of pressure is impossible.
At the end of a long ride, having to push the bike to the top of a long, steep climb, my numb fingers could never find the right amount of push to have the assistance steady enough to keep the bike moving stead.
With the shimano, the lever of the shifter is easily accessible and keeping it activated does not demand any attention, allowing me to even wheelie the bike and use the rear brake to drive the rear wheel through rocks and step ups. On steep climbs, without enough battery to ride the bike, I can actuate the lever while leaning the chest on the saddle and drag me uphill.

 

[Stihldog]

Problem is that when you really need the walk mode, bosch push button does not work.

Hmmm …I never found that the buttons were difficult to access during walk-mode, but I have the old Kiox controller mounted on the Trek Rail. On my Fuel EXE (newish) the walk-mode is a bit more difficult …but the bike is light enough that I don’t use walk-mode that much (rarely).

I’m puzzled by the torque or speed while in walk-mode though. Your explanation kinda makes sense but I never noticed or sensed that on the Rail. When the go-button is first held the bike moves at about 4km per hour …then increases to 6km per hour after the go-button is depressed for about 5 seconds. After the go-button is released the walk-mode slowly depletes itself unless you immediately reset that and go back to eMTB mode.

The rear wheel can spin-out though until it finds grip again. I feather the go-button depending on the terrain or steepness. (Takes a bit of practice).

I’m not too fussed about the position of the controller because I only use it once or twice at the beginning of a ride. Usually in eMTB mode 98% of the time.

 

[arTNC]

Stihldog, the walk mode speed/effort is quite dependent on what gear you're in.

I'm with you on the ease of use of the button, even with the primitive Purion. When I'm having to use it at our off club at Texana Ranch, it's usually in rocky terrain that is hard to walk in under normal conditions without the bike. While some other design could definitely be easier, the simple push button doesn't seem that onerous to me.

B1rdie, on the fatigue of the finger on an extended push-to-walk requirement, I just change fingers...or thumb. That's not meant to be "smart alecky", it's just what I do. These bikes are heavy when trying to be pushed uphill manually. I love the walk feature when you've ended up in that stall, or terrain just too loose to power up on the bike. I love it.

 

[steve_sordy]

Once I worked out that the speed in Walk mode depended upon what gear I was in, I have had no further problems with Shimano Walk mode (e8000 or EP8). The biggest problem is an expected one, that of wheel spin. I just lean on the saddle.
I frequently find that the bike tows me up the hill.

One thing I have always been meaning to try is to be sat on the bike when I engage Walk mode. Just never got around to it. Who out there has done it?

 

[arTNC]

Steve, that's an interesting thought about sitting on the bike in walk mode. Now there's where I would expect the motor to be programmed to detect the more extreme effort being required, and it would kick out of power...speculation. If it didn't it would be like a kind of throttle, and I'd think that would infuriate the authorities who regulate such things.

I'm tempted right now to go out in the shop, drag out my Rail 7, and sit on the bike and see. I'm almost a little fearful that it might put out an error code or such, and I'd have to go down to the shop and get a reprogram...or worse, cause some kind of failure. I think I'll wait and see if someone else has tried this or knows the official result. Interesting thought, though.

I recently came off of a 2003 SC Bullit with a Bafang BBSHD mid-drive, and of course it would take off like a scalded dog with an actual throttle...but...the Bosch is a totally different animal. As an aside, at first when I built that Bullit, I tried riding an actual trail on the throttle just for grins. Even coming from a long background of riding very fast dirt motorcycles, it was nearly uncontrollable on throttle...at least if there were turns and trees...LOL! The BBSHD is very programmable for power and speed, but the throttle portion was not as controllable as the regular pedal cadence modes.

 

[2WheelsNot4]

or mountains as we call them

Are you sure thats not a hill ?

 

[arTNC]

Are you sure thats not a hill ?

But it's a big hill...and steep...and loose...and with rattlesnakes...and cactus...and heat...and...well, you get it.

 

[Gauss Guzzler]

I have some experience with Bosch Smart CX and Specialized 2.0E.

Specialized has a nice rubber button and, intuitively, the + button triggers walk mode. The walk speed can be adjusted somewhat by changing gears, but the max torque is very low and the button needs to be held very firmly or else you have to start all over again with the damn timeout. It's really bad.

Bosch has a painful plastic button and, ergonomically, it's the - button for walk mode. The walk speed is the same in any gear but is adjustable by the dealer (hopefully someday within the app!). When my thumb - or legs - get tired, letting off the button puts the bike in hill-hold mode for 10 seconds where it cannot roll backward - only forward, and power resumes immediately when I re-press the button. This is perfect for taking turns over big boulders where sometimes I'm helping the bike up, and sometimes it's helping me. It is strong enough to ride uphill in low gear, and I have found myself in rare situations where riding was preferred over dismounting, but it's so slow that "riding" is almost always more difficult than walking alongside.

 

[RebornRider]

I'll jump into this to say that walk mode on my gen 2 Turbo Levo always works as expected. It engages a second or 2 after pressing the dedicated walk mode button on the handlebar remote, and stays engaged until I release the button. Assuming I'm in a climbing gear (biggest or second biggest cog), the assistance is at an appropriate speed for me to walk up the hill next to the bike. The motor provides enough torque to help me climb the hill.

There was some walk mode drama in the Spesh forum a few years back, but I've never had any problems with using it. Maybe I never installed the 'bad' firmware.

 

[2WheelsNot4]

But it's a big hill...and steep...and loose...and with rattlesnakes...and cactus...and heat...and...well, you get it.

Ahh but unfortunately you didnt. Its a Welsh joke bit obscure i admit.

The Englishman Who Went up a Hill but Came down a Mountain - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Base]

I had to reverse the up/down buttons so the walk assist button was on the bottom and not the top which was making it hard to use while holding down. The app didnt allow for the bottom button to be used as the button to hold down which is dumb to say the least.

 

[sethimus]

to have it engage nearly instantly: press walk button, move bike backwards. works with most brands way better than trying to move it forward, especially if you have not much room on a trail.

 

[RustyIron]

to have it engage nearly instantly: press walk button, move bike backwards. works with most brands way better than trying to move it forward, especially if you have not much room on a trail.

Whaaaaat? I need to give this a try. By the time I resort to Walk Assist, I've already moved the bike as far forward as humanly possible. Getting it moving again requires a heroic effort. If I can just let it roll back a hair, that might make my life MUCH easier. Thanks for the tip.

 

[Hattori-Hanzo]

With the Bosch smart system you can also tilt the bike over to engage walk assist. I've found tilting or rolling back much more effective at starting walk mode than trying to push forward.

 

[steve_sordy]

On Shimano, I just press Walk twice, once to select and again to engage.

 

[Natch]

Fazua Ride 60 on a Transition Relay. My walk mode only works when it wants to.

 

[Suns_PSD]

I gave up on the F60 walk mode as it never worked enough for me to notice it working.

 

[Amber Valley Guy]

Shimano EP8 walk mode is pants on mine, about 2.5mph...your on a steep gnarly climb beyond your experience and engage walk mode, the front wheel drops over a stone, bolder, into a gully whatever, the bikes momenteraly accelerated and kills the walk assist with the rear wheel stuck on said obstacle without any aid. Bloody useless, pushing is harder but less annoying!