Shimano Hyperglide + (plus)

[Mario Antony]

Yes, it's not new, and Yes it's around for quiet a while now!

But with all hype around Sram Transmission, and changing gears without taking out power, we quickly think it's the only option...but no!

Shimano with the Hyperglide plus, can and will change gears without any flaw up and/or down, and with all the tech, starting at Deore level up to XTR.

On the upper levels (xt/xtr) there are details that can be worth have (like multire lease shifter on the downshifts - only possible on XT & XTR, more range of adjustment on the shifter, or better feeling due to rubberized interface), and other details that can make a difference to touch and apperance.

After almost 1000km with Hyperglide plus, and coming from Sram X01 and XT 11speed, I was amazed how we can change gears up at full power on an ebike!
The shift is seamless, and without any problems.
On the downshifts is equally amazing, although the sound that it transmit is a bit like a squencial rally car.

Regaring transmission wear, it still looks as new, but time will tell.

What can be asked more?

Plus side:
Price - starting at Deore up to XTR
Shifting performance
Shifting under power

Less side:
Not being wireless?

More info: SHIMANO HYPERGLIDE+ | SHIMANO BIKE-US

 

[theremotejuggernaut]

It is a good system. The shifts are crisp even with a load of power going through the pedals.

I've just had to replace my slx cassette though after only 890 miles which is disappointing given that I see people running thousands of miles on them.

Is there any functional difference between a Deore and an XT?

Obviously, the XT weighs less not is there any difference in the shifting?

 

[emtbeast]

I think Hyperglide + is excellent for a normal bike, and good enough or let's say pretty darn good for an ebike, although it has drawbacks.

The main one would be that it shifts fast and you can feel it as chain shift shock(nicely shown in the Linkglide vs Hyperglide animation), especially when under power.

I think the Sram Transmission will wear at least the same or even more due to people just abusing it because they believe the hype of shifting under load not effecting wear. I believe all the Transmission is doing is enabling a quiet shift and so giving a false sense of lack of drivetrain wear, time will tell if the price for it is justified.

I also believe the Transmission is a somewhat copy of the Shimano Linkglide system that was released at least a year before and had/has the so called LINKGLIDE's optimized gear gate design =? Sram shift ramp design...and also like the Linkglide the Transmission is slow-er in shifting because of this tech...just food for thought here...

Don't get me wrong I like new tech and am not saying the Transmission is bad, it does have one negative side though if we leave out the price...it is slow, to slow imo any mechanical shift system with a healthy shifting technique is faster and also quiet and efficient.

I would love to see more of Linkglide on ebikes.

LINKGLIDE | SHIMANO BIKE-EU

SHIMANO LINKGLIDE sets a new standard for smooth and reliable shifting.

bike.shimano.com

 

[JP-NZ]

I've done 1700km (1050 miles) on my full XT M8100 drivetrain. Think my chain is almost at 0.50% so I'll be replacing it soon. On the Hyperglide+ thoughts mine actually shifts better when under load compared to easing off the pedals. It does feel like a DSG gearbox and is very smooth when changing under pressure.

 

[Mario Antony]

I think Hyperglide + is excellent for a normal bike, and good enough or let's say pretty darn good for an ebike, although it has drawbacks.

The main one would be that it shifts fast and you can feel it as chain shift shock(nicely shown in the Linkglide vs Hyperglide animation), especially when under power.

I think the Sram Transmission will wear at least the same or even more due to people just abusing it because they believe the hype of shifting under load not effecting wear. I believe all the Transmission is doing is enabling a quiet shift and so giving a false sense of lack of drivetrain wear, time will tell if the price for it is justified.

I also believe the Transmission is a somewhat copy of the Shimano Linkglide system that was released at least a year before and had/has the so called LINKGLIDE's optimized gear gate design =? Sram shift ramp design...and also like the Linkglide the Transmission is slow-er in shifting because of this tech...just food for thought here...

Don't get me wrong I like new tech and am not saying the Transmission is bad, it does have one negative side though if we leave out the price...it is slow, to slow imo any mechanical shift system with a healthy shifting technique is faster and also quiet and efficient.

I would love to see more of Linkglide on ebikes.

LINKGLIDE | SHIMANO BIKE-EU

SHIMANO LINKGLIDE sets a new standard for smooth and reliable shifting.

bike.shimano.com

There was an interview/podcast on the Linkglide, and had some opinions regarding the system.

Although I was all for the Linkglide (less gears, stronger, hg freehub, fair price), I stumbled on the interview/podcast, why PROs wouldn't use it on eEWS:
Initially was the lack of parts in case something bent, risking the fact that it would need to go back to Hyperglide+ (riders seemed to dislike have to adapt to new gears mid season), but the most important was the fact that Linkglide takes more time to switch gears.

I know I'm not a PRO racer, nor it's my intention to be, but something that always annoyed me, was the time it takes for defective drivetrain or even bent RDhangar, to switch gears!
Other considerations was:
- Am I breaking chains/Cassetes?(No...)
- So do I need stronger material, if the present one is handling all situations? (No...)

So, I question myself:
Why buy a drivetrain, that's presently proprietary, with specific and tailored hardware, heavier (although much burlier I supose!), that shifts slower than my present Hyperglide+?

Being me, I probably will try sooner or later, but for now, hyperglide+ makes my day with ultraprecise shifting and seemless gearchange while on power (up...
or down!), in Boost or Eco... on steep climbs or shallow trails

Next step, is Upgrading the shifter to XT, but leaving the Deore mech (really cheap and I don't get mad when I add a scratch) & cassete (100%steel)

 

[Hardtail]

Linkglide is hard to beat on an Ebike for the non-pros, it's cheap, burly, shifts clean and purpose-built.
Sure, if you are competing, weight matters and you are going a lot more maintenance anyway and prefer a known/tried and tested drivetrain then HG+.
Combine Linkglide with a proper wax and it is outstanding.

 

[emtbeast]

Initially was the lack of parts in case something bent, risking the fact that it would need to go back to Hyperglide+ (riders seemed to dislike have to adapt to new gears mid season), but the most important was the fact that Linkglide takes more time to switch gears.

I can totally agree with everything you wrote, as I also said, Shimano Linkglide and Sram Transmission both shift much slower(same technology) than older drivetrains and I am pretty sure I wouldn't like it either because when you have an uphill flow going you need fast and precise shifts, so in this case Hyperglide + with slightly releasing pedal presure it enables a really snapy and precise shift. Although I haven't tried the Linkglide yet so can't say for sure if it would be to slow. From what I have seen for the Sram Transmission It is definitely to slow for me.

In my case with regular cleaning and lubing my SLX/XT Hyperglide + is still going strong after two chains(KMC 1200km(0,75 stretch) Shimano XT 1500km(0,5 stretch)), original SLX cassette, so far 90000 meters of elevation gain and 3700km distance traveled on an average terrain incline of 8,3%.

So yes Hyperglide + is a pretty good ebike drivetrain, the only thing I don't like is the chain jump shock when shifting down the cassette(smaller sprockets).

Linkglide on the other hand probably provides smother shifting and takes away the so called chain shock to the expense of speed. It all depends what you prefer.

The best would be a hybrid of both systems.

 

[Stihldog]

The best would be a hybrid of both systems.

I’ve kinda been using a hybrid/hack drivetrain system for almost three years now.
Shimano XT cassette, HG chain, Sram AXS GX derailer, eThirteen 34t chainring, Shimano 13t lower jockey wheel(recommended). Before I switch to this system I chewed through cassettes and chains fairly fast. I seem to be getting more km’s from my drivetrain now.

Three problems though;
1-too fast
2-too quiet
3-too smooth

Other than that, I’m not bending derailer hangers as much.

I keep a spare hanger and HG chain, and lube things up every few rides.

 

[emtbeast]

I’ve kinda been using a hybrid/hack drivetrain system for almost three years now.
Shimano XT cassette, HG chain, Sram AXS GX derailer, eThirteen 34t chainring, Shimano 13t lower jockey wheel(recommended). Before I switch to this system I chewed through cassettes and chains fairly fast. I seem to be getting more km’s from my drivetrain now.

Three problems though;
1-too fast
2-too quiet
3-too smooth

Other than that, I’m not bending derailer hangers as much.

I keep a spare hanger and HG chain, and lube things up every few rides.

I have a similar setup(except the 13T) on my amish bike, like you said it's a solid performer. With the hybrid I actually ment a hybrid between Hyperglide + and Linkglide would be the best for an ebike.

The old Sram AXS is fast, but still slower than any mechanical drivetrain, especially Shimano's where the chain shifts as soon as you press the trigger vs Sram's where it shifts when you release the trigger.

So I still prefer mechanical for an ebike.

 

[Stihldog]

I have a similar setup(except the 13T) on my amish bike, like you said it's a solid performer.

The lower jockey wheel may not be necessary (Shimano 13t). The original Sram lower jockey wheel (14t) works just fine. I installed this exact system on a friends eMTB but the axle diameter on the guide wheel wouldn’t fit properly …so I left the original Sram 14t lower jockey wheel. The narrow/wide wheel caused a bit of “ticking” noise for a few rides then settled in. It’s plastic so the chain probably wore the narrow/wide a bit. He seems to be happy with the shifting.

The AXS derailer system allows for some micro adjustments thru the app.

 

[Mario Antony]

I can totally agree with everything you wrote, as I also said, Shimano Linkglide and Sram Transmission both shift much slower(same technology) than older drivetrains and I am pretty sure I wouldn't like it either because when you have an uphill flow going you need fast and precise shifts, so in this case Hyperglide + with slightly releasing pedal presure it enables a really snapy and precise shift. Although I haven't tried the Linkglide yet so can't say for sure if it would be to slow. From what I have seen for the Sram Transmission It is definitely to slow for me.

In my case with regular cleaning and lubing my SLX/XT Hyperglide + is still going strong after two chains(KMC 1200km(0,75 stretch) Shimano XT 1500km(0,5 stretch)), original SLX cassette, so far 90000 meters of elevation gain and 3700km distance traveled on an average terrain incline of 8,3%.

So yes Hyperglide + is a pretty good ebike drivetrain, the only thing I don't like is the chain jump shock when shifting down the cassette(smaller sprockets).

Linkglide on the other hand probably provides smother shifting and takes away the so called chain shock to the expense of speed. It all depends what you prefer.

The best would be a hybrid of both systems.

Emtbeast,
Just a side note: Hyperglide+ is more the interface chain/cassete, with the chain being design to work in conjunction with the cassete.
Now, I don't know if KMC already has Hyperglide + chains, but if you're using a "simple" 12 speed chain, you're losing all that hyperglide+ "thing".

Now... if KMC already makes hyperglide plus chain, forget everything I wrote

 

[emtbeast]

@Mario Antony Thanks for your input, I am of course perfectly aware of that. The reason why I used it was because It was factory spec on a new Giant Reign E+ 2022.

I was also wondering why Giant speced the SLX cassette with this chain, as like you say man losses the Hyperglide tech with it, but as I had it new I gave it a go.

To add some info on this here, I had a Hyperglide+ drivetrain on my amish bike before the Reign and so I knew/know how smooth it is.

All I can say the marriage of the Hyperglide SLX cassette and the KMC E-chain on the Reign ebike was good enough, but no where near the Shimano Hyperglide smoothnes.

The 0,75% stretch after only 1200km probably shows that they don't match to good.

 

[Mario Antony]

@Mario Antony Thanks for your input, I am of course perfectly aware of that. The reason why I used it was because It was factory spec on a new Giant Reign E+ 2022.

I was also wondering why Giant speced the SLX cassette with this chain, as like you say man losses the Hyperglide tech with it, but as I had it new I gave it a go.

To add some info on this here, I had a Hyperglide+ drivetrain on my amish bike before the Reign and so I knew/know how smooth it is.

All I can say the marriage of the Hyperglide SLX cassette and the KMC E-chain on the Reign ebike was good enough, but no where near the Shimano Hyperglide smoothnes.

The 0,75% stretch after only 1200km probably shows that they don't match to good.

Sometimes product managers spec components outside of the product family (like your bike with KMC on Shimano) due to stock or contractual arrangements set previously.
Ask any engineer, and the best solution is not always the "more better" solution in terms of margins

Once I had all Shimano stuff (down to cables and guides), I noticed a really upgrade (this like +15years ago...)
Has you said, it works with other brands, but 100% Shimano is something else - more if it's XTR!
Since it was released (XTR) it's what I always wanted, but personaly, I can't justify over XT (Yes, I'm a cheap bastard!)

 

[emtbeast]

Sometimes product managers spec components outside of the product family (like your bike with KMC on Shimano) due to stock or contractual arrangements set previously.

I know, that was my first thought also, availability, as this was the after Covid time, I remember that Shimano stuff was out of stock in a lot of online shops. I never tried XTR as I feel the same, usually also go for the best bang for buck

 

[theremotejuggernaut]

The 0,75% stretch after only 1200km probably shows that they don't match to good.

This about what I got from an SLX cassette and a 6100 chain that came standard on my Rise.

I do a lot of pedalling on my rides and love climbing but I'm not a pedal masher and make full use of the gears. They just didn't last all that well.

II reckon swapping the chain earlier would probably have helped. I've just fitted an XT cassette/ chain and I'm going to buy a second chain and rotate them to see if I get better mileage.

 

[emtbeast]

For the chain I would always go for one group higher than the cassette, always has great results with the XT M8100 chains.

 

[theremotejuggernaut]

For the chain I would always go for one group higher than the cassette, always has great results with the XT M8100 chains.

I thought about XTR but I hot wax my chains and having to poke the wax out of every single hole just doesn't appeal lol

 

[Mario Antony]

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