New Owner: Giant Trance X E+ 3 Pro 29 - Curious about auto algorithm

[DogRanger]

Old MTBer here who just got his first e-bike for some help climbing those hills.
Very happy with the bike. Had it just over a week and 75 or so fairly hard trail miles in Southern California.

I've been using it mostly in the "auto" mode. It works well and, more than any other setting, just makes me feel like I'm doing all the work and pedaling like I could 20 years ago.

I just did a 22-mile ride, never taking it out of auto just to see what it would do. My trails are generally intermediate, rocky at times, rutted dirt other times, varying grades and pretty much never level.

Every now and then, though, auto mode does something unexpected. For example, climbing a quite steep grade (15-20%) it seemed to give me as little help as possible. Like it would never get past Eco mode. I ended up cranking slowly uphill in the lowest gear at 3 mph hoping I'd make it to the top.

Then on a light uphill suddenly it's like a big push in the back and I'm easily pedaling 15 mph where most moderately strong riders might be at 8-10 mph.

I tried changing pedal pressure and cadence but am having trouble discerning how to get a little more boost on slow steep stuff and a little less when cruising on mild slopes. While I'm still mostly happy with the mode I'd like to learn more about the algorithm. When the terrain keeping changing I'd rather be using gearshifts than e-buttons.

 

[trailaddict]

I suppose this is a 2021 Model with Syncdrive Pro / PW-X2 Motor?
If yes, that's how it is. Nothing you can do about it other switching to manual Mode.
Auto Mode in 2022 Syncdrive Pro2 / PW-X3 is working much netter, but still there are people who favor manual over it.

 

[DogRanger]

I suppose this is a 2021 Model with Syncdrive Pro / PW-X2 Motor?
If yes, that's how it is. Nothing you can do about it other switching to manual Mode.

Yes, it's the 2021. I don't expect to change the algorithm, just understand how it works. Obviously something in the way a rider pedals has an impact, but what?

 

[Mabman]

The one I rode exhibited similar performance and I have read on here that as said most bypass it although if it worked like it should it would be a nice feature. As far as I know there is no fix for it although as Giant does their own software for the Yamaha motor they should be able to get it right, they certainly have enough sensors.

 

[malc101]

Funny, I noticed a little weirdness on power level 3 on a steep, sustained, hill yesterday on my 21 Trance. Seemed like the level sensor was playing games with the power even in manual mode. If that remains the case I'd love to eliminate that sensor. My Haibike/Yamaha does not do this, but it has its own weird things. The power changes were not dramatic, but they were not helpful either.

 

[DogRanger]

After riding the bike some more I'm getting a better sense of obtaining the most from the Auto mode, which I still prefer for majority of my ride. It tends to usually do the right thing and I'd rather pay attention to things like gearing and the trail ahead than switching modes frequently.

I believe Auto mode is designed to protect the motor from over-torquing as much as anything else. It kicks in best at a cadence of between 70 to 80 rpm which explains why it doesn't give much assistance when slowly slogging up a steep hill.

 

[malc101]

After riding the bike some more I'm getting a better sense of obtaining the most from the Auto mode, which I still prefer for majority of my ride. It tends to usually do the right thing and I'd rather pay attention to things like gearing and the trail ahead than switching modes frequently.

I believe Auto mode is designed to protect the motor from over-torquing as much as anything else. It kicks in best at a cadence of between 70 to 80 rpm which explains why it doesn't give much assistance when slowly slogging up a steep hill. View attachment 77865

Good to know. I need to give it a chance. Keeping up the high cadence is also important since the chain is experiencing 3x or more torque than a pedal bike.

 

[malc101]

I suppose this is a 2021 Model with Syncdrive Pro / PW-X2 Motor?
If yes, that's how it is. Nothing you can do about it other switching to manual Mode.
Auto Mode in 2022 Syncdrive Pro2 / PW-X3 is working much netter, but still there are people who favor manual over it.

I guess my 3 month old 2021 is outdated already.

 

[Evolution Stu]

Might be worth taking it to the shop and having them calibrate the inclinometer as if that’s off your assistance will be off too.

I think it will always be a bit hit and miss as every rider will sit differently and affect the inclinometer.

 

[Atebit]

Might be worth taking it to the shop and having them calibrate the inclinometer as if that’s off your assistance will be off too.

I think it will always be a bit hit and miss as every rider will sit differently and affect the inclinometer.

So what method would the LBS use to dial in the inclinometer for the rider?

I don’t understand why Giant favors cadence so much over torque, and why that balance isn’t adjustable in the RideControl app. Having six sensors is great, but if they’re programmed by someone who’s never ridden a bike (or isn’t YOU riding the bike), what good are they?