Levo SL Gen 1 Shh - Don't tell Trek Forum / Rail to Levo SL

[flightrisk86]

Hey All,
I got a 2021 Trek Rail 9.8xt and only ride it in the eco mode (setting 1 of 4) 60% support.
Great bike, big fun, but I don't need all the power and the weight. I ride often (3-5times a week), road & mtb, so kind of in shape (6ft 235lb). I like the burn and reward of getting up a hill, but the ebike allows me to go further in less time and makes me look for new trails, so I don't want to lose that aspect.
So, looking at the Carbon Levo SL in a Large.
I can rent a AL Comp and will do so, but what can be expected riding a SL in low pwr mode?
Any idea what kind of support it gives in the power modes?

 

[Zimmerframe]

I think from all the threads it's one of those things which is difficult to compare in a 100% meaningful way.

As a completely rough guide .. Eco would be less than eco you're used to and Turbo would be slightly more than Eco you're used to. But with bike weighs and other factors it's not as clear cut as that.

 

[boBE]

Hey All,
I got a 2021 Trek Rail 9.8xt and only ride it in the eco mode (setting 1 of 4) 60% support.
Great bike, big fun, but I don't need all the power and the weight. I ride often (3-5times a week), road & mtb, so kind of in shape (6ft 235lb). I like the burn and reward of getting up a hill, but the ebike allows me to go further in less time and makes me look for new trails, so I don't want to lose that aspect.
So, looking at the Carbon Levo SL in a Large.
I can rent a AL Comp and will do so, but what can be expected riding a SL in low pwr mode?
Any idea what kind of support it gives in the power modes?
View attachment 58862

The SL default levels are 35%, 60%, and 100% of assist, up to the 240 watt limit. According to Specialized Rider Care this means we will get 35% of max assist in Eco (times 2x rider power for the SL) or 70% boost. Or 120%, or 200% in the other settings. The amount and limits of assist are all adjustable but maybe 35 will be similar to the 60% you have now except it will only go to 240 watts max.

 

[flightrisk86]

Ok, I just pulled the Ad for sale of bike and told the prospective buyer, I'm having 2nd thoughts. I will rent a SL next week to confirm this is the right move.

 

[Moe Ped]

Here is a comparison.

 

[levity]

Agree with all of the above replies including Steve's review in the video @Moe Ped posted. When you test ride the SL next week I recommend that you set Peak Power to 100% for all assist levels. That way you can get the full 240W (actually closer to 280W) if you put in the effort even at lower Eco or Trail assist levels.

Compared to full power ebikes like the Rail and Levo the Levo SL will ride more like a regular mtb - you will have to engage and anticipate more and shift to lower gears. You will be rewarded with more nimble handling, and the lighter front end can also make some technical terrain easier. As a lighter rider (160 lb) I find the SL power to be plenty and prefer the more bicycle feel of the SL to the moto feel of its big brother. I loved the power of the Levo (!), I just prefer the experience of the SL.

If you want the perspective of someone your weight who owns both a full-size Levo and a Levo SL you might reach out to @jbodnar here on emtbr for his views. (Jeff to the white courtesy phone, please)

 

[flightrisk86]

Thanks All, Interesting Video. Maybe the bike I want does not exist yet.

 

[jbodnar]

Nothing beats test riding one on your trails.

I’m not fit (over 50 lbs overweight), so I’m missing my FF Levo while its waiting for a new motor.

On a local XC trail, I will run the FF in eco and the SL in trail mode.

At a local Bike Park (no lift), I run the FF in Trail and the SL in Turbo (with the extender battery)...I normally would take the FF because it’s easier and faster back to the top.

I usually ride alone...if I do ride with other ebikes, I take the FF.

Sounds like the SL might be a great fit for you.

For me, I love having both.

I do get more exercise on the SL, if that is important to you (I’d rather not reduce eco on my FF).

 

[Moe Ped]

I must be on too much medication, forgot to mention I have an SL as well as a levo (haven't ridden the levo yet) but have another full power bike.

The SL is really unique and if I am riding with non ebikes I love it, if riding with really fit riders or full ebikes it would be hard to keep up. The SL needs good cadence to get the support out of it.

I am not that fit though.

 

[flightrisk86]

jbodnar & moe ped - thanks for the input!
Can't wait to test one out.

 

[Mtbvkk]

Fyi i traded in my FF Levo for an SL. If you are looking for a feel of a regular mountain bike then the SL is it. Its more nimble, easier to handle and for me more fun. Im not in great shape and also recovering from health issues and the SL is perfect for me for recovery. it has sufficient power. I almost never use turbo.

 

[flightrisk86]

Good to hear

 

[Ridill66]

Good Damn, I have the same Problem... Changing my mind every 1h. SL or FF Levo?

I am 73kg used to be 98kg 2019, then I did buy a Scott E-Genius tuned 700 from 2018 and Cycled almost every day. I live in Switzerland, all I can ride is up. During the Winter i started to ride on Zwift, did buy a road bike last year, and finished my first Century ride this summer 100 miles. my FTP is around 250W. Last Summer I did ride the Ebike in Eco only this had the Steps 8000 Motor, max Torque is 70NM no Idea what it is in Eco mode. One day I was riding with a friend and after the Ebike ride, I jumped on Zwift because I did feel I had to exercise more. I can get a Levo Expert for 20% Off or the SL for 25% Off the SL would be upgrades to XT Breaks 200mm Rotors and 52-10T Cassette and Range extender.

How many meters in elevation do you think I can get in Turbo out of it?

What shall I get?

 

[CjP]

On the main battery alone I am getting around 35km and 1200m elevation with a 36t rear and 19kg bike.

 

[Ridill66]

On the main battery alone I am getting around 35km and 1200m elevation with a 36t rear and 19kg bike.

That's not bad in Turbo, I guess you can't ask for peoples weight nowadays

 

[Kimmoi]

When I made the decision for a new bike, the ease of removing the battery was one of the criteria.
Specialized really sucks in that point of view. Stupid solution. So i went to Trek.
I have had Turbo Levo HT and i liket it a lot though. Brose is very good motor.

Sad they come up that kind of solution about battery. I might have bought turbo levo otherwise.

 

[CjP]

That's not bad in Turbo, I guess you can't ask for peoples weight nowadays

I’m no princess, I weight a porky 85kg @ 178cm.
Bike is also a large.

 

[CoreyB]

I only have a Levo SL and am 6'2" and 210lbs (I'm pushing 60 and am in decent shape for someone who works lots of hours per week). When I'm riding with my buddies that have FF bikes, I keep my bike in Trail (set at 60/75) and they ride in Eco mode. With my range extender, at the end of a 4 hour ride, I have about 40% battery left and they have about the same - depending on the bike. If I were riding with a group that wanted to jam to the top as fast as possible, my SL would not be a good fit, but generally we climb at a comfortable pace together and it works really well. Every time I go out with them I wonder if I made the correct choice with the SL compared to the FF, but at the end of the day I am totally confident that I made the correct choice for what I like about riding for me. So..with all that said, there are pros and cons to all the options and it's all just personal preference.

 

[Dave_B]

I rode my Son’s SL today for the first time around Surrey Hills. I did 30km and about 3000 ft of climbing. Still had 30% battery remaining and used eco mode 35/100 factory setting for 99% of the ride. I weigh 85kg. A rough estimate tells me the SL will give me more distance and climbing around Surrey Hills than what I get out of my Heckler (shimano e8000 500wh battery in medium eco and low trail). I can’t quite figure out out the Levo SL is capable of doing this, but it does! Yes, it is slower on the climbs and I got more of a work out than usual, but it’s a fecking great bike to ride!! I can see that in steeper environments than Surrey Hills is would give me a lot more of a workout than the Heckler and is the reason I’m taking the Heckler to Afan tomorrow and not the SL.

I would also prefer the SL to be a mullet (I converted my Heckler to mullet) as I did catch my arse a few times on the rear wheel today.

 

[Bikewombat]

Hey All,
I got a 2021 Trek Rail 9.8xt and only ride it in the eco mode (setting 1 of 4) 60% support.
Great bike, big fun, but I don't need all the power and the weight. I ride often (3-5times a week), road & mtb, so kind of in shape (6ft 235lb). I like the burn and reward of getting up a hill, but the ebike allows me to go further in less time and makes me look for new trails, so I don't want to lose that aspect.
So, looking at the Carbon Levo SL in a Large.
I can rent a AL Comp and will do so, but what can be expected riding a SL in low pwr mode?
Any idea what kind of support it gives in the power modes?
View attachment 58862

I have a Turbo Levo Hardtail, which I'm very happy with on and off road. I assume the Mission Control app is the same for all Specialized ebikes. If I am doing a shorter ride I punk the Smart Control function by entering 2X (for example) the distance, height gain and/or battery remaining for my anticipated ride. The bike seamlessly doles out the boost (usually between eco and none) so I often forget that I'm riding an ebike. If I get tired on the way home, I turn Smart Control off and change the settings on the bike as I ride, though I could also change the parameters on Smart Control. fyi - for some stupid reason the bike has to be turned on before opening the app otherwise it won't connect.

 

[Mohawk3a]

I have a 2021 9.9 Xtr trek rail, 2019 sw levo and a 2021 sw levo sl. I’ve compared all 3 with identical strava rides in different power modes.

My sl on boost can’t keep up with my rail or levo in eco mode. I don’t care what the math is when you calculate the percentage of power delivered, the sl is slower. Another difference with the sl is that you have to maintain a higher pedal cadence to get the full assist.

I still love my sl. It’s a great bike! I love the way it handles. I just think it’s closer to a non e-bike than it is to the assist you can get with a rail or ff levo.

 

[Gutch]

I have a 2021 9.9 Xtr trek rail, 2019 sw levo and a 2021 sw levo sl. I’ve compared all 3 with identical strava rides in different power modes.

My sl on boost can’t keep up with my rail or levo in eco mode. I don’t care what the math is when you calculate the percentage of power delivered, the sl is slower. Another difference with the sl is that you have to maintain a higher pedal cadence to get the full assist.

I still love my sl. It’s a great bike! I love the way it handles. I just think it’s closer to a non e-bike than it is to the assist you can get with a rail or ff levo.

Nice bike collection! I went from an Orbea Rise to a Trek Rail 2021XT as I missed the weight and feel of the FF. Maybe I’m one of few that chose the other way?!!

 

[Mohawk3a]

Nice bike collection! I went from an Orbea Rise to a Trek Rail 2021XT as I missed the weight and feel of the FF. Maybe I’m one of few that chose the other way?!!

Thanks! Our rails are great bikes!
I upgraded the shock and fork on my ff levo. I will put an fox 38 fork and x2 shock on my sl when parts become available.
I won’t upgrade anything on 9.9 rail. I love the way these rails are spec’d from factory. I also love the tour mode on the Bosch motor. In tour mode I can do 25 miles and 4000 feet elevation with a full battery. Great workout for my fitness level.

 

[CjP]

I have a 2021 9.9 Xtr trek rail, 2019 sw levo and a 2021 sw levo sl. I’ve compared all 3 with identical strava rides in different power modes.

My sl on boost can’t keep up with my rail or levo in eco mode. I don’t care what the math is when you calculate the percentage of power delivered, the sl is slower. Another difference with the sl is that you have to maintain a higher pedal cadence to get the full assist.

I still love my sl. It’s a great bike! I love the way it handles. I just think it’s closer to a non e-bike than it is to the assist you can get with a rail or ff levo.

What are the power settings in each bike as I’ve had a very different experience.
Two Kenevo’s I ride and I all have the same settings
Eco 30/100
Trail 60/100
Turbo 100/100

They both stay out of Eco as I’m always on their tale otherwise (me turbo on the SL)
Even in trail they’re selecting turbo by the end of a long ride.
Obviously there may be some differences between us but we’re all pretty similar fitness levels.

I do agree about it being closer to a normal mtb though, has just the right amount of power.
I wouldn’t sacrifice 1 kg for more power.

 

[Ridill66]

Good Damn, I have the same Problem... Changing my mind every 1h. SL or FF Levo?

I am 73kg used to be 98kg 2019, then I did buy a Scott E-Genius tuned 700 from 2018 and Cycled almost every day. I live in Switzerland, all I can ride is up. During the Winter i started to ride on Zwift, did buy a road bike last year, and finished my first Century ride this summer 100 miles. my FTP is around 250W. Last Summer I did ride the Ebike in Eco only this had the Steps 8000 Motor, max Torque is 70NM no Idea what it is in Eco mode. One day I was riding with a friend and after the Ebike ride, I jumped on Zwift because I did feel I had to exercise more. I can get a Levo Expert for 20% Off or the SL for 25% Off the SL would be upgrades to XT Breaks 200mm Rotors and 52-10T Cassette and Range extender.

How many meters in elevation do you think I can get in Turbo out of it?

What shall I get?

I got my answer the battery lasts longer then i did. Akku with range extender @49% did 1400m and 31km i think.

 

[Mohawk3a]

What are the power settings in each bike as I’ve had a very different experience.
Two Kenevo’s I ride and I all have the same settings
Eco 30/100
Trail 60/100
Turbo 100/100

They both stay out of Eco as I’m always on their tale otherwise (me turbo on the SL)
Even in trail they’re selecting turbo by the end of a long ride.
Obviously there may be some differences between us but we’re all pretty similar fitness levels.

I do agree about it being closer to a normal mtb though, has just the right amount of power.
I wouldn’t sacrifice 1 kg for more power.

On my levo I have my eco set up at 35/35. If I put my eco at 35/100 I could crush the strava times I get with my sl on boost. If I turn the eco power down on my levo to 25/25, I will get similar strava times as my sl on boost.

The sl can can hang on flat terrain and and pull away when pedaling after the motor cuts out, but when climbing the sl is at a pretty solid disadvantage. Like I said, I put my ff levo at 25/25 to get the same strava times as my sl on boost.

 

[Mohawk3a]

What are the power settings in each bike as I’ve had a very different experience.
Two Kenevo’s I ride and I all have the same settings
Eco 30/100
Trail 60/100
Turbo 100/100

They both stay out of Eco as I’m always on their tale otherwise (me turbo on the SL)
Even in trail they’re selecting turbo by the end of a long ride.
Obviously there may be some differences between us but we’re all pretty similar fitness levels.

I do agree about it being closer to a normal mtb though, has just the right amount of power.
I wouldn’t sacrifice 1 kg for more power.

Maybe the kenevo is a bit slower than a levo being that it had 27.5’s and weighs 5-7 lbs more. I haven’t ridden a kenevo except for around the parking lot at my lbs, so I wouldn’t know.

 

[CjP]

On my levo I have my eco set up at 35/35. If I put my eco at 35/100 I could crush the strava times I get with my sl on boost. If I turn the eco power down on my levo to 25/25, I will get similar strava times as my sl on boost.

The sl can can hang on flat terrain and and pull away when pedaling after the motor cuts out, but when climbing the sl is at a pretty solid disadvantage. Like I said, I put my ff levo at 25/25 to get the same strava times as my sl on boost.

So your saying 25% of 90nm and around 720w with 25% rider assist is equal to 100% of 35nm with around

On my levo I have my eco set up at 35/35. If I put my eco at 35/100 I could crush the strava times I get with my sl on boost. If I turn the eco power down on my levo to 25/25, I will get similar strava times as my sl on boost.

The sl can can hang on flat terrain and and pull away when pedaling after the motor cuts out, but when climbing the sl is at a pretty solid disadvantage. Like I said, I put my ff levo at 25/25 to get the same strava times as my sl on boost.

The numbers don’t add up in my head so unless there is something wrong with your SL I am stumped.
There is no way any of my FF ebike mates (on eco) can lose me (on turbo). Bosch, Shimano or Brose.

 

[Mohawk3a]

So your saying 25% of 90nm and around 720w with 25% rider assist is equal to 100% of 35nm with around

The numbers don’t add up in my head so unless there is something wrong with your SL I am stumped.
There is no way any of my FF ebike mates (on eco) can lose me (on turbo). Bosch, Shimano or Brose.

Im on the 3rd motor in my ff levo and 2nd motor in my sl. Same results. Rather than compare yourself to a buddy, I would try timing yourself on any sort of climb with decent elevation. Btw, if you have your eco at 35/100 on a ff levo, your actually getting 90nm. I’m not sure how that’s even comparable to 35 nm on the sl.

The max torque doesn’t necessarily determine how much assist you receive. Best example would be comparing the shimano ep8 to the gen 4 Bosch. Both have 85nm but the ep8 is definitely slower up hill.

 

[CjP]

All good mate, not really interested in times, was just sharing my experiences with SL v FF.
As long as I’m smiling on the way up there’s enough torque for me.