Orbea Rise adjustable geometry 64-65.5?

[Dirtnvert]

Steep seat angles on an emrb arent as necessary. If its steep enough to accomodate the handling of the current slacker head angles along with the new fork offsets thats fine. I dont want my seat angle to be super steep like i have on my heavy enduro bike. The steep sa in that case is used for winching up steep climbs. If the bike is carrying any momentum , above just trying to turn over the cranks in winch mode, than a steep sa sux for moving the bike around and having a play finding lines. You dont need winch mode near as much with assist. I prefer my 75 degree seat angle in boost with the seat slammed finding fun lines on steep climbs. Its easier to be active on the bike with the seat out of the way. If the seat is up its because its not emtb super steep and only a moderate climb. Ill often pedal through stuff with the seat down 2 or 3 inches. Put the sear down that much and it makes the effective seat angle steeper. With assist im pedaling through stuff and want to be super active moving the bike around rather than looking for leg extension and time trial position so i can struggle to turn the cranks over. That position would be like wasting the attributes of the motor assist

 

[Zimmerframe]

Spreadsheet!!!

Spreadsheet(s) ... or Spead Sheeet ?

 

[Dirtnvert]

Spreadsheet(s) ... or Spead Sheeet ?

(S) there can never be enough!

 

[carlbiker]

Note that changing shock length changes the way the lever works. So the kinematic changes.
It amazes me how so many shops can sell a brand new bike and advise (sell) a ton of upgrades to it. Shocks and forks are bloody expensive.
the bike designers took a lot of time to optimise the stock model you know. It’s a popular bike - as it is. I’d try it.
Fox shocks are ok especially the X2. Nowhere near my EXT though. That’s a revaluation.
the Geometron guys ride pretty close geo to me and do plenty of long distance Xc just with lighter wheels. The Geometron philosophy is ONE BIKE. I think that’s right.
I do really enjoy the downward fast stuff but also tight singletrack in the woods and occasional long rides. Geometron designer Chris Porter believes all mtb should be 63 head and with a steep seat tube. My reach is 535mm (I’m 6’2”). It really feels amazing to be on a bike that fits. And steers so beautifully.
If they made the Specialized SL in S5 geo I’d be wanting that. As it is the Kenevo tempts me.

I’ve chatted with Chris the other day who’s at Mojo, nice guy. I’ll stick with the 29ers for now, it felt way more agile than my Wild which I’ve now sold, there are a couple tweaks I can to bring it down to 64.5 at least, maybe 64 and I’ll check how that feels.

The cost to service is the next thing I’m checking out, don’t fancy £300/year to keep a coil running okay tbh which I’ve only just discovered.

 

[carlbiker]

Spreadsheet!!!

Think zimmerbrain should make a spreadsheet for the amount of times a spreadsheet pun is made! ?

 

[Dirtnvert]

Think zimmerbrain should make a spreadsheet for the amount of times a spreadsheet pun is made! ?

Definitely. Im sure he's wotking ot on it and he'll post soon.

Im with you a bit on the coil thing too. A lot of these suspension systems are hard on coils then add in the extra weight of an emtb and the extra mileage/vert. The linkages with the shock yokes seem to be a prime offender. Blew up my jade pretty quick on my commie. Regilar service wouldve been $140 but it was over 200 needing a shaft and shaft bushing. Wouldnt be surprised if i blow it up again this summer. I shoild learn how to service it my self.My decoy doesnt have a yoke and i dont find the bike particularly flexy but blew my relatively new cane creek coil up pretty quick too. The cc coil i had on my banshee was bomber for a few years. Might be the vertical here at the new bike park. Laps are a minimim 3500ft and can be 6k ft. Hand touch to the shock feels pretty hot. I just prefer the feel of coil by a large margin. Thinking any new coil .ight have an E attached to the model. E storia or Jade X are designed for E. Larger shaft so larger seal and bushing surface. I should check with vorsprung too. Chances are he'd have a recommendation for which is best for E or he has a shock mod that addresses the extra stress

 

[carlbiker]

Definitely. Im sure he's wotking ot on it and he'll post soon.

Im with you a bit on the coil thing too. A lot of these suspension systems are hard on coils then add in the extra weight of an emtb and the extra mileage/vert. The linkages with the shock yokes seem to be a prime offender. Blew up my jade pretty quick on my commie. Regilar service wouldve been $140 but it was over 200 needing a shaft and shaft bushing. Wouldnt be surprised if i blow it up again this summer. I shoild learn how to service it my self.My decoy doesnt have a yoke and i dont find the bike particularly flexy but blew my relatively new cane creek coil up pretty quick too. The cc coil i had on my banshee was bomber for a few years. Might be the vertical here at the new bike park. Laps are a minimim 3500ft and can be 6k ft. Hand touch to the shock feels pretty hot. I just prefer the feel of coil by a large margin. Thinking any new coil .ight have an E attached to the model. E storia or Jade X are designed for E. Larger shaft so larger seal and bushing surface. I should check with vorsprung too. Chances are he'd have a recommendation for which is best for E or he has a shock mod that addresses the extra stress

With monster truck tyres my rise is 20kg atm and the aim is to load it with normal bike gear rather than e, I’ve a new set of rims I’m going to put lighter tyres on, I’d like to sit around 18.5kg in an ideal world

Prices - Service/Tuning here’s a nice link covering various upkeep costs

Your looking at a service every 100hrs so for an EXT shock £1.20/hr. Ohlins is same, coil is cheaper to maintain than air.....I don‘t know the frequency of parts needing replacing though

 

[David0208]

With monster truck tyres my rise is 20kg atm and the aim is to load it with normal bike gear rather than e, I’ve a new set of rims I’m going to put lighter tyres on, I’d like to sit around 18.5kg in an ideal world

Prices - Service/Tuning here’s a nice link covering various upkeep costs

Your looking at a service every 100hrs so for an EXT shock £1.20/hr. Ohlins is same, coil is cheaper to maintain than air.....I don‘t know the frequency of parts needing replacing though

I am a Wild FS owner and now, today a Rise owner too and after reading through all your posts I can see only one conclusion. You have to buy another bike. If anyone asks, tell them I said it was ok.

 

[Dirtnvert]

With monster truck tyres my rise is 20kg atm and the aim is to load it with normal bike gear rather than e, I’ve a new set of rims I’m going to put lighter tyres on, I’d like to sit around 18.5kg in an ideal world

Prices - Service/Tuning here’s a nice link covering various upkeep costs

Your looking at a service every 100hrs so for an EXT shock £1.20/hr. Ohlins is same, coil is cheaper to maintain than air.....I don‘t know the frequency of parts needing replacing though

Copy that. Tires are definitely adding some weight. There must be something in a similar category with a weight closer to the intention of such a bike? Can't remember, are tgeu schwalbe? Butcher/eliminator 2.6 grid gravities are 1200 g. Seems pretty reasonable for dh casing tires
E storia weight compared to a regular storia or jade compared to a jade x seems negligable.
We spend all this $ on these fancy bikes so i think the coil shock and service interval $/performance ratio is a bargain ?

 

[Dirtnvert]

I am a Wild FS owner and now, today a Rise owner too and after reading through all your posts I can see only one conclusion. You have to buy another bike. If anyone asks, tell them I said it was ok.

Itd be pretty funny if by chance you unknowingly bought his old wild fs.
Nice bike btw or bike(s). Bases are covered with that quiver

 

[David0208]

Itd be pretty funny if by chance you unknowingly bought his old wild fs.
Nice bike btw or bike(s). Bases are covered with that quiver

That woukd have been funny ... but alas no. I've had mine since new in November 2019. Having said that I'd be more inclined to make changes to the Wild FS than the Rise. I don't want them to be too similar ... a degree on the Wild and maybe the mullet set up as shown on here previously on both bikes. I am vertically challenged and my 5' 7" frame and legs has me receiving unwelcome contact with my rear tyre on occasion.

Either a mullet set up or 2 inch heel lifts. ?

 

[Dirtnvert]

That woukd have been funny ... but alas no. I've had mine since new in November 2019. Having said that I'd be more inclined to make changes to the Wild FS than the Rise. I don't want them to be too similar ... a degree on the Wild and maybe the mullet set up as shown on here previously on both bikes. I am vertically challenged and my 5' 7" frame and legs has me receiving unwelcome contact with my rear tyre on occasion.

Either a mullet set up or 2 inch heel lifts. ?

I can relate. Same size here. Ill run full 9er on my enduro bike whrn im at the xc area. Everywhere else im mullet. Decoy is amways millet

 

[Shjay]

Trying out the Mullet setup in local woods

 

[RickBullotta]

Steep seat angles on an emrb arent as necessary. If its steep enough to accomodate the handling of the current slacker head angles along with the new fork offsets thats fine. I dont want my seat angle to be super steep like i have on my heavy enduro bike. The steep sa in that case is used for winching up steep climbs. If the bike is carrying any momentum , above just trying to turn over the cranks in winch mode, than a steep sa sux for moving the bike around and having a play finding lines. You dont need winch mode near as much with assist. I prefer my 75 degree seat angle in boost with the seat slammed finding fun lines on steep climbs. Its easier to be active on the bike with the seat out of the way. If the seat is up its because its not emtb super steep and only a moderate climb. Ill often pedal through stuff with the seat down 2 or 3 inches. Put the sear down that much and it makes the effective seat angle steeper. With assist im pedaling through stuff and want to be super active moving the bike around rather than looking for leg extension and time trial position so i can struggle to turn the cranks over. That position would be like wasting the attributes of the motor assist

Steep seat angles also start you further forward a bit to compensate for slacker HA's and longer wheelbases so that you can properly weight the front through turns. Lots of eMTBs are a bit nose heavy so this is less of an issue.

 

[Dirtnvert]

Steep seat angles also start you further forward a bit to compensate for slacker HA's and longer wheelbases so that you can properly weight the front through turns. Lots of eMTBs are a bit nose heavy so this is less of an issue.

Yes theres always a balance to find. I also see people way too far jacked over the front end on downhills because they insist on having low rise bars for climbing when all they need to do is bend their elbows a bit. You have all the time in the world to bend your elbows on a climb in comparison to fractions of a second to straighten your arms, straight arms are bad on downs too, to save your bacon at speed on the downs. Its similar for seat angles within reason. 75-76 isnt slack its just not overly steep. Those angles on a traditional mtb steep pitch are more than fine with assist. When the pitch gets emtb steep the seat is slammed so it doesnt matter. When you are pedaling through chunder on up and downs , because we do that lots on emtb, the seat will be down a couple inches so you can move the bike around through the chunder while pedaling. In that situation these 77-79 degree seat angles suck for pedaling because youre jacked over the front. With assist in that situation youre able to hang off the back more as you carry momentum through the rough while pedaling. When the 75 degree seat angle has the seat lowered a couple inches its now effectively a 76 degree seat angle. 78 degree seat angles are for turning over cranks on mtb steeps on mtb's. They do play a part in taming the new slack head angles but most of that control is from the new fork offsets and reach

 

[Andy Sid]

So yesterday I saw this on a Kenevo SL advert and the more I looked into the bike the more I loved other than the poxy motor ofc:

‘The Turbo Kenevo Super Light geometry can be fine-tuned for wherever and however you ride. Six distinct geometry settings allow easy adjustment to hone performance in any terrain. Head angle can be adjusted between 63 and 65.5 degrees. The bottom bracket height can be fine-tuned up or down by 7mm. We’ve never made a more adjustable, adaptable trail bike.’

Does anyone know how their doing this and can it be done on our Rises?

I’m trying to maintain the nicer upright feel (and abit of pop) for bike parks and XC so 65.5 and maybe keep the 210x55 air shock.

Then for dh tech/enduro stuff use an EXT storia v3 coil but it’s how we get to 64. I’ve seen examples of mullet with an offset bush using 216x63 and increase 160 fork and 163 rear travel but with a mullet.

At this point the fork has been upped which slackens the geo by 0.5 so it’s become 65, does adding an offset bush make it 65.5 again?

A 2.6 front tyres slackens by 0.5, I could use one of those if I was to aim toward 64 days.

The simple question would be, is it possible to get 65.5 and 64 using 29er on 210x55 without making the ride crap?

If not then if it’s a mullet option with the 216x63 then can that ever work as 65.5?

I’m guessing it’s one of the other….if so I defo need two shocks.

Just trying to work out if mullet is essential to get to 64 degrees really as I’ll leave that option for a while I think which may also mean I have to drop the coil idea also.

I know some can’t be assed with tinkering but I know others who do and seem to get a lot more out of their rides for doing so, if anything be nice to know and understand the options.

A lot of the current Specialized bikes have reversible headset cups, shock and chain stay fit chips, that's how they get all the different combos I believe. On a Rise im pretty sure your limited to shock length (Void Warranty) Fork length, External lower head cup, wheel/tyre diameter (Raise/lower front/rear axels) You could contact Works components to see if he has any solutions for head angle cups, but the Rise has integral bearings, with a tapered head tube which might really hamper what could be possible. My old Ebike had a 56mm ID head tube and was easy to fit angle and reach set, loads off free space, might be a bit of a squeeze in a Rise im guessing.