Levo SL Gen 1 SRAM axs worth it?

[Mtbvkk]

Since I’m building a new frame out I was wondering if I should spend the approx. extra 800 on the axs derailleur and shifter. ive read reviews and people seem to love it. But it Is a steep price of entry.

 

[Motoxfreak]

I have AXS droppers, controllers and derailleur on all 3 of my bikes. That being said, I do not feel it is really worth the price.
I do like them a lot, but they are just so expensive. I dont know if I could do without the droppers, but the shifter/controller is another thing. It does really clean up the cockpit and I really do like that. The only problem I have had, is once in a while I hit the shifter of the dropper with my knee and slam the dropper. The other thing is the sensitivity of the controller. It has happened that I will sometimes hit it with my knuckle and accidentally shift down when I'm in the middle of a climb. Now that I said most of the negatives, the shifts are deliberate and for the most part quiet and smooth. The seat post with its micro adjustments are awesome. That is my .02.

 

[Salespunk]

If the money makes a difference to you then pass on it. AXS works really well, but it won't improve your ride at all. Money is better spent on the best wheels you can find, but if this is a bling build then go for it.

 

[Motoxfreak]

If the money makes a difference to you then pass on it. AXS works really well, but it won't improve your ride at all. Money is better spent on the best wheels you can find, but if this is a bling build then go for it.

Well said!

 

[Mtbvkk]

I have AXS droppers, controllers and derailleur on all 3 of my bikes. That being said, I do not feel it is really worth the price.
I do like them a lot, but they are just so expensive. I dont know if I could do without the droppers, but the shifter/controller is another thing. It does really clean up the cockpit and I really do like that. The only problem I have had, is once in a while I hit the shifter of the dropper with my knee and slam the dropper. The other thing is the sensitivity of the controller. It has happened that I will sometimes hit it with my knuckle and accidentally shift down when I'm in the middle of a climb. Now that I said most of the negatives, the shifts are deliberate and for the most part quiet and smooth. The seat post with its micro adjustments are awesome. That is my .02.

Thanks for the detailed info. I’ve seen other reports too that they say the dropper is a bigger game changer than the drivetrain.

 

[Bigtuna00]

The drivetrain is not "worth it", as in worth the cost. It shifts no better than the other SRAM drivetrains. The main difference is the controller since you're not throwing levers, just pushing switches, it's "easier" and a bit more precise. I still miss shifts occasionally by simply not pressing the lever far enough to trigger the button. If you have hand strength/grip issues, it might be worth it. I enjoy it because it's cool, but if I ever break the derailleur or shifter I won't be replacing them with AXS.

Also, when the battery gets low it's pretty catastrophic, the system really freaks out and it munched my chain and hanger pretty good. I was expecting more head room as they say a red light means 25% power; mine went from green to flashing-red-freak-out in a single ride. I'm not at all impressed with the derailleur construction, this is what mine looks like after this incident:


The dropper is a slightly different story. It's still VERY expensive and the post itself is not particularly good (BikeYoke Revive is smoother and easier to move), but the controller offers some interesting advantages. The biggest plus in my opinion is the ability to make micro adjustments. If you flick the button, you can move the post by very small amounts. It's actually really useful, instead of having to fight with lever position to get in just the right spot. One caveat here: the stock controller spring is way too stiff. I replaced it with a softer spring, which makes this aspect even better.

The other advantage to the controller is there's no effort to locate the release point of the dropper. With an analog lever I would often have to push more than once because I wasn't in the right spot. Swapping bikes (with different droppers) only makes this worse. With AXS it's always just a click.

I would say if you get the drivetrain, you should also get the dropper as well so that you always have two batteries. They don't drain at the same rate, so you always have a backup when one runs out. You can of course carry an extra battery, but that's just one more thing to remember to bring when riding. On the other hand doing the dropper only is a fine idea.

EDIT to add: Not having to run cables is certainly nice. But not $1800 nice

For my next bike/drivetrain I'm ready to try Shimano. I've heard too many good things, even with mismatched shifters, the Shimano stuff is supposed to be better especially shifting under load. Shifting under load is a big concern for me on an ebike. Even on a "bling" build I don't think I'd buy AXS again.

 

[Mtbvkk]

If the money makes a difference to you then pass on it. AXS works really well, but it won't improve your ride at all. Money is better spent on the best wheels you can find, but if this is a bling build then go for it.

Is that completely true though? cables do drop in tension over time and sometimes the angle of the chain means less precise shifting where apparently this is accounted for in axs. So more precision and no degradation and less weight. I agree cables are already so good that this is incremental, but to say it’s purely bling doesn’t seem accurate.

 

[Bigtuna00]

Is that completely true though? cables do drop in tension over time and sometimes the angle of the chain means less precise shifting where apparently this is accounted for in axs. So more precision and no degradation and less weight. I agree cables are already so good that this is incremental, but to say it’s purely bling doesn’t seem accurate.

Cables shouldn't lose any tension after break in. Something else is wrong if you're finding that to be a problem.

Not sure what you mean about the angle of the chain affecting shifting, AXS is no different in this regard. It's just a SRAM derailleur with a motor in it*

* One feature SRAM touts is that the derailleur moves out of the way after impact. I don't really see how this solves anything, you've already had the impact, why move after? What it *does* do is overreact and cause chain skipping when you smack it. Seems very gimicky...

 

[Mtbvkk]

The drivetrain is not "worth it", as in worth the cost. It shifts no better than the other SRAM drivetrains. The main difference is the controller since you're not throwing levers, just pushing toggle switches, it's "easier" and a bit more precise. I still miss shifts occasionally by simply not pressing the lever far enough to trigger the button. If you have hand strength/grip issues, it might be worth it. I enjoy it because it's cool, but if I ever break the derailleur or shifter I won't be replacing them with AXS.

Also, when the battery gets low it's pretty catastrophic, the system really freaks out and it munched my chain and hanger pretty good. I was expecting more head room as they say a red light means 25% power; mine went from green to flashing-red-freak-out in a single ride. I'm not at all impressed with the derailleur construction, this is what mine looks like after this incident:


The dropper is a slightly different story. It's still VERY expensive and the post itself is not particularly good (BikeYoke Revive is smoother and easier to move), but the controller offers some interesting advantages. The biggest plus in my opinion is the ability to make micro adjustments. If you flick the button, you can move the post by very small amounts. It's actually really useful, instead of having to fight with lever position to get in just the right spot. One caveat here: the stock controller spring is way too stiff. I replaced it with a softer spring, which makes this aspect even better.

The other advantage to the controller is there's no effort to locate the release point of the dropper. With an analog lever I would often have to push more than once because I wasn't in the right spot. Swapping bikes (with different droppers) only makes this worse. With AXS it's always just a click.

I would say if you get the drivetrain, you should also get the dropper as well so that you always have two batteries. They don't drain at the same rate, so you always have a backup when one runs out. You can of course carry an extra battery, but that's just one more thing to remember to bring when riding. On the other hand doing the dropper only is a fine idea.

For my next bike/drivetrain I'm ready to try Shimano. I've heard too many good things, even with mismatched shifters, the Shimano stuff is supposed to be better especially shifting under load. Shifting under load is a big concern for me on an ebike. Even on a "bling" build I don't think I'd buy AXS again.

Thanks - good info. Youve convinced me to save my money. I’ll just go with a regular 52T eagle for now. I’m already familiar with it and it works sufficiently well for me.

i may upgrade to an axs dropper in the future but for now I’ll Just get a pnw loam.

 

[Bigtuna00]

One more tip, since you indicated Levo SL: AXS is heavier

 

[Mtbvkk]

Cables shouldn't lose any tension after break in. Something else is wrong if you're finding that to be a problem.

Not sure what you mean about the angle of the chain affecting shifting, AXS is no different in this regard. It's just a SRAM derailleur with a motor in it*

* One feature SRAM touts is that the derailleur moves out of the way after impact. I don't really see how this solves anything, you've already had the impact, why move after? What it *does* do is overreact and cause chain skipping when you smack it. Seems very gimicky...

My terminology may be incorrect here, but I remember reading a while ago that they have programmed it to prevent Mis-shifts so you can’t push the shifter beyond where you want to go like in a cable one.

The tension is subtle and I’m not saying its a huge loss in tension And why I said that its not a huge improvement. But any time you get a new bike it shifts way crisper and that does degrade a bit over time,

 

[Mtbvkk]

One more tip, since you indicated Levo SL: AXS is heavier

Thats good to know - I was hoping it’s lighter since you don’t have cables. Are you sure about that? Cables do add a but of weight.

 

[Bigtuna00]

My terminology may be incorrect here, but I remember reading a while ago that they have programmed it to prevent Mis-shifts so you can’t push the shifter beyond where you want to go like in a cable one.

If you can push the chain too far, your limit screws aren't set correctly. AXS derailleur still has limit screws. If you adjust the derailleur incorrectly (called "micro-adjust"), you can still shift past the gears and drop the chain. The only thing you don't have is the ability to use the shift lever to push past the last gear, that's true. But you shouldn't be able to do that on a properly set up drivetrain whether it's AXS or not.

The tension is subtle and I’m not saying its a huge loss in tension And why I said that its not a huge improvement. But any time you get a new bike it shifts way crisper and that does degrade a bit over time,

That's the shifter and derailleur wearing. If it was cable stretch you'd simply tighten the cable again.

Thats good to know - I was hoping it’s lighter since you don’t have cables. Are you sure about that? Cables do add a but of weight.

I suppose it's mainly the post. The post is very heavy (so is the "regular" Reverb). The drivetrain is pretty close but I wouldn't be surprised if full XX1 is actually lighter.

 

[Mtbvkk]

If you can push the chain too far, your limit screws aren't set correctly. AXS derailleur still has limit screws. If you adjust the derailleur incorrectly (called "micro-adjust"), you can still shift past the gears and drop the chain. The only thing you don't have is the ability to use the shift lever to push past the last gear, that's true. But you shouldn't be able to do that on a properly set up drivetrain whether it's AXS or not.



That's the shifter and derailleur wearing. If it was cable stretch you'd simply tighten the cable again.



I suppose it's mainly the post. The post is very heavy (so is the "regular" Reverb). The drivetrain is pretty close but I wouldn't be surprised if full XX1 is actually lighter.

Makes sense - thanks

 

[j1e]

If/when AXS shifting is integrated such that power to motor is momentarily interrupted to enable a fast, smooth shift I'll certainly be interested.

Until then Shimano 12 speed sounds like the way to go as I hear it shifts smoothly under power...

I live in Michigan (where even a 42 tooth rear cog is pretty laughable) so I usually prefer SRAM 11 speed as it is light (cassette = 263g), has a 10 tooth cog (which I do spend a lot of time in) and shifts quite fast.

As far as cable stretch I occasionally give the barrel adjuster a turn to correct any issue. While I will be glad to lose the cable someday I can't say that it has been much trouble.

Here's a great resource for comparing drivetrain/cassette options:


(if link doesn't work can Google: Bicycle Cassettes & Drivetrains Chart)

 

[Salespunk]

Is that completely true though? cables do drop in tension over time and sometimes the angle of the chain means less precise shifting where apparently this is accounted for in axs. So more precision and no degradation and less weight. I agree cables are already so good that this is incremental, but to say it’s purely bling doesn’t seem accurate.

I have AXS on three bikes, two MTB plus my road bike. Also have XO1 on another bike right now so I can compare them back to back. I do make micro adjustments on my XO1 bike, but it is not a big deal. I didn't say AXS isn't good or isn't worth the money, I said there is another place I would spend the money first if I had to make a choice. AXS is very good, but it doesn't change the quality of your ride like a high end set of wheels.

 

[Mtbvkk]

If/when AXS shifting is integrated such that power to motor is momentarily interrupted to enable a fast, smooth shift I'll certainly be interested.

Until then Shimano 12 speed sounds like the way to go as I hear it shifts smoothly under power...

I live in Michigan (where even a 42 tooth rear cog is pretty laughable) so I usually prefer SRAM 11 speed as it is light (cassette = 263g), has a 10 tooth cog (which I do spend a lot of time in) and shifts quite fast.

As far as cable stretch I occasionally give the barrel adjuster a turn to correct any issue. While I will be glad to lose the cable someday I can't say that it has been much trouble.

Here's a great resource for comparing drivetrain/cassette options:


(if link doesn't work can Google: Bicycle Cassettes & Drivetrains Chart)

Thanks!

 

[bikeguy11]

I have AXS droppers, controllers and derailleur on all 3 of my bikes. That being said, I do not feel it is really worth the price.
I do like them a lot, but they are just so expensive. I dont know if I could do without the droppers, but the shifter/controller is another thing. It does really clean up the cockpit and I really do like that. The only problem I have had, is once in a while I hit the shifter of the dropper with my knee and slam the dropper. The other thing is the sensitivity of the controller. It has happened that I will sometimes hit it with my knuckle and accidentally shift down when I'm in the middle of a climb. Now that I said most of the negatives, the shifts are deliberate and for the most part quiet and smooth. The seat post with its micro adjustments are awesome. That is my .02.

Feel the same way Motoxfreak. I can leave the shifting but even though they're hella expensive I've owned two of the droppers on different bikes and they haven't given me any problems at all.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Dropper is brilliant and would recommend if you don't mind the cost so much. Performance has been outstanding.

Agree with the shifting comments above. Wireless is neat, tidy and easy install. But the actual feel vs cable, personally I think cable still has the edge. I think with a more ergonomic shifting paddle and some tweaks to the feel of the actual shift (maybe with some haptic shifting feedback?) then it'd be close to perfection *(other than cost).

 

[Mtbvkk]

Dropper is brilliant and would recommend if you don't mind the cost so much. Performance has been outstanding.

Agree with the shifting comments above. Wireless is neat, tidy and easy install. But the actual feel vs cable, personally I think cable still has the edge. I think with a more ergonomic shifting paddle and some tweaks to the feel of the actual shift (maybe with some haptic shifting feedback?) then it'd be close to perfection *(other than cost).

Thanks Rob, that's good to hear. I'm going analog on the whole thing at the moment and will upgrade at a future point. I'm sure SRAM will come out with a V2 at some point. It's been a few years already.

 

[crazymelki]

If you are a big data geek, then maybe the AXS shifting is quite interesting.

For this ride, I could also use a bigger chainring ;-)

 

[Mtbvkk]

If you are a big data geek, then maybe the AXS shifting is quite interesting.
View attachment 53468 View attachment 53469
For this ride, I could also use a bigger chainring ;-)

interesting - could be useful for fitness and training - an inclinometer would be useful too - or a way to correlate this with the map and altitude data in mission control

 

[crazymelki]

I was wondering also about the switching operations during a ride. Example: 378 time during a 78 min ride...Thats quite a lot.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

If you are a big data geek, then maybe the AXS shifting is quite interesting.
View attachment 53468 View attachment 53469
For this ride, I could also use a bigger chainring ;-)

This is great data. I looked on mine but it didn't record. Can you see more than the last ride? I'd be interested how much you use the 42/52t

 

[Jackware]

But the actual feel vs cable, personally I think cable still has the edge. I think with a more ergonomic shifting paddle and some tweaks to the feel of the actual shift (maybe with some haptic shifting feedback?) then it'd be close to perfection *(other than cost).

There is a new paddle available based on the traditional lever positions through obviously it doesn't change the 'clicky' feel;

 

[crazymelki]

This is great data. I looked on mine but it didn't record. Can you see more than the last ride? I'd be interested how much you use the 42/52t

so far, I did just 3 rides with the AXS and can see all. But I was using a Garmin Edge 1030 during the ride. The AXS is connected via ANT+. Then my Garmin Account is paired with the SRAM Account.
Here is a howto but in German: ▷ SRAM eTap AXS Test » Connectivity der el. Schaltung
I hope it helps.
BTW: During this three rides I never used the 42 and 52

 

[Salespunk]

I was wondering also about the switching operations during a ride. Example: 378 time during a 78 min ride...Thats quite a lot.

This is actually about average, on technical terrain it will be significantly more.

 

[Singletrackmind]

Thanks for the detailed info. I’ve seen other reports too that they say the dropper is a bigger game changer than the drivetrain.

100% agree about the AXS dropper, always thought Fox Transfer was the only dropper for me until I got my Spesh Levo S-Works that came stock with AXS Dropper. Ended up switching out on all my bikes. Would also agree that the AXS Shifters are more than adequate, like the programmability and clean cockpit. Have Shimano XT Drivetrain on my YT Decoy Elite and can attest it does shift much smoother. Both are top of the line components and you can't go wrong either way. For me money is not a consideration and I have Sram AXS on my hybrid road bike and acoustic mtbs. Haven't been impressed with lower lever SRAM or Shimano drivetrain components and perhaps its because I am a bit of a snob once I got a taste of the higher ebd stuff. One last thought, if you are building a bike from the ground up, absolutely go with the Shigura Brake set-up. I've tried them all and these live up to the hype!

 

[RickBullotta]

If you ride somewhere technical or with lots of blowdown after storms, where you occasionally destroy derailleurs, you'll dislike AXS and Di2. It's a pricy replacement when you bust them up.

 

[High Rock Ruti]

Since I’m building a new frame out I was wondering if I should spend the approx. extra 800 on the axs derailleur and shifter. ive read reviews and people seem to love it. But it Is a steep price of entry.

High Rock Ruti

Have the dropper it is fantastic and worth the money, the derailleur is $700 and I break one or two a year because of sticks getting sucked up, not to mention the torque just chews up chains and cassettes about every 750 miles. I've got Di2 and have only broken one in about 3000 miles just love it, but they are only $190 USD.

Warm Regards

Ruti