Orbea wild fs 2020 battery options

[James7475]

Hi everyone.

I’ve just ordered the extra 500W frame battery and the frame bracket kit. Has anybody got this up and running yet? And does the extra battery come with a cable or does that need to be purchased too? (I’ve seen that they can be bought separately from wiggle etc).

Thanks for your time

 

[Gyre]

Hi James,

My frame brackets are still on backorder. As far as I know "klevtik" is the only member with the system up and running. The extra battery does *not* come with the dual battery wiring harness.

Thanks,
Neil

 

[James7475]

Hi James,

My frame brackets are still on backorder. As far as I know "klevtik" is the only member with the system up and running. The extra battery does *not* come with the dual battery wiring harness.

Thanks,
Neil

Thanks Neil

 

[James7475]

Reply from Orbea should this be of use to anyone ??

 

[Gyre]

Good to have a reference. I have my appointment to get the double battery kit installed tomorrow.

 

[Gyre]

Ok, I finally got the range extender installed. However, I'm having a problem that makes no sense. The frame/extender battery started at 29% and the main battery started at 70%. The extender battery stopped at 36% within a matter of minutes and the main battery kept on charging for several hours all the way to 89%. So right now I'm at 89/36 - The balance between the two batteries just got worse and worse.

Obviously it would be healthier for both batteries to come up to 80% more or less together, not have the main keep shooting for 100% and leaving the frame battery far behind. What gives?

 

[Micael]

Honestly it makes sense to me, the main battery is essentially always going to be on the bike, while the second battery is kind of optional and might not be taken to every trip since it can add unnecessary weight in some shorter trips, so at least for me this would be the ideal use case scenario, charge the main battery first, then charge the add-on battery second.

It might also be charger amperage related, not sure what charger you have, but most orbea wild fs come with the 2A charger, which is honestly quite a bit on the weak side, so if they went to charge both batteries side by side assuming 100% efficient charging it could take 15 hours, in real life more than that, so yeah there are definitely arguments to be made for going for main battery first. I am however curious if this behaviour would be different with the 6A charger, an ideal system might start to charge the main battery quite a bit more slowly towards the end and use the extra amperage to charge the secondary battery.

For battery life the most important thing is going to be the discharge, and that is where I would expect to see the system split the load between both batteries.

 

[Gyre]

I was honestly expecting it to prioritize the more discharged battery first, and then to alternate between them so they come up together.

What I'm seeing now is that it's charging the main to 91% and then charging the frame battery. That's not ideal in my opinion, but at least it's not pushing the main battery to 100% first. So, okay - not thrilled because 91% charge is going to be a little harder on the main battery, but it's not the end of the world.

 

[Micael]

At some point it might start to "trickle" charge both batteries at the same time.

With that being said I would like to point out even charging at full speed it is actually extremely slow for a lithium ion battery, the 625watts battery has about 16.7amps, so even with the most powerful 6amp charger, charging a 625W battery at full would make for about 0.35C charge rate, which is well, well, below what most lithium-ion batteries are charged at, it is basically lead acid battery levels (and even those can be charged faster at the start), and as seen by you the rate gets lower when the battery starts to get full, something I can confirm happens with a single battery with the 6amp charger, as it goes along it starts to charge slower and slower (as it should).
This was assuming you had the most powerful 6amp charger, if you have the 2amp charger then yeah that's more like 0.12C charging rate which falls even more below the standard charging rate of any battery type I can think of let alone lithium ion.

So yeah all around really, really don't think you have nothing to worry about regarding battery life of the way they are being charged here, could it theoretically be better for the battery if they were being charged simultaneous? Sure technically, but they are already being charged well below the standard and recommended safe rates for lithium ion batteries, so the difference from a real life perspective would probably be non-existent honestly.

Most damage to the battery cells will come in the discharge, and that is where a mixture of just having much higher capacity resulting in less deep discharges, and it being split between the batteries can have some very real benefits, and I would fully expect for the bosch system to draw between the 2 batteries somewhat equally, although probably more biased towards drawing from the main battery since that one should run cooler and be a longer battery in the first place.

 

[Gyre]

I just figured it should charge them in a more balanced way - not necessarily at the same time, but low one first, then alternating at 10% increments. That way if I wanted to bring the whole system up to 80% and stop there it would be very easy. C'est la vie.

On the discharge side, it appears to be more cautious in alignment with what you're saying. High battery discharges first, then it alternates between the two batteries in 5% increments.

1000+ Watt Hours is a hell of a lot of juice. I set out at roughly 92/70 yesterday, went 38.5 miles and 5000+ feet of climbing, and came back with 32/36 left in the tank, mostly using Eco with occasional hits of Tour. I did find it necessary to use Tour more often and for longer stints than I usually would to make up for the extra weight. There's no question, if you have the discipline to not lean on the motor too much, you can get one hell of a workout. I was personally running very low on steam and the bike had plenty to go.

One thing that's driving me nuts is that ever since the mount was installed, something is now rattling over bumps. Argh. Hopefully it's easy to find and fix.

 

[Zed]

Love to hear some thoughts on how it rides with the extended battery on..? For my use case it would be for extended shuttling when I got to parks/large trails further away - as opposed to for epic rides. So downhill handling would be important. Would it be worthwhile for this use case do you think?

 

[Gyre]

Love to hear some thoughts on how it rides with the extended battery on..? For my use case it would be for extended shuttling when I got to parks/large trails further away - as opposed to for epic rides. So downhill handling would be important. Would it be worthwhile for this use case do you think?

I think it would, but there are some caveats.

- On my last bike park trip, I didn't bother with the shuttle at all and just kept riding up and down all day. I probably did a few less runs, but I was riding nonstop and having fun both up and down. If you enjoy climbing with the eMTB enough, it's pretty damn nice to skip the shuttle and just keep riding.

- Handling over rocks and roots downhill was fine including on one of my favorite advanced runs. I rode it pretty much like any other bike. Aside from the considerations I've listed below, it was just a really good enduro bike that motors up the course with plenty of aplomb.

- Because the bike seems front-heavy, I'm not confident to jump off of rocks or drops like I usually would. I think it can be done fine in the right hands, but my gut feeling is that you can't be sloppy and get away with it as easily as you can on an acoustic bike. I went around the rocks I usually jump off of and just practiced a little on smaller things.

- When it comes to clearing big rocks for the hell of it, occasionally I scraped said rock against the bottom of the motor protector case. It sounds pretty awful, so I decided to try to pick lines that give the case more clearance. On my acoustic bikes, either I'd clean rocks of the same height or I'd slide on the Delrin bash guard.

- Bosch Eco mode and 1125Wh are seriously going to take you a long, long way.

 

[James7475]

Love to hear some thoughts on how it rides with the extended battery on..? For my use case it would be for extended shuttling when I got to parks/large trails further away - as opposed to for epic rides. So downhill handling would be important. Would it be worthwhile for this use case do you think?

It does take even more muscle to thrown around and is even more reluctant to leave the ground. It’s still a magic DH machine but I’d recommend getting an extra internal frame battery to reduce the weight and stashing it somewhere if you’re just shuttling. I’m only a novice/intermediate rider by the way ??

 

[jerry]

The mounting bracket can easily be found on Orbea's website. I think you also need an ABUS lock, and plastic covers.The wiring harnass seems a bit more difficult to find: Cable en Y batería dual Bosch | Comprar en EBIKE24.es and Cable en Y batería dual Bosch | Comprar en EBIKE24.es
Manual says it'd also require a software update, though other sites suggest the latest version of the firmware recognises the dual battery setup automatically.

 

[yolo_MTB]

Anybody in the US do this recently and have tips on where to get parts, or if the current fw requires dealer intervention or just works?

 

[yolo_MTB]

Do either of you have any idea if it would be a motor or battery firmware update? My dealer is saying I can do the update over the phone, which I suspect is wrong.

I am starting this install process. I got the kit, all the parts, etc. Before you do anything, you can take off the non drive side cover and you will have access to the plugs. You can unplug the power cable and plug in the Y cable, hook up one end to your existing cable and one to your new battery and see if the Kiox shows 2 batteries. If it only shows 1, you need the dealer anyway, so might as well have them do the job. If both are there, you are golden. Another tip, you need a Tork 40 Bit to drop the motor (3 bolts on each side), and also you do NOT have to remove the crank arms to drop the motor.

 

[yolo_MTB]

One other thing weight related that was pointed out in another forum... It appears you can run with either the frame mount or the inner frame battery, you don't have to run both at once. So if you are lapping, you can swap as needed. A nice bonus benefit. Or you can charge one up while you are out riding. Shit for that matter, you can just have a couple frame mount batteries and swap those super easy.

 

[yolo_MTB]

View attachment 30176

Do you know what specific bottle cage this is? Looking to get one for my ride. Guessing its a side load, like the specialized ones?

 

[Gyre]

Thanks @yolo_MTB . My dealer did the install last spring and it's working great. I can confirm that you can run solely on the extender, which is a nice option since it has a better weight/capacity ratio than the powertube. It's a bit more hassle than I can be bothered with since you have to remove the battery to charge it and removing and reinstalling the powertube can be more fiddly than I'd like. I've only run solely on the extender just once to see what it was like.

 

[yolo_MTB]

Thanks @yolo_MTB . My dealer did the install last spring and it's working great. I can confirm that you can run solely on the extender, which is a nice option since it has a better weight/capacity ratio than the powertube. It's a bit more hassle than I can be bothered with since you have to remove the battery to charge it and removing and reinstalling the powertube can be more fiddly than I'd like. I've only run solely on the extender just once to see what it was like.

Just putzing around town, the bike felt lighter for sure with the 400 Frame mount vs the 625 PowerTube. I am more about the power than the weight, but I would like to do a nice flowy trail wo/ the extra weight. Nice to know i have 400/625/1025 Options. And that I can easily use a bottle cage when not using an extender.

 

[PTB]

One other thing weight related that was pointed out in another forum... It appears you can run with either the frame mount or the inner frame battery, you don't have to run both at once. So if you are lapping, you can swap as needed. A nice bonus benefit. Or you can charge one up while you are out riding. Shit for that matter, you can just have a couple frame mount batteries and swap those super easy.

Hi, great tips on fitting the dual battery kit . As you now have the original built in frame charging socket and the additional charging socket that comes with the second battery mount, can you advise which charging port is used when both batteries on the bike? And if only the power tube is on the bike, which charging port would be used. Thanks, Phil

 

[yolo_MTB]

Hi, great tips on fitting the dual battery kit . As you now have the original built in frame charging socket and the additional charging socket that comes with the second battery mount, can you advise which charging port is used when both batteries on the bike? And if only the power tube is on the bike, which charging port would be used. Thanks, Phil

With just the power tube, I continue to only use the built in port. I need to get the firmware updated on the power pack as it throws a message when both are plugged in and I attempt to charge. (They work fine together riding). I just take off the power pack and charge it seperate. There is also a power port on the side of the powerpack mount (lower half) and I am not sure if that is for the power pack specifically, or if it would go to both. Rarely do I need both, so I just charge as needed. No regrets! and, the bike rides fine with both batteries, i really cant tell much of a difference.