POLL: Do you want to be able to derestrict your Amflow PL?

[skismith]

One for @Amflow_Support to watch.

Following the recent software update that has removed the option to derestrict/remove the speed limit on the Amflow PL - Please vote to show whether this is a feature you would like restored?

Derestricting the bike is legal for use on private land and there are even race series in the UK allowing derestricted bikes: e.g Pedalhounds – Multi Stage MTB – EMTB Enduro

Thanks all.

 

[Bndit]

Buy a Stark Varg, 80 horsepower, no restrictions and you don`t even need to pedal.

 

[irie]

One for @Amflow_Support to watch.

Following the recent software update that has removed the option to derestrict/remove the speed limit on the Amflow PL - Please vote to show whether this is a feature you would like restored?

Derestricting the bike is legal for use on private land and there are even race series in the UK allowing derestricted bikes: e.g Pedalhounds – Multi Stage MTB – EMTB Enduro

Thanks all.

At a guess Amflow "removed the option to derestrict/remove the speed limit on the Amflow PL" to ensure that it/they remained compliant with UK pedelec laws.

EAPC standards and legal requirements

www.gov.uk

 

[skismith]

At a guess Amflow "removed the option to derestrict/remove the speed limit on the Amflow PL" to ensure that it/they remained compliant with UK pedelec laws.

EAPC standards and legal requirements

www.gov.uk

From that site: “E-bikes with …increased speed (with motor assistance not cutting out at 15.5mph) cannot be used legally as bicycles anywhere on land accessible by the public; when riding on private land you would need permission from the landowner”.

 

[Polar]

"for use on private land"

 

[irie]

From that site: “E-bikes with …increased speed (with motor assistance not cutting out at 15.5mph) cannot be used legally as bicycles anywhere on land accessible by the public; when riding on private land you would need permission from the landowner”.

Allowing bikes to exceed the pedelec speed limit would mean that they could not be sold as pedelecs.

Is the largest market for use only on private land or is the largest market for use as legally certified pedelecs?

Your call.

 

[steve_sordy]

At a guess Amflow "removed the option to derestrict/remove the speed limit on the Amflow PL" to ensure that it/they remained compliant with UK pedelec laws.

....

Not just the UK, but the whole of Europe.

 

[iXi]

It's not coming back regardless of the poll. If you want to derestrict you'll have to wait for an aftermarket company to do it. It's there for nearly every other brand so it's only a matter of time.

 

[Mad_Angler1]

This should all be very simple. All EMTB should be sold restricted from the factory and compliant however users should have the option to remove that restriction on request. Either via updating software or via a settings with no penalty on warranty.

There are a number of industries where dedicated firmware is used on a de restricted product and once done you can't go back to factory spec and it's even listed with the manufacture.

At the point of de restriction users should agree they are only going to use the bike where they are legally allowed to and understand the manufacturer takes no responsibility for their actions.

It's manufacturers job to sell products that comply with local laws however they don't own the products once you buy them and they also should not be held bent on ensuring compliance once it's sold.

It's complete madness that it's accepted that manufactures are with in their right to dictate what you can do with the product you have purchased and even go as far as bricking your bike Like Bosch.

There are completely legitimate reasons to derestrict and it's down to the local laws to deal with people who don't follow them.

Would you buy a car that was factory limited to 70Mph that did not have any option of bypass or a TV that would not go above the recomended safe sound levels.

Next minute the bike won't let you ride unless you have a helmet on. People are responsible for their own actions.

Amflow if you want to expand your reach and gain more users give people the option to choose or opt out after purchase as mentioned above.

 

[Polar]

That will never happen, because Bosch was first and only after pressure from the authorities so that they could cooperate on regulation and safety after Bosch made the decision sales mooned

 

[Bengy22]

This should all be very simple. All EMTB should be sold restricted from the factory and compliant however users should have the option to remove that restriction on request. Either via updating software or via a settings with no penalty on warranty.

Completely agree with everything you say, really shocking the amount of people that are completely ok with letting companies dictate what you can and can't do with your own personal property. In the USA I can see people wanting to unlock the speed to class 3 legal 28mph, it really shock be has hard as agreeing to a few things in a menu at most.

 

[luna87824]

The one great thing about Shimano is their class 3 EP801!!

 

[Ark]

Completely agree with everything you say, really shocking the amount of people that are completely ok with letting companies dictate what you can and can't do with your own personal property. In the USA I can see people wanting to unlock the speed to class 3 legal 28mph, it really shock be has hard as agreeing to a few things in a menu at most.

all cars should be locked to motorway speeds, regular push bikes should have gear restriction.
then it makes sense, but we still need to ban roller skates and skate boards

 

[Bndit]

This should all be very simple. All EMTB should be sold restricted from the factory and compliant however users should have the option to remove that restriction on request. Either via updating software or via a settings with no penalty on warranty.

There are a number of industries where dedicated firmware is used on a de restricted product and once done you can't go back to factory spec and it's even listed with the manufacture.

At the point of de restriction users should agree they are only going to use the bike where they are legally allowed to and understand the manufacturer takes no responsibility for their actions.

It's manufacturers job to sell products that comply with local laws however they don't own the products once you buy them and they also should not be held bent on ensuring compliance once it's sold.

It's complete madness that it's accepted that manufactures are with in their right to dictate what you can do with the product you have purchased and even go as far as bricking your bike Like Bosch.

There are completely legitimate reasons to derestrict and it's down to the local laws to deal with people who don't follow them.

Would you buy a car that was factory limited to 70Mph that did not have any option of bypass or a TV that would not go above the recomended safe sound levels.

Next minute the bike won't let you ride unless you have a helmet on. People are responsible for their own actions.

Amflow if you want to expand your reach and gain more users give people the option to choose or opt out after purchase as mentioned above.

It`s totally madness that there are laws! People should have right to do what ever they want, fight the power!

 

[nrgbod]

Does anyone one know what firmware version new Amflows are being delivered with now, after the clamp down?
If they come with V00.08.0306 or if it's possible to upgrade to 08.0306 before upgrading to v09... then happy days.

I haven't been able to turn my bike off for a few weeks without removing the screen.
I'm thinking I might have to have the screen replaced and this will maybe loose my current region setting.
I think I'd rather unscrew the faulty screen from the bike after every ride rather than go back to 15mph.
My only hope is if the region settings are stored in the motor not the screen.

 

[irie]

Completely agree with everything you say, really shocking the amount of people that are completely ok with letting companies dictate what you can and can't do with your own personal property. In the USA I can see people wanting to unlock the speed to class 3 legal 28mph, it really shock be has hard as agreeing to a few things in a menu at most.

It's a question of what you can do with your private property on public property such as public highways.. You do not now have the right to drive your car at over the speed limit on public highways. Exactly why do you believe that you should have the right to do exactly as you wish with a pedelec on other than private land?

 

[skismith]

It's a question of what you can do with your private property on public property such as public highways.. You do not now have the right to drive your car at over the speed limit on public highways. Exactly why do you believe that you should have the right to do exactly as you wish with a pedelec on other than private land?

Whilst very off topic re: the specific private land use case in the poll, we all have the freedom to drive our cars over the speed limit- but there will be consequences if it goes wrong/you get caught.

Begs the question of risk when comparing ebikes to cars (as you did), speeds involved etc… and why ebikes are such a special case that manufacturers have to regulate this for riders, the authorities etc.

Unless of course your car is automatically speed limited at all times or you never, ever exceed the speed limit?

 

[irie]

Whilst very off topic re: the specific private land use case in the poll, we all have the freedom to drive our cars over the speed limit- but there will be consequences if it goes wrong/you get caught.

Begs the question of risk when comparing ebikes to cars (as you did), speeds involved etc… and why ebikes are such a special case that manufacturers have to regulate this for riders, the authorities etc.

Unless of course your car is automatically speed limited at all times or you never, ever exceed the speed limit?

If the speed of pedelecs were derestricted they would then become subject to the same licencing, road tax licencing, insurance, and MOT laws etc. as other motor cycles.

 

[Mad_Angler1]

It`s totally madness that there are laws! People should have right to do what ever they want, fight the power!

No the laws are absolutely fine. However there are no laws preventing you going beyond the limit on private land so as the owner there should be an option.

This is not some "I want my freedom" nonsense it's about what's reasonable.

If the speed of pedelecs were derestricted they would then become subject to the same licencing, road tax licencing, insurance, and MOT laws etc. as other motor cycles.

But again this is all really simple.

All bikes sold remain compliant as they are today with restriction in place and owners can apply to deresrict with the manufacture accepting some basic terms and conditions.

There is no good reason for this to affect warranty and more than anything it's simply a box ticking exercise that allows them to continue to sell the bikes compliant but also give the user the choice.

It's no business of Bosch, DJI, Shimano or anyone else what I intend to do with my bike and it's my responsibility to remain with in the law at all times. It's not their job to force compliance.

People have become way to accepting of over reaching manufacture behavor and regulation of what we do.

This is again a classic example of punishing legitimate users while the AliExpress and Chinese imported cheap bikes and scooters are everywhere on the streets doing what they want with no restriction.

The guy who buys a 6k EMTB is not the problem.

 

[luna87824]

No the laws are absolutely fine. However there are no laws preventing you going beyond the limit on private land so as the owner there should be an option.

This is not some "I want my freedom" nonsense it's about what's reasonable.

But again this is all really simple.

All bikes sold remain compliant as they are today with restriction in place and owners can apply to deresrict with the manufacture accepting some basic terms and conditions.

There is no good reason for this to affect warranty and more than anything it's simply a box ticking exercise that allows them to continue to sell the bikes compliant but also give the user the choice.

It's no business of Bosch, DJI, Shimano or anyone else what I intend to do with my bike and it's my responsibility to remain with in the law at all times. It's not their job to force compliance.

People have become way to accepting of over reaching manufacture behavor and regulation of what we do.

This is again a classic example of punishing legitimate users while the AliExpress and Chinese imported cheap bikes and scooters are everywhere on the streets doing what they want with no restriction.

The guy who buys a 6k EMTB is not the problem.

Let me fix one sentence........... People have become way to accepting of over reaching government bearcats!!

 

[Bengy22]

It's a question of what you can do with your private property on public property such as public highways.. You do not now have the right to drive your car at over the speed limit on public highways. Exactly why do you believe that you should have the right to do exactly as you wish with a pedelec on other than private land?

I fully disagree with that, this isn't at all about what you can do on public highways. This is about what you can do with your personal property. If that's what it was about then why doesn't DJI offer a class 3 mode aka 28mph limiter, still fully legal in the USA. I'm not advocating for doing whatever you want on public land, but I do find it ridiculous that people would rather have these companies completely lock down and limit functions vs just putting the responsibility on the user.

I find this no different then offering a new car with a 65mph speed limiter. But even if I beg to the company showing proof I have roads near me with a 85mph limit or that I will but using the car on a race track they still will not remove that limiter.

 

[Weeksy]

No the laws are absolutely fine. However there are no laws preventing you going beyond the limit on private land so as the owner there should be an option.

This is not some "I want my freedom" nonsense it's about what's reasonable.

But again this is all really simple.

All bikes sold remain compliant as they are today with restriction in place and owners can apply to deresrict with the manufacture accepting some basic terms and conditions.

There is no good reason for this to affect warranty and more than anything it's simply a box ticking exercise that allows them to continue to sell the bikes compliant but also give the user the choice.

It's no business of Bosch, DJI, Shimano or anyone else what I intend to do with my bike and it's my responsibility to remain with in the law at all times. It's not their job to force compliance.

People have become way to accepting of over reaching manufacture behavor and regulation of what we do.

This is again a classic example of punishing legitimate users while the AliExpress and Chinese imported cheap bikes and scooters are everywhere on the streets doing what they want with no restriction.

The guy who buys a 6k EMTB is not the problem.

Out of interest, how many people have access to a chunk of private land ?
Do you ? If so, how big is it ?

I'd guess we're talking fractions of a percent of people in the UK who have access to a private woodland.

 

[skismith]

Out of interest, how many people have access to a chunk of private land ?
Do you ? If so, how big is it ?

I'd guess we're talking fractions of a percent of people in the UK who have access to a private woodland.

Some do, some don’t….. how many people actually track day their car that can exceed the speed limit?

For those that don’t (in the UK) have access to private land, here’s 5 events allowing derestricted bikes with landowner permission: MTB – EMTB Enduro 2025 race dates and venues – Pedalhounds

The questing on the poll is very clear, this is about private land use.

 

[Weeksy]

Some do, some don’t….. how many people actually track day their car that can exceed the speed limit?

For those that don’t (in the UK) have access to private land, here’s 5 events allowing derestricted bikes with landowner permission: MTB – EMTB Enduro 2025 race dates and venues – Pedalhounds

The questing on the poll is very clear, this is about private land use.

So there's 5 possible days... which lets be honest most people won't actually enter as not many race.. The Pedalhounds series is good but it's not exactly setting the world on-fire in terms of tracks and or entries.

In the last Pedalhounds there were 25 people who rode in total in the non-restricted class out of 216 entries.

Results | 2024 Pedalhounds MTB/E-MTB Enduro round 5 at Canada Heights

Full results from 2024 Pedalhounds MTB/E-MTB Enduro round 5 at Canada Heights. Click into any rider to see their event history and any tagged photos they have.

www.rootsandrain.com

We all know that anyone who wants the Amflow deresticted is quite simply for everyday use, lets not kid ourselves here.

The post may specify private land, but come on, lets be serious for a moment.

 

[iXi]

I derestricted my levo, I have no private land. It was for everyday use. I'll do the same once they release something for the amflow but expecting the manufacturer to make it available is a stretch. The only time I miss going past 25 is when I'm riding to the trails, once I'm there I don't even notice.

 

[skismith]

So there's 5 possible days... which lets be honest most people won't actually enter as not many race.. The Pedalhounds series is good but it's not exactly setting the world on-fire in terms of tracks and or entries.

In the last Pedalhounds there were 25 people who rode in total in the non-restricted class out of 216 entries.

Results | 2024 Pedalhounds MTB/E-MTB Enduro round 5 at Canada Heights

Full results from 2024 Pedalhounds MTB/E-MTB Enduro round 5 at Canada Heights. Click into any rider to see their event history and any tagged photos they have.

www.rootsandrain.com

We all know that anyone who wants the Amflow deresticted is quite simply for everyday use, lets not kid ourselves here.

The post may specify private land, but come on, lets be serious for a moment.

Anyone can engage in whataboutery/people will…./ people might/once upon a time…

The poll has a specific question.

 

[Weeksy]

Anyone can engage in whataboutery/people will…./ people might/once upon a time…

The poll has a specific question.

LOL sure.

 

[Elvi$]

I believe Firmware downgrade will be possible. People have been doing it with their drones and simply requires downloading of the flash tool & official firmware.