The loser of the test: Trek Rail 9.9.

[JP-NZ]

The treks over here are bloody expensive. I paid $7k NZ for my 2020 Rail 7 with another couple of grand in upgrades. (38 forks weren't fitted on stock bikes then so you had to settle of a 36 fork). I see today the 5 with crap components are $8500NZ & the 7 is $10K. In comparison the E160 is $8200NZ.

Yes they have increased in price over here in NZ but I think you have to have some context. Our prices are actually some of the cheapest between NZ/Aus the UK and the USA.

For instance
Rail 9.8 = £8900 or NZD $17,281 RRP is $12,999
Rail 9 = £6600 or NZD $12.851 RRP is $11,499
Rail 7 = £5800 or NZD $11,261 RRP is $9,999

Emtb prices will only increase due to popularity and increased parts and production costs. It’s always cheaper to buy the higher spec bike to start too.

Im not going to comment on a Trek v Merida comparison. It’s apples and oranges brand wise.

 

[JP-NZ]

Thank you guys, your opinion is really helpful! I asked my Trek dealer and they don't have demo bikes, said that it was before but now people buy all bikes in advance so no sense to keep demo ones

Yes, most dealers won’t bother with more than possibly 1-2 demo bikes. My LBS has 44 Trek Rails on order and every single one was sold over 5 months ago. LBS owner said if Trek could supply more he would have tripled his order.

Very limited amounts make it all the way down here and he’s just happy he’s getting some. He also sells Santa Cruz, Scott, Focus and Rocky Mountain. The stock supply is limited across the board.

 

[Growmac]

@Doug Stampfer @Growmac hey guys, what do you think which bike, Merida Eone-sixty or the new long Trek Rail(490 reach) better suits this type of trails? Looking at new Trek, but afraid to lose the playfulness of Merida, whereas sometimes feel a lack of stability.

Wow, those look like great trails. Hard to say which to recommend. If I was going for a '22 Rail I think I might have to drop a size. The reach on the '20 e160 and the '21 Rail is about perfect for me, I don't think I would want to go 30 mm longer.

The Merida is more fun on the downs, but I am now pretty certain it's also slower. I've not noticed any lack of stability in either bike, but then I suspect that's strongly influenced by sizing. In terms of manoeuvrability on tight, steep stuff, the Merida is better than the Rail, which in turn is better than my '20 Specialised Enduro.

We did a big 47 km loop last night: 900 m of climbing and 23.5 km/h average, 99% of the ride in Tour but pushing hard all the way round. I got home with 21% battery, whereas I've often had to climb the last hill unassisted on the e160, so the Bosch range definitely seems better.

I've just switched to the Rail, so obviously I'm biased, but I'm going to sell the Merida with a completely clear conscience - it's a great bike, really fun to ride, and with a brand new fork, motor and (hopefully) battery the new owner should have a lot of fun. I think you'd enjoy either bike, just watch the sizes as the new Rail is -really- long.

 

[urastus]

Emtb prices will only increase due to popularity

I don't think so. Prices will increase because that is what happens over time. We're paying substantially more now simply because of covid. Demand for bikes and ebikes went through the roof. This coupled with supply chain issues, the huge cost of fuel (putin's war) and a general industrial slow down, again due to covid means there is no reason for business to be as competitive as what is was. It has meant price increases on pretty much everything that relies on transport.

Things should return to something like what they were before. Growing popularity for e bikes will mean greater numbers of ebikes and more manufacturers getting in the market - this has been happening. That's when scale of economy kicks in. Of course we can't predict wild cards like covid or putin. There will come a time when stock will be sitting on the floor and the lbs will have demo bikes as sales slow down and business has to compete for our dollar.

 

[1oldfart]

Lookig at prices here in Quebec Canada
Giant Etrance start at 6,000$
Rocky Mountain Instinct start at almost 7,000$
i think one of the worst is Specialized at 8,300$
and the Trek Rail is 7,550$
and sales taxes add 15%.
If i cannot have fun on a Giant i will simply stop riding, find some other
fun thing and just buy a 300$ used bike to go do my grocery.

 

[Doug Stampfer]

If i cannot have fun on a Giant i will simply stop riding, find some other
fun thing and just buy a 300$ used bike to go do my grocery.

Yes Giant is my usual default due to bang for buck & that's what I forgot to suggest to torabora851. The other bike I'd be keen on is the new Reign. I reckon it'll be a contender for BOTY & great specs for the price

 

[JP-NZ]

Lookig at prices here in Quebec Canada
Giant Etrance start at 6,000$
Rocky Mountain Instinct start at almost 7,000$
i think one of the worst is Specialized at 8,300$
and the Trek Rail is 7,550$
and sales taxes add 15%.
If i cannot have fun on a Giant i will simply stop riding, find some other
fun thing and just buy a 300$ used bike to go do my grocery.

Same here in New Zealand, spec for spec the Specialized is always around $1500 to $2000 NZD more. Its just not worth it, plus the local Spec dealer here are tools.

 

[irie]

I'm 1.78m/5'10, 80kg on a 2022 Rail 5* (L).

Downhill it's not as "lively" as my Fuel EX (ML) was but definitely quicker. The downside is that you mess up your lines it's harder to get them back again. But uphill, well I'm an old geezer and the electric legs save so much time getting to the top for the next run down.

Edit: the point is that I would not want to go longer than my 2022 Rail 5 (L). So since a 2022 9.8 is longer I'd probably go a size smaller.'

* upgraded forks, shock, brakes, wheels, tyres, bar, stem, saddle, shifter ...

 

[torabora851]

Yes Giant is my usual default due to bang for buck & that's what I forgot to suggest to torabora851. The other bike I'd be keen on is the new Reign. I reckon it'll be a contender for BOTY & great specs for the price

Yeah I considered giant reign, but it's out of stock in Australia:
The dealer's reply:
"Unfortunately we have been informed that there are no more Reign e+1 or E+0 coming for the rest of the season!
There are electronic and battery shortages still on account of COVID
There is no news yet as to when we can expect 2023 models."

 

[JP-NZ]

Yeah I considered giant reign, but it's out of stock in Australia:
The dealer's reply:
"Unfortunately we have been informed that there are no more Reign e+1 or E+0 coming for the rest of the season!
There are electronic and battery shortages still on account of COVID
There is no news yet as to when we can expect 2023 models."

Thats exactly the reply I got here in NZ. I got in touch with all 9 Giant dealers/chain stores etc in New Zealand. I really wanted a Reign E+1 but was told Giant wasn't bringing anymore 22 models to Australasia and to wait for the 23 models which may be out by March/April 2023.

I told them in no uncertain terms I'm not waiting over 12 months for a new bike! Then I ordered the Rail that will be here in 5 months

 

[torabora851]

Wow, those look like great trails. Hard to say which to recommend. If I was going for a '22 Rail I think I might have to drop a size. The reach on the '20 e160 and the '21 Rail is about perfect for me, I don't think I would want to go 30 mm longer.

The Merida is more fun on the downs, but I am now pretty certain it's also slower. I've not noticed any lack of stability in either bike, but then I suspect that's strongly influenced by sizing. In terms of manoeuvrability on tight, steep stuff, the Merida is better than the Rail, which in turn is better than my '20 Specialised Enduro.

We did a big 47 km loop last night: 900 m of climbing and 23.5 km/h average, 99% of the ride in Tour but pushing hard all the way round. I got home with 21% battery, whereas I've often had to climb the last hill unassisted on the e160, so the Bosch range definitely seems better.

I've just switched to the Rail, so obviously I'm biased, but I'm going to sell the Merida with a completely clear conscience - it's a great bike, really fun to ride, and with a brand new fork, motor and (hopefully) battery the new owner should have a lot of fun. I think you'd enjoy either bike, just watch the sizes as the new Rail is -really- long.

Thank you! Why brand new motor? Have you replaced it?

 

[1oldfart]

Thats exactly the reply I got here in NZ. I got in touch with all 9 Giant dealers/chain stores etc in New Zealand. I really wanted a Reign E+1 but was told Giant wasn't bringing anymore 22 models to Australasia and to wait for the 23 models which may be out by March/April 2023.

I told them in no uncertain terms I'm not waiting over 12 months for a new bike! Then I ordered the Rail that will be here in 5 months

Hopefully you will appreciate your new Ebike. My shop sells Giant but they cannot choose wich Ebike they order.
On the other side they also sell Trek and they sell so many Trek Ebikes that they can call the shots.
Sometimes our options are limited and sometimes the shop options are also limited.
I am thinking of pre ordering a 2023 in september. I know my size so testing is less important.

 

[urastus]

A bike that looks really interesting to me is the marin alpine trail e2. It just looks a bit long (wb) for tighter stuff. Very slack ha, very steep sta, long reach but those who have it say it isn't a big bike to ride (some have gone larger). Only one dealer here in Aus (bicycles online) and none in stock. Some of that descending on your first link still looked pretty tight in places though.

Re the instability you feel on your merida sometimes; I have felt that a couple of times, but only as I started getting over the front at certain times. I assumed that I'm still getting the hang of body language with the bike - those times I might be too far forward.

 

[Growmac]

Thank you! Why brand new motor? Have you replaced it?

Hi, yeah, the motor was playing up since about 4,000 km. Madison eventually replaced it after I persisted in complaining.

 

[BiGJZ74]

Rob, how do you adjust the battery on the rail? You have mentioned that it is very easy. Is it the two screws at the bottom of the battery compartment closest to the motor? Would be great if you detailed that. Much appreciated.

There is a sticky thread on battery alignment on the top of the Trek page.

 

[Wilm]

Thanks @Growmac I'm 179cm and buying the 2022 Rail 9.8 in Medium. Reach on Medium is 456mm, Large is 491mm. The 2022 smart system models had a large increase in reach to accomodate the 750 battery.

awesome - this is what I came looking for - 178cm with short legs, Medium it is. Now to find out of the LBS will take qmastercard, if yes It's going to be hard to not buy the 9.8XT over the 7

 

[Ebike3rr]

awesome - this is what I came looking for - 178cm with short legs, Medium it is. Now to find out of the LBS will take qmastercard, if yes It's going to be hard to not buy the 9.8XT over the 7

I’m selling my 22 medium xt if your in north Cali.

 

[JP-NZ]

awesome - this is what I came looking for - 178cm with short legs, Medium it is. Now to find out of the LBS will take qmastercard, if yes It's going to be hard to not buy the 9.8XT over the 7

Yep, you can always increase reach with seat position/stem length but very hard to go smaller from 490ish.

I see your in NZ, good luck with the LBS. I got the very last one on order at my LBS back in February, but I see EVO and possibly T7 have pre orders now open for stock due to arrive in July. The 9.8XT is a very easy choice for me over the 7.

Smart system, 750wh battery, better brakes, better gearing, bettter fork, better shock, Carbon v Alloy are just a few and for the $3,000 higher RRP you couldn't change half those items for $3000.

 

[Wilm]

Yep, you can always increase reach with seat position/stem length but very hard to go smaller from 490ish.

I see your in NZ, good luck with the LBS. I got the very last one on order at my LBS back in February, but I see EVO and possibly T7 have pre orders now open for stock due to arrive in July. The 9.8XT is a very easy choice for me over the 7.

Smart system, 750wh battery, better brakes, better gearing, bettter fork, better shock, Carbon v Alloy are just a few and for the $3,000 higher RRP you couldn't change half those items for $3000.

Agreed - I've got a big Enduro bike but feel the need for something shorter and more lively for tighter trails than that big bus

I did the maths on copper/shock/fork and the 9.8 is a no-brainer plus you get the newer Smart System and a much bigger battery.

Out of interest why are you favouring carbon over alloy?

 

[JP-NZ]

Out of interest why are you favouring carbon over alloy?

Yea, I just sold my Enduro rig in preparation for the Rail arriving. My last 3 bikes (plus 1 current) were Carbon and I like the stiffness and directness over alloy. You don't really have the option with Trek as there is no Alloy above the 9. Trek also have lifetime frame warranty and some of the best support in the business.

 

[Wilm]

Understood. I’d have been happy with an alloy 9XT but alas not here.

Deposit paid.

 

[JP-NZ]

Understood. I’d have been happy with an alloy 9XT but alas not here.

Deposit paid.

What part of NZ are you in? Do you have a delivery date from the LBS?

Mine has said 1st or 2nd week of July

 

[Wilm]

What part of NZ are you in? Do you have a delivery date from the LBS?

Mine has said 1st or 2nd week of July

Wellington. I’m being told mid July. Another local shop quoted me September 2023. Yup, 2023. No typo.

 

[JP-NZ]

Loamwolf have their 2022 review video up on the 9.9AXS


Most of the negativity stems from the large jump in reach between sizes and the newer geo. No mention at all of battery issues or rattles. They loved the climbing ability of the Rail.

I too was stuck in the M/L range but went smaller and ordered a Medium, I can always fit a longer stem and adjust the seat but my last Enduro bike was 455 reach so I should be fine.

 

[torabora851]

Loamwolf have their 2022 review video up on the 9.9AXS


Most of the negativity stems from the large jump in reach between sizes and the newer geo. No mention at all of battery issues or rattles. They loved the climbing ability of the Rail.

I too was stuck in the M/L range but went smaller and ordered a Medium, I can always fit a longer stem and adjust the seat but my last Enduro bike was 455 reach so I should be fine.

Yeah, interesting that Rob 6''2' also thinks that it's too long. Wondering if 30mm stem would help. I mean Rob from Loam Wolf Not Rob rides ebikes

 

[Oupy]

Hard to really know what to read into these reviews. I think the wheelbase and length commentary is likely riding a mullet/vs non mullet back to back as the actual numbers are quite minor. I think they are right about the sizing though and its going to work great for some and not great for others. I guess that is the problem riding a single size bike in a group test setting with lots of different height riders - particularly being on the smaller side trying to wield a wrong size long/heavy ebike around would not give the greatest impression.

Isn't the shock the same as last year's bike? Not sure why opinion would change in that area and likely comes back to the sizing issue for that particular rider and the weight bias front/back being off. The taller feller Rob seemed to actually really like the bike but its always splitting hairs in these tests anyway.

Levo review is up and seemed to be a big hit with them and seems like a nice ride. Pricing for Specialized in Australia is very far out of whack though so you get a lot less spec for your dough if looking at as comparable price point and i'm not convinced on the reliability.

 

[Jhagst]

I had a ‘21 and a ‘22 9.8 XT Rail. There is quite a difference between the two years. I spent big $$ getting the suspension and fit right for me, however it was still just OK. I never really felt super comfortable. I have since got rid of the ‘22 Rail. I had some substantial quality control warranty issues which Trek stood behind.
I bought a ‘22 Norco Range VLT C1 with a big 900 battery, I couldn’t be happier. The Norco Chassis fits my riding style much better. The Shimano EP8 is considerably weaker than the Bosch motor. I still have a 2020 Rail 7 which my son rides… he absolutely leaves me in the dust on long climbs now that I’m on a EP8 motor. We used to be pretty evenly matched.

 

[torabora851]

I had a ‘21 and a ‘22 9.8 XT Rail. There is quite a difference between the two years. I spent big $$ getting the suspension and fit right for me, however it was still just OK. I never really felt super comfortable. I have since got rid of the ‘22 Rail. I had some substantial quality control warranty issues which Trek stood behind.
I bought a ‘22 Norco Range VLT C1 with a big 900 battery, I couldn’t be happier. The Norco Chassis fits my riding style much better. The Shimano EP8 is considerably weaker than the Bosch motor. I still have a 2020 Rail 7 which my son rides… he absolutely leaves me in the dust on long climbs now that I’m on a EP8 motor. We used to be pretty evenly matched.

Great experience, Were them both Large? Norco Range has 170mm travel vs 150mm Trail, no wonder it feels much more comfortable.

 

[JP-NZ]

Levo review is up and seemed to be a big hit with them and seems like a nice ride. Pricing for Specialized in Australia is very far out of whack though so you get a lot less spec for your dough if looking at as comparable price point and i'm not convinced on the reliability.

Agree 100% the comparable Levo is $2,500 more expensive here and I’d still rather have the Trek. I’m not entirely convinced on reliability either.

At the end of the day I have ordered a bike and I’ll be personalising it to suit me and my riding style. Winning tests is great and all but splitting hairs springs to mind sometimes.

 

[Jhagst]

Great experience, Were them both Large? Norco Range has 170mm travel vs 150mm Trail, no wonder it feels much more comfortable.

Both were XL. The suspension on both Rails was extended to 170 front 165ish rear. Fox 38 Factory with coil conversion front and Ohlins TTX rear.

I can't say enough good things about Trek, they stood behind their product and provided excellent customer service.