Replacement for Kenevo

[Swissrider]

I have a 2018 Kenevo. I live in the Alps and for where I ride the Kenevo looks after me very well. It still works as well as the day I bought it and I'm approaching 5000k. The only issue is the battery. It now has about 90% health and it seldom charges to 100% - usually between 96 and 99%. Not surprisingly, I don't think I'm getting the same range as when it was new. My limit is about 1000m of ascent with about 20k. It is fantastic on descents with really good ohlins suspension and and upgraded air spring on the lyrik forks. It also climbs really well. However, going out with mates who have bikes with 650 or 700k batteries I'm struggling to keep going when they have plenty left in the tank. I read all the reviews of new bikes and none really strike me as a real game changer compared to what I've already got for where I ride. However, because of the battery issue I'm now looking to get another bike. I doubt I would get much for my Kenevo second hand so I'm thinking of keeping it for really tricky terrain and bike parks, or when a ride is not too long. Having a second ebike seems to be a good idea, especially these days when there can be massive delays waiting for parts. So, I'm looking for a bike to compliment, rather than replace my Kenevo. Something a bit lighter (which would not be hard!), probably less travel and a big battery for long rides. The Orbea rise would seem to fit the bill but I don't like not being able to remove the battery (essential for re-charging on route and not good in sub zero winter temperatures) and I'm not so keen on the Shimano motor or the reduced power, or the small back rotor. So, I'm thinking the new Trek rail, although to get the bigger battery I've got to go quite a long way over budget, or the latest generation allu Lev, which would be just about in budget. Both bikes get good reviews. Although I love my Brose motor, I'm on the second one (which I hope will last a long time as I took it to the UK to have it serviced by Performance Line bearings), I do worry about being let down by another Brose motor.

In either case, I'm in for a long wait. The delivery date quoted for the Levo was March 2023 and October 2022 (maybe) for the rail! So, no rush and plenty of time to make a decision (and to save up the not inconsiderable amount of money - a lot more than I paid for my Kenevo). I did test ride a Kenevo SL. I did like it downhill, easier to get into the air than my Kenevo, but it was 30% slower uphill. It was nearly twice the price of my Kenevo and certainly not twice as good. With the ascents around my way, it is pretty easy to use up a 500k battery so going for at least 700k makes sense and I like the look of the latest Bosch system which will hopefully be quite a while before it goes out of date.

 

[Bomble]

Mate of mine has the same bike/problem as you with the battery.
He bought one of those battery extenders which fits in the water bottle, works really well apart from the added weight

 

[Paulcon]

2nd hand bike prices are still bonkers mate, so you'd still get a decent amount for your kenevo, Rise seems the best of the SL options, but if you want a Kenevo replacement have a look at the Reign E+, I’ve just got one and it’s a monster truck and really well priced.

 

[cozzy]

Sell the gen1 & buy a gen2. Having owned both, the gen2 kenevo is so much better than the gen1 in every respect.
As a serial bike swapper its an amazing bike that I have no plans to change out anytime soon despite owning it for nearly 2 years, a record for me
Plus used 500wh batteries are cheap & plentiful for this gen, much less so with the previous model.

 

[Alexbn921]

Sell the gen1 & buy a gen2. Having owned both, the gen2 kenevo is so much better than the gen1 in every respect.
As a serial bike swapper its an amazing bike that I have no plans to change out anytime soon despite owning it for nearly 2 years, a record for me
Plus used 500wh batteries are cheap & plentiful for this gen, much less so with the previous model.

This.

Gen 2 is amazing and I have no intention of replacing it. Best bike made for my style of riding.

 

[Swissrider]

Thanks for replies. I did consider supplementary battery but bike would be really heavy and they are quite expensive. I think I would be reluctant to sell my Kenevo because of its long travel, excellent coil shock, money spent having the motor serviced (at Performance Line Bearings) and because it’s an old friend and we’ve shared many adventures together! It’s also useful to have a spare bike to lend to friends and if the main bike has to be off the road for a while. I’ve managed to track down a Trek rail 9.8xt which arrives in June but I’ve also been looking at the Scott Patron Eride 900 tuned. It seems the geometry is closer to my Kenevo. I’ve got quite a short upper body and don’t like to be too stretched out. My Kenevo has a reach of 431mm and the Patron is 445.8mm. The Rail is 452mm. I’d be interested in any opinions of the Patron. I did once test a Bold (which has been bought by Scott) and was impressed.

 

[R120]

SCOR

SCOR - Play the Mountains

www.scor-mtb.com

 

[High Rock Ruti]

Waiting on the Pole Voima, first long travel bike at 190. The turbo Levo will be back next week, with motor # 4. I've had a philosophical shift, transcendence really, I stopped caring about failed motors, instead of asking for the refund now I'm going to wait to have it offered when they decide they've had enough. I can't express just how happy I am that Pole switched to the Bosch drive prior to releasing the bike, trying to get third parties to warranty a bike they didn't sell me seems like a forced march. There is finally an owner review of the Pole Voima, on YouTube, a very experienced rider, he loves it.....or is it the "honeymoon"? You all have me curious to try a newer Kenevo, why not have different Specialized EMTB.....WITH MOTOR PROBLEMS?

Warm Regards

Ruti

 

[brizi2003]

I have a 2018 Kenevo. I live in the Alps and for where I ride the Kenevo looks after me very well. It still works as well as the day I bought it and I'm approaching 5000k. The only issue is the battery. It now has about 90% health and it seldom charges to 100% - usually between 96 and 99%. Not surprisingly, I don't think I'm getting the same range as when it was new. My limit is about 1000m of ascent with about 20k. It is fantastic on descents with really good ohlins suspension and and upgraded air spring on the lyrik forks. It also climbs really well. However, going out with mates who have bikes with 650 or 700k batteries I'm struggling to keep going when they have plenty left in the tank. I read all the reviews of new bikes and none really strike me as a real game changer compared to what I've already got for where I ride. However, because of the battery issue I'm now looking to get another bike. I doubt I would get much for my Kenevo second hand so I'm thinking of keeping it for really tricky terrain and bike parks, or when a ride is not too long. Having a second ebike seems to be a good idea, especially these days when there can be massive delays waiting for parts. So, I'm looking for a bike to compliment, rather than replace my Kenevo. Something a bit lighter (which would not be hard!), probably less travel and a big battery for long rides. The Orbea rise would seem to fit the bill but I don't like not being able to remove the battery (essential for re-charging on route and not good in sub zero winter temperatures) and I'm not so keen on the Shimano motor or the reduced power, or the small back rotor. So, I'm thinking the new Trek rail, although to get the bigger battery I've got to go quite a long way over budget, or the latest generation allu Lev, which would be just about in budget. Both bikes get good reviews. Although I love my Brose motor, I'm on the second one (which I hope will last a long time as I took it to the UK to have it serviced by Performance Line bearings), I do worry about being let down by another Brose motor.

In either case, I'm in for a long wait. The delivery date quoted for the Levo was March 2023 and October 2022 (maybe) for the rail! So, no rush and plenty of time to make a decision (and to save up the not inconsiderable amount of money - a lot more than I paid for my Kenevo). I did test ride a Kenevo SL. I did like it downhill, easier to get into the air than my Kenevo, but it was 30% slower uphill. It was nearly twice the price of my Kenevo and certainly not twice as good. With the ascents around my way, it is pretty easy to use up a 500k battery so going for at least 700k makes sense and I like the look of the latest Bosch system which will hopefully be quite a while before it goes out of date.

I still own a 2018 Kenevo and like you have really formed a bond with the bike despite a battery failure in the first 1000 miles and several motor changes and recently a motor service by Performance Line Bearings, as its now out of warranty. It's now coming up to 6000 miles and I've started thinking of what would be a possible replacement. My concerns are the same as yours about the Brose motor - but it is lovely when its working! The new Levo geometry is very close the 2018 Kenevo except it uses a mullet wheel size. The Trek Rail was also on my shortlist. I think the Bosch probably is the best motor (power and reliability) and you can also tune the power settings like with Specialized (I think). But they are all so much more expensive these days that I've decided just to continue with my Kenevo for now. Cost of replacement at the minute far exceeds anything I need to replace - I'm talking drivetrain, possibly wheels & forks in the near future. I don't really notice the reduced battery range on most of my rides but have the feeling that my battery isn't as fresh as it used to be. You could always buy a new battery - quite expensive but much cheaper than a new bike! The Kenevo really is a great bike that can turn its hand to many types of riding - but I am rather biased! You have some hard choices ahead!

 

[mastakilla]

I would go for the Rail 9.8 XT and bump the travel 10mm front and rear. I like that Voima too but there are no reviews or anything out yet and its more travel than it sounds like you want but that is the other thing I would consider. I dont think I would even consider anything but bosch at the moment and definitely not shimano but thats just me.

 

[1oldfart]

I agree with post # 3

 

[Ebikes-Unlimited]

Have a look at the Trek Rail - fantastic alternative

 

[Swissrider]

I would go for the Rail 9.8 XT and bump the travel 10mm front and rear. I like that Voima too but there are no reviews or anything out yet and its more travel than it sounds like you want but that is the other thing I would consider. I dont think I would even consider anything but bosch at the moment and definitely not shimano but thats just me.

How would you bump up the travel?

 

[Kingerz]

I have your bike too and got a Trance eMTB to 'replace it' but ended up keeping both. It's a bit less agile with 29 wheels but otherwise pretty similar in some ways. It goes much further though. Much.

You say you had no problems but are on the second motor?

My Kenevo showed 100% battery health for years even when it was clearly eroding. Specialized seem to do this (fake it) so when it starts saying it's less that 100% health, you are looking at rapid degradation. I get about 22 to 28km on my 2018 Kenevo.
I have a blog featuring both bikes in Australia if you are interested at Best eMTB rides in Victoria

 

[Swissrider]

I didn’t actually say I’ve had no problems, but you’re right, I have had to change the motor. It didn’t let me down, but started to make a loud clicking when the motor was hot. I recorded the noise and my LBS sent this to Specialized who agreed that the motor needed replacing. This was during Covid so there were a few delays but that was no one‘s fault. I also have an ebike with a Bosch motor and have tried many others and in my opinion the Brose is the most natural and by far the quietest. It’s just a pity that there seem to have been so many problems and there has to be a lingering doubt that they have not all been resolved. Pete from Performance Line Bearings has written that the vast majority of motors he is sent to fix are damaged from water ingress, some of which is due to careless washing. In some ways it seems ridiculous to make a mountain bike which can’t be ridden in the wet but this is probably a mainly U.K. problem. I’m lucky living in the Alps as I never need to ride in the wet or even in wet conditions. If I did live in the U.K, I would take my bike from new straight to PFLB and have it “waterproofed”.

 

[Swissrider]

I still own a 2018 Kenevo and like you have really formed a bond with the bike despite a battery failure in the first 1000 miles and several motor changes and recently a motor service by Performance Line Bearings, as its now out of warranty. It's now coming up to 6000 miles and I've started thinking of what would be a possible replacement. My concerns are the same as yours about the Brose motor - but it is lovely when its working! The new Levo geometry is very close the 2018 Kenevo except it uses a mullet wheel size. The Trek Rail was also on my shortlist. I think the Bosch probably is the best motor (power and reliability) and you can also tune the power settings like with Specialized (I think). But they are all so much more expensive these days that I've decided just to continue with my Kenevo for now. Cost of replacement at the minute far exceeds anything I need to replace - I'm talking drivetrain, possibly wheels & forks in the near future. I don't really notice the reduced battery range on most of my rides but have the feeling that my battery isn't as fresh as it used to be. You could always buy a new battery - quite expensive but much cheaper than a new bike! The Kenevo really is a great bike that can turn its hand to many types of riding - but I am rather biased! You have some hard choices ahead!

So, you are my mountain biking twin! I couldn’t agree more about the 2018 Kenevo being a great bike. It should be regarded in future years as a classic. luckily, I don’t need to buy a new battery because I can borrow the battery from my wife’s Levo. It’s a bit heavy to carry but I’ve got an EVOC pack which takes the battery and is pretty comfortable. So, I’m fine for the moment and as I said in my original post I’m looking for a bike to compliment my Kenevo rather than find an equivalent. The one area in which there has been significant progress is in range and as some magazines have pointed out we may have reached maximum battery size (with the limitations of weight and length) with current technology or maybe have gone too far as the changes in geometry (to accommodate longer down tubes) are not really for better performance (despite the claims) but to fit the longer batteries in to the frame. Nevertheless, we now have good performing bikes that have 50% more range than any bike when I bought mine four years ago and that is mainly why I’m looking for a new bike. I think I’ve boiled it down to a Trek 980 XT or a Scott Patron tuned. Very similar in many ways. The Scott hasn’t had to increase the reach so much (which concerns me as I have a short body) in medium size by situating the battery lower than the Trek but the Scott has some unnecessary gadgets such as a lockout.

 

[brizi2003]

So, you are my mountain biking twin! I couldn’t agree more about the 2018 Kenevo being a great bike. It should be regarded in future years as a classic. luckily, I don’t need to buy a new battery because I can borrow the battery from my wife’s Levo. It’s a bit heavy to carry but I’ve got an EVOC pack which takes the battery and is pretty comfortable. So, I’m fine for the moment and as I said in my original post I’m looking for a bike to compliment my Kenevo rather than find an equivalent. The one area in which there has been significant progress is in range and as some magazines have pointed out we may have reached maximum battery size (with the limitations of weight and length) with current technology or maybe have gone too far as the changes in geometry (to accommodate longer down tubes) are not really for better performance (despite the claims) but to fit the longer batteries in to the frame. Nevertheless, we now have good performing bikes that have 50% more range than any bike when I bought mine four years ago and that is mainly why I’m looking for a new bike. I think I’ve boiled it down to a Trek 980 XT or a Scott Patron tuned. Very similar in many ways. The Scott hasn’t had to increase the reach so much (which concerns me as I have a short body) in medium size by situating the battery lower than the Trek but the Scott has some unnecessary gadgets such as a lockout.

Hello brother! My vote goes to the Trek - looks proper beefy and all the parts are easily accessible for maintenance and I love the Trek Black/Marigold to Red fade colour, Dark Prismatic/Trek Black - pretty cool too! The Scott Patron looks good, but I'm not a fan of hiding everything away as it just makes maintenance a pain and makes the remote lock out a necessity due to limited access on the rear shock. I ride a large Kenevo and the reach and stack are virtually identical to the Medium Trek Rail but the top tube is about 1" shorter. In theory, that means the standing position should feel familiar but the seated position might feel a bit cramped. Compared to the Large Kenevo the geometry of the Scott Medium is a bit odd - 10mm shorter reach but more than 20mm higher stack and 30mm shorter top tube. I see you're riding a Medium Kenevo so maybe small sizes in other bikes may be better? Ideally - you need to try for size.

 

[JP-NZ]

How would you bump up the travel?

170mm Air shaft or Damper upgrade in the fork and changing the rear thru shaft to 230x60 or 230x65 to increase travel 10-15mm

 

[Swissrider]

Hello brother! My vote goes to the Trek - looks proper beefy and all the parts are easily accessible for maintenance and I love the Trek Black/Marigold to Red fade colour, Dark Prismatic/Trek Black - pretty cool too! The Scott Patron looks good, but I'm not a fan of hiding everything away as it just makes maintenance a pain and makes the remote lock out a necessity due to limited access on the rear shock. I ride a large Kenevo and the reach and stack are virtually identical to the Medium Trek Rail but the top tube is about 1" shorter. In theory, that means the standing position should feel familiar but the seated position might feel a bit cramped. Compared to the Large Kenevo the geometry of the Scott Medium is a bit odd - 10mm shorter reach but more than 20mm higher stack and 30mm shorter top tube. I see you're riding a Medium Kenevo so maybe small sizes in other bikes may be better? Ideally - you need to try for size.

Thanks for info. What I want is the closest to my medium size Kenevo, and you’re right - the only way to really tell is to try them, preferably side to side with my bike. According to the size charts, at my height 5’7” I am a medium in both bikes. The problem is that none of the local shops have a medium Scott or Trail and they seem to have little idea when they will arrive - June the earliest. Just have to be patient. In the meantime, I’m loving my Kenevo so no real worries.

 

[Swissrider]

170mm Air shaft or Damper upgrade in the fork and changing the rear thru shaft to 230x60 or 230x65 to increase travel 10-15mm

Thanks for info. I wonder how much difference I would notice between my present 180mm travel (with super plush Ohlins coil shock) to a bike with 160mm travel. TBH, I sometimes ride my wife’s 2018 Levo which only has 140mm of travel and this works really well. On my own bike, I’ve tunes the Lyrik fork so that it doesn’t quite bottom out on a big jump which means most of the time I guess I’ll only use about 140mm of travel. There seems to be a bit of a trend away from longer travel bikes but I think that this is partially due to far more man made flowing tracks with lots of tight turns and jumps rather than really bumpy rock gardens really rooty terrain where it seems long travel can really help

 

[Swissrider]

Went to a shop today because they told me they had a Scott Patron in medium but when I got there they said it was still in its box and they won’t get it out until someone wants to buy it. Anyway, they had a carbon Patron on test, size small and I tried this. Although size small, it felt fine so now I’m really confused between choosing a medium or small. I’m 5’7” and according to the Scott size guide I could ride either a small or medium, with a slight bias towards medium. Until I got my medium Kenevo, I always rode size small analogue bikes. The shop said they would put the medium together to try if I committed to buying either the small or medium after tying both! The 900 model with the alu back end is 1000 francs cheaper than the full model and the mechanic said he thought there was very little difference between them. For either, it’s a frightening wad of cash, more than my 650cc Suzuki motorbike! If I want a medium full carbon Patron, the delivery date is November. I’m glad I’ve got a decent bike and not too much in a hurry.

 

[1oldfart]

Went to a shop today because they told me they had a Scott Patron in medium but when I got there they said it was still in its box and they won’t get it out until someone wants to buy it. Anyway, they had a carbon Patron on test, size small and I tried this. Although size small, it felt fine so now I’m really confused between choosing a medium or small. I’m 5’7” and according to the Scott size guide I could ride either a small or medium, with a slight bias towards medium. Until I got my medium Kenevo, I always rode size small analogue bikes. The shop said they would put the medium together to try if I committed to buying either the small or medium after tying both! The 900 model with the alu back end is 1000 francs cheaper than the full model and the mechanic said he thought there was very little difference between them. For either, it’s a frightening wad of cash, more than my 650cc Suzuki motorbike! If I want a medium full carbon Patron, the delivery date is November. I’m glad I’ve got a decent bike and not too much in a hurry.

I prefer smaller bike beause it is easier to contol them. I am tall and i ride small.
If need be you can put a longuer stem.
Basically we should never look at any sticker. My present Ebike is a small and i love it.
First i tried that bike in medium and it was obvious i needed a small.
Trust your feelings not what a saleperson or manufacturer think.

 

[Swissrider]

I’ve had a bit of a rethink. I pulled the plug on the Petron that I was going to reserve, much to the chagrin of the salesman in the bike shop. He was pushing me very hard to put a 500 Swiss franc deposit on a bike I hadn’t tried and is not due to arrive until July. I think that the pressure was one of the things that put me off. Although I think the Patron looks a great bike and if I didn’t already own a Kenevo I might go for it, but I think it is too similar. I’m now looking at the Orbea Rise H15. This is getting very good reviews and recently got Best Buy award in emountainbiking magazine. I hadn’t realised that the alu version of the Rise has a 540w battery (instead of 360w battery in the carbon models), bigger than my Kenevo battery. With the reduced torque of the motor and considerably lighter weight of the bike I should have a much better range than the my Kenevo. I also have the option of buying a range extender. A nice bonus is that I will have to spend a lot less. I’ve got to try out the Rise and see how I feel about the reduced power but I ride my Kenevo mainly in trail (adjusted to 60%), which should be about the same as the Rise in boost.

So, I should end up with one bike which is great for steep, rocky technical terrain and bike parks and another bike which will be much more like an analogue bike in terms of being playful and fun in more mellow terrain and with a big enough range for big mountain days in the Alps. Well, that‘s the theory, I’ve just got to try and track one down. I think my only real concern is not being able to remove the battery. No problem at home, but when away in hotels or trying to recharge on route, this could be a bit of a pain. I‘m going to make a very lightweight extension lead!