Need advice on Orbea vs Cube

[Longfellow78]

Hi all.

I wonder if anyone can assist me with a purchase. I have narrowed down my search to a Cube Stereo Hybrid 140 or an Orbea Rise H15.

My situation is I am a small rider 5ft5, 10 stone, who has been riding a hard tail for 25 years and want my first ebike.

I generally ride single-track and tours, very occasional bike park but don't like to jump.

I am torn between a great value full fat cube (27.5 version with 625 batter) and the idea of a more efficient, lighter Orbea.

The Orbea is more expensive with a better spec (the h30 is too underspecced vs the cube).

I would appreciate any buying advice as I needed to buy soon. I'd love the look of the carbon orbea but I like long rides and it seems pointless to buy that, plus the additional battery and end up a similar weight to the alloy Rise.

So I'd love to know, how much would I miss out on the turbo/boost mode of the cube, but benefit from around 5 kg less weight on the orbea?

Any perspectives very much appreciated.

Thanks!

 

[faberle]

Rise has turbo mode also and it has plenty of power. The power is a bit less than 90kn bikes but it allows a much better control of the bike. my comparison point is not cube but the Levo.

 

[NorthernBloke]

Hi all.

I wonder if anyone can assist me with a purchase. I have narrowed down my search to a Cube Stereo Hybrid 140 or an Orbea Rise H15.

My situation is I am a small rider 5ft5, 10 stone, who has been riding a hard tail for 25 years and want my first ebike.

I generally ride single-track and tours, very occasional bike park but don't like to jump.

I am torn between a great value full fat cube (27.5 version with 625 batter) and the idea of a more efficient, lighter Orbea.

The Orbea is more expensive with a better spec (the h30 is too underspecced vs the cube).

I would appreciate any buying advice as I needed to buy soon. I'd love the look of the carbon orbea but I like long rides and it seems pointless to buy that, plus the additional battery and end up a similar weight to the alloy Rise.

So I'd love to know, how much would I miss out on the turbo/boost mode of the cube, but benefit from around 5 kg less weight on the orbea?

Any perspectives very much appreciated.

Thanks!

I think the new alloy Rises are aimed at the emtb entry level, hence the larger battery. It is still a lot lighter than most entry level bikes though.

I ride a RISE carbon TEAM and chose it as I wanted as light a emtb as possible but still have the FOX36. I don't use a range extender and I would expect you to will easily manage 40k + and 1500m on a single charge. I am a lot bigger and heavier than you and I easily get 30-35k before 20% battery red warning light comes on.
My view is that you can always add an extender but you can't lighten the alloy version.
The Rise in turbo is great imo, a real benefit in Trail mode and not much difference in Eco. I use Profile 1 as this is more than sufficient for my riding (Xc/Trail) but Profile 2 gives you more umph if you need it.
Also the Rise is easier to ride manually without the motor on at all, although it will still be significantly heavier than a hardtail. I ride an Orange Five and I wouldn't consider that to be light but it feels like a feather compared to the Rise and mine is just under 17kg.

If you can get one to demo that's the best advice, try both if you can but I hated the idea of emtb but love my RISE

 

[Longfellow78]

Thanks for the reply. Would you say that the rise in turbo mode is like a full fat ebike in trail mode? With similar power and hence range? I know what you mean about adding a range extender to the carbon one but then it weighs only a few hundred grams less than the alloy one but at a thousand pounds more. I'm already stretching the budget with the h15. I wonder if orbea will also add a larger battery to the carbon one in the next model update which would be annoying. I'm also worried I might miss the turbo mode on an 85nm bike when with my friends who are all stronger riders than me.

 

[faberle]

Saying that the default Turbo mode on the Rise is comparable to default Trail mode on 85nm bike, sounds about right to me in terms of feeling of output/power. However, when riding alone, I use same assist level regardless if I ride the Rise or Levo (70% Eco). I think the weight and overall efficiency of the Rise does a good job at offsetting the less NM, but that is not it. Riding with friends influences the riding style, and in my case, it means faster and harder. As most of my friends have 85 NM bikes, I use my Levo with them and my Rise when on my own.

 

[NorthernBloke]

I can't comment on a full fat experience as the Rise is my first emtb.
Reviews I have seen is that 60Nm on a lighter bike is more than enough to keep up with 85-90Nm full fat.
A lot of reviews say it can handle more technical climbs better than most as well.
Turbo can get me, a big bloke up a 1km, 15% climb on loose mud and wet rocky surfaces easily, if that helps. And I can still hold a conversation at the top.

If your friends are riding full fat emtb and doing so in trail mode, then it might be better to get a similar bike or the H15 because constant turbo mode does burn through the battery.

I think be honest in what you'll ride, the RISE is a power assisted ride over a traditional emtb which in my mind is designed to get you to the top of the trail as quickly as possible to come back down again (enduro style).

2021 models are being discounted now...

Are you looking at 0% interest free? I did and went for the Team as it worked out at an extra eight quid a week from memory over an M10, or a couple of pints in my language.
And my marriage survived....

 

[ggx]

They are diferent bikes and both fun . I like both (very ), so perfect world is one of each . The Cube provides a full ebike experience.The rise a more natural bike experience with assist, aldo it´s not "wek".You can consider diferents aspects to decide. If you go to ride with fullpower ebikers and want to keep allways the pace, maybe you should prefer the Cube. If you ride solo, or mixed groups the rise could br a good choice.

 

[NorthernBloke]

I can't comment on a full fat experience as the Rise is my first emtb.
Reviews I have seen is that 60Nm on a lighter bike is more than enough to keep up with 85-90Nm full fat.
A lot of reviews say it can handle more technical climbs better than most as well.
Turbo can get me, a big bloke up a 1km, 15% climb on loose mud and wet rocky surfaces easily, if that helps. And I can still hold a conversation at the top.

If you're friends are riding full fat emtb and doing so in trail mode, then it might be better to get a similar bike or the H15 because constant turbo mode does burn through the battery.

I think be honest in what you'll ride, the RISE is a power assisted ride over a traditional emtb which in my mind is designed to get you to the top of the trail as quickly as possible to come back down again (enduro style).

2021 models are being discounted now...

Are you looking at 0% interest free? I did and went for the Team as it worked out at an extra eight quid a week from memory over an M10, or a couple of pints in my language.
And my marriage survived....

Oh and unless it is in stock, take any delivery date with a large pinch of salt

 

[Longfellow78]

Saying that the default Turbo mode on the Rise is comparable to default Trail mode on 85nm bike, sounds about right to me in terms of feeling of output/power. However, when riding alone, I use same assist level regardless if I ride the Rise or Levo (70% Eco). I think the weight and overall efficiency of the Rise does a good job at offsetting the less NM, but that is not it. Riding with friends influences the riding style, and in my case, it means faster and harder. As most of my friends have 85 NM bikes, I use my Levo with them and my Rise when on my own.

Hi. Can you explain what 70% eco means pls? Does that mean 70% of the available power overall? or 70% of the available power that eco mode has? Thanks!

 

[Longfellow78]

I can't comment on a full fat experience as the Rise is my first emtb.
Reviews I have seen is that 60Nm on a lighter bike is more than enough to keep up with 85-90Nm full fat.
A lot of reviews say it can handle more technical climbs better than most as well.
Turbo can get me, a big bloke up a 1km, 15% climb on loose mud and wet rocky surfaces easily, if that helps. And I can still hold a conversation at the top.

If your friends are riding full fat emtb and doing so in trail mode, then it might be better to get a similar bike or the H15 because constant turbo mode does burn through the battery.

I think be honest in what you'll ride, the RISE is a power assisted ride over a traditional emtb which in my mind is designed to get you to the top of the trail as quickly as possible to come back down again (enduro style).

2021 models are being discounted now...

Are you looking at 0% interest free? I did and went for the Team as it worked out at an extra eight quid a week from memory over an M10, or a couple of pints in my language.
And my marriage survived....

Hi, no I am not looking at Credit. It is the bike to work scheme, so I get about £1200 off and my work also gives me a monthly "fitness" allowance as well to put towards something like this. Marriage yes! My missus thinks that my max budget is £3900, so I am taking a risk even with the Cube, hehe.

 

[Longfellow78]

Oh and unless it is in stock, take any delivery date with a large pinch of salt

I have already paid a deposit on a Cube which is transferable. the shop has an H15 in stock, but it is in the Orange colour i don't like. I would like the Blue and Grey one which they insist is coming in Feb - I have seen this date in multiple shops so assuming that Orbea is dropping a lot of stock around then, but that could all change easily.

 

[Longfellow78]

So looking at pros and cons:

Cube Stereo Hybrid 140 SL 27.5 inch wheels:
- Cheapest at £4599 (I take a small so it is £200 pounds cheaper than stock with a 620wh instead of 750 and 27.5" wheels)
- Good display with phone satnav connection
- Good specs but slightly worse/heavier forks. No stock parts need replacing, beautiful Newmen Fade hubs, heavy rims I don't need
- Overbuilt for my weight at 10 stone
- Large battery, powerful motor
- Overall best value, fastest, best range at stock battery
- 24.5kg

Orbea H15 :
- Expensive for me at £5199 plus I would want at some point a Garmin 530 to match Cube's display so £5330 with that, but could put it off
- Great forks (except 36 performance is more than I need, would prefer the 34) and shock (float x), best components overall (except deore brakes to Cube's XT, but not great tyres and bars, would need new bars at some point but can put it off)
- Lighter and better ride cross country (my style) than Cube
- Looks better
- Option of Range extender for massive range, but not needed - could save for the Alpine trip that won't happen.
- Mostly as good battery at stock than Cube, slightly less range and weaker motor
- Weaker wheels than Cube but a bit lighter.
- £600 more than Cube (£820 with Garmin) for a slower bike that rides a bit better
- 20.2kg (21.6kg with range extender)

I wonder if the RS motor will ever be chipped to make it the same as a normal EP8? It would such if they released a 2023 Rise with the 90nm

Orbea M20 :
- Expensive for me at £5599 - Already £1000 more than Cube or £1230 with Garmin
- My preferred forks, but not as good shock as H15, same as Cube with lighter fork, slightly worst components overall
- Lightest and best ride
- Looks the best (stunning in blue)
- Ok battery but borderline too small for my longest rides
- Option of Range extender to match the Cube, but now costing £6050 or £6280 with Garmin.
- Least range and weaker motor
- Weaker wheels than Cube but a bit lighter.
- £1000 more than Cube (or £1450 with range extender or £1680 with Garmin) for a slower bike that rides better
-18.2kg (19.6kg with range extender).

I love the idea of the M20, keeping it for years, and slowly upgrading to make an ultralight beast, but looking at the cost I think maybe it is just too expensive. I would need the range extender for my longest rides - I would loathe to buy an ebike and run out of steam and it's a LOT more than the Cube. I also have a bad feeling they will bring out a carbon bike with a larger battery which would be very annoying and this is the part that puts me most off.

H15 looks like a sweet spot in that it is only a few hundred grams more than the M20 with the range extender, but doesn't need one itself (but if it did have one it would open the door to Epic Alpine rides I dream of and would likely never do). £600 more than the Cube is easier to swallow, and has the best components (excluding brakes, which in reality deore = xt). Still slower than Cube in punch, but I am light so it may not be a big deal. I may get dropped with others, but I mostly ride alone, so unlikely to be a problem.

I lean towards the H15 as I think it will have longevity as companies will move towards lighter ebikes, and it is super versatile in that in future when I have more cash, the range extender will make it a total monster, could leave it in turbo all the time.

Final point though is buyers remorse, which is what brings me back to the Cube - If I buy the Cube, I will no doubt love it, and on the downhills I doubt it would be much different to the Orbea, and with that torque, I'm not sure I will say "I wish I'd spent more on a bike which was 4kg lighter", but if I buy the Orbea, every time I don't make it up a steep, rocky, rooty climb, I might always wonder if I would have made it up there with the Cube.

So with all this all I've done is talked myself out of the M20, and still flip flopping between H15 and Cube SL. Heart saying Orbea, head saying Cube. Especially as wife thinks max budget is £3900! Lol!!!!!

Edit: Also realised the Orbea is 29 inch wheels and the Cube is 27.5. I am nor sure what difference this makes as I am used to 26"!

 

[faberle]

Hi. Can you explain what 70% eco means pls? Does that mean 70% of the available power overall? or 70% of the available power that eco mode has? Thanks!

i mean that on my regular 2 hours ride, I spend 70% of that time in Eco mode.

 

[NorthernBloke]

So looking at pros and cons:

Cube Stereo Hybrid 140 SL 27.5 inch wheels:
- Cheapest at £4599 (I take a small so it is £200 pounds cheaper than stock with a 620wh instead of 750 and 27.5" wheels)
- Good display with phone satnav connection
- Good specs but slightly worse/heavier forks. No stock parts need replacing, beautiful Newmen Fade hubs, heavy rims I don't need
- Overbuilt for my weight at 10 stone
- Large battery, powerful motor
- Overall best value, fastest, best range at stock battery
- 24.5kg

Orbea H15 :
- Expensive for me at £5199 plus I would want at some point a Garmin 530 to match Cube's display so £5330 with that, but could put it off
- Great forks (except 36 performance is more than I need, would prefer the 34) and shock (float x), best components overall (except deore brakes to Cube's XT, but not great tyres and bars, would need new bars at some point but can put it off)
- Lighter and better ride cross country (my style) than Cube
- Looks better
- Option of Range extender for massive range, but not needed - could save for the Alpine trip that won't happen.
- Mostly as good battery at stock than Cube, slightly less range and weaker motor
- Weaker wheels than Cube but a bit lighter.
- £600 more than Cube (£820 with Garmin) for a slower bike that rides a bit better
- 20.2kg (21.6kg with range extender)

I wonder if the RS motor will ever be chipped to make it the same as a normal EP8? It would such if they released a 2023 Rise with the 90nm

Orbea M20 :
- Expensive for me at £5599 - Already £1000 more than Cube or £1230 with Garmin
- My preferred forks, but not as good shock as H15, same as Cube with lighter fork, slightly worst components overall
- Lightest and best ride
- Looks the best (stunning in blue)
- Ok battery but borderline too small for my longest rides
- Option of Range extender to match the Cube, but now costing £6050 or £6280 with Garmin.
- Least range and weaker motor
- Weaker wheels than Cube but a bit lighter.
- £1000 more than Cube (or £1450 with range extender or £1680 with Garmin) for a slower bike that rides better
-18.2kg (19.6kg with range extender).

I love the idea of the M20, keeping it for years, and slowly upgrading to make an ultralight beast, but looking at the cost I think maybe it is just too expensive. I would need the range extender for my longest rides - I would loathe to buy an ebike and run out of steam and it's a LOT more than the Cube. I also have a bad feeling they will bring out a carbon bike with a larger battery which would be very annoying and this is the part that puts me most off.

H15 looks like a sweet spot in that it is only a few hundred grams more than the M20 with the range extender, but doesn't need one itself (but if it did have one it would open the door to Epic Alpine rides I dream of and would likely never do). £600 more than the Cube is easier to swallow, and has the best components (excluding brakes, which in reality deore = xt). Still slower than Cube in punch, but I am light so it may not be a big deal. I may get dropped with others, but I mostly ride alone, so unlikely to be a problem.

I lean towards the H15 as I think it will have longevity as companies will move towards lighter ebikes, and it is super versatile in that in future when I have more cash, the range extender will make it a total monster, could leave it in turbo all the time.

Final point though is buyers remorse, which is what brings me back to the Cube - If I buy the Cube, I will no doubt love it, and on the downhills I doubt it would be much different to the Orbea, and with that torque, I'm not sure I will say "I wish I'd spent more on a bike which was 4kg lighter", but if I buy the Orbea, every time I don't make it up a steep, rocky, rooty climb, I might always wonder if I would have made it up there with the Cube.

So with all this all I've done is talked myself out of the M20, and still flip flopping between H15 and Cube SL. Heart saying Orbea, head saying Cube. Especially as wife thinks max budget is £3900! Lol!!!!!

Edit: Also realised the Orbea is 29 inch wheels and the Cube is 27.5. I am nor sure what difference this makes as I am used to 26"!

If you are mainly XC/trail then you spend most of your time in trail going up, eco or not on at all on the flat and totally disengaged going down. I think the RISE is ideal

The 29inch wheels?? It might take one or two rides to get used to it but I'd be more concerned what brakes it has.

Is the M20 four pot or two pot?

I have found the Rise picks up a really fast downhill and shedding speed quickly is probably more important than difference in forks.

I don't think there are many bad emtb to be honest.
So pick the one you are happiest to purchase rather it be that than a millstone around your neck. And enjoy

 

[Longfellow78]

Putting on my finance hat on, taken over 4 years on 0% you are looking at £96 per month for the Cube or £116 for the M20 or H15. That's £20 a month if you can get finance.

If you are mainly XC/trail then you spend most of your time in trail going up, eco or not on at all on the flat and totally disengaged going down.

The 29inch wheels?? It might take one or two rides to get used to it but I'd be more concerned what brakes it has.

Is the M20 four pot or two pot?

I have found the Rise picks up a really fast downhill and shedding speed quickly is probably more important than difference in forks.

I don't think there are many bad emtb to be honest.
So pick the one you are happiest to purchase rather it be that than a millstone around your neck. And enjoy

Thanks. I think I've discounted the m20. It's not much lighter and when you factor in that the h has a larger battery which accounts for 900g of the difference the carbon frame itself is only worth 1kg, which is too little for the cost imo. The cube has xt 4 pots and the h15 has deore, so basically identical internals and performance when the deore has xt pads.

I'm thinking that I will keep this bike for a long time and the price difference will end up being less of a big deal. The orbea is just shading it for me. God knows why they didn't let owners choose between the custom RS power curve and the standard 85nm. Then I would buy the orbea without any doubt.

 

[NorthernBloke]

Thanks. I think I've discounted the m20. It's not much lighter and when you factor in that the h has a larger battery which accounts for 900g of the difference the carbon frame itself is only worth 1kg, which is too little for the cost imo. The cube has xt 4 pots and the h15 has deore, so basically identical internals and performance when the deore has xt pads.

I'm thinking that I will keep this bike for a long time and the price difference will end up being less of a big deal. The orbea is just shading it for me. God knows why they didn't let owners choose between the custom RS power curve and the standard 85nm. Then I would buy the orbea without any doubt.

H15 has 180mm 2 pot, with the 4 pot an upgrade option if my memory serves me correct. I would also upgrade to the 203mm discs if you can.

H15 looks the best for buck in the alloy range,

 

[Longfellow78]

H15 has 180mm 2 pot, with the 4 pot an upgrade option if my memory serves me correct. I would also upgrade to the 203mm discs if you can.

H15 looks the best for buck in the alloy range,

Actually I think the h15 has deore M6100 4 pots. The h30 has 2 pots. Not sure about the carbon ones.

 

[Chris ledger]

The whole point of the rs motor is to try and get as much mileage as possible on the smaller battery.
If it was full power the temptation is there to use the extra power and run out of gas fairly quickly.
Ive picked a cube for my next bike because of the bosch motor and the fact you can get the motors repaired unlike the shimano units that seem ti be more difficult to repair.

 

[Longfellow78]

The whole point of the rs motor is to try and get as much mileage as possible on the smaller battery.
If it was full power the temptation is there to use the extra power and run out of gas fairly quickly.
Ive picked a cube for my next bike because of the bosch motor and the fact you can get the motors repaired unlike the shimano units that seem ti be more difficult to repair.

You make a good point which makes me think I should go cube. Apart from the weight which is much less important on an ebike there are no advantage to the orbea, as if you want the "less powerful more natural ride" just turn the cube down to eco or trail. But if you want the massive torque, on the cube you have it. So the cube has just as much range (more in fact) especially if you ride it like the orbea, but it also has the punch. I just wish it wasn't so overbuilt for my riding style. I've spent 25 years with the ethos that "lighter is better" but on an ebike, does 4kg matter when it costs more money and less available power? Orbea missed a huge opportunity to have 85 or 60 nm available at rider choice.

 

[Chris ledger]

Over 15 stone there was no way i would look at a the orbea i dont think the range would suit me like you said for a great work out use eco for fun emtb is the way the cube with a 750 battery suits me fine

 

[ggx]

You make a good point which makes me think I should go cube. Apart from the weight which is much less important on an ebike there are no advantage to the orbea, as if you want the "less powerful more natural ride" just turn the cube down to eco or trail. But if you want the massive torque, on the cube you have it. So the cube has just as much range (more in fact) especially if you ride it like the orbea, but it also has the punch. I just wish it wasn't so overbuilt for my riding style. I've spent 25 years with the ethos that "lighter is better" but on an ebike, does 4kg matter when it costs more money and less available power? Orbea missed a huge opportunity to have 85 or 60 nm available at rider choice.

Just to point that in my opinion/experience it´s a diferent fell due to wheight, not just due the assist level. For exemple with the rise abouve assist limit you barely notice the transition.

 

[Longfellow78]

Just to point that in my opinion/experience it´s a diferent fell due to wheight, not just due the assist level. For exemple with the rise abouve assist limit you barely notice the transition.

Do you mean that the rise feels more natural because its lighter?

 

[Longfellow78]

Over 15 stone there was no way i would look at a the orbea i dont think the range would suit me like you said for a great work out use eco for fun emtb is the way the cube with a 750 battery suits me fine

Ah you must be tall. The cube in my small size is only a 625 but with our weights it's probably about the same. I guess if I get the cube I can spend the extra money on upgrades!

 

[Longfellow78]

Flipping back to Orbea now btw, lol

 

[Chris ledger]

Buy both

 

[Longfellow78]

I went to the excellent e-bikeshop.co.uk I'm Farnham Surrey and saw many models of a
carbon rise. Decided to go for the medium H15 in grey and blue. It is "supposed" to come in around 4 weeks. Fingers crossed.

 

[Matzotom]

I'm 17st+ kitted up on a M10 rise. It's my first ebike and I wanted the same sort of ride experience that I've known for 30 years, not something completely different. In profile 1 (the detuned ep8 further limited to 47nm in boost) its still feels like its pulling me up the hill in boost so I personally would not want full fat. So far, I've only done 3 rides so I can't be too sure in the range but the last ride was 3hrs, 17miles, 750m climbed and still had 52% battery left.
The bike feels similar to my non ebike but with far less pop when it comes to bunnyhopping trail obstacles. I dread to imagine what a far heavier ebike would feel like. I think it would make the trail riding experience that I know and love a totally different experience. So I'd say, really consider what you love about mountain bike riding and what you're prepared to compromise on or are prepared to lose completely.

 

[Alex Ebiker]

I have ridden both and the rise is definitely my favourite of the two. It just feels better to ride as it rides like a normal trail bike.

Once you see both in person you will want the rise. The cube screams Ebike. The down tube is almost twice as thick as the rise’s.

I also felt that the rise in turbo uphill is pretty close to the cube in turbo uphill.