Levo Gen 3 Improving Levo Comp suspension

[decooney]

@Rod B.
"The Fox 38 with Grip 2 is a very good fork. It's a much stiffer fork than the Fox 36. The Fox 36 Rhythm can also be upgraded to make it an extremely good fork, i.e. addition of a Grip 2 damper, Vorsprung Luftkappe negative air piston, custom damper tuned to your weight, etc."

Hi Rod,
Good insights. Thanks for the links. Will check them out.

I'm not referring to the prior generation Grip 2 damper btw. Referring to the new X and X2.
Going to try the new design damper in the Grip X and Grip X2 family. Just came out 3 weeks ago from Fox.
Same chassis, all new damper and internal bushing design from the MX side of Fox leaning in. X2 now has 23 shims in the stack, hopefully same control you are aware of with the former gen, and with better damping and control with the new X2. Came close to upgrading my OEM 36, but the jump up to 38 with the new X2 design may be worth it.

We'll see. Hope it works out. A few internal pics over here on pinbike fwtw. I'm not doing "Factory" going for the "Performance Elite" X2 with the black upper scansions, not the blinging gold stuff. Want to keep it subdued stealth looking...

First Ride: Fox Releases New Grip X & Grip X2 Dampers - Pinkbike

New dampers, and a limited edition run of gold lowers.

www.pinkbike.com

 

[Rod B.]

@Rod B.
"The Fox 38 with Grip 2 is a very good fork. It's a much stiffer fork than the Fox 36. The Fox 36 Rhythm can also be upgraded to make it an extremely good fork, i.e. addition of a Grip 2 damper, Vorsprung Luftkappe negative air piston, custom damper tuned to your weight, etc."

Hi Rod,
Good insights. Thanks for the links. Will check them out.

I'm not referring to the prior generation Grip 2 damper btw. Referring to the new X and X2.
Going to try the new design damper in the Grip X and Grip X2 family. Just came out 3 weeks ago from Fox.
Same chassis, all new damper and internal bushing design from the MX side of Fox leaning in. X2 now has 23 shims in the stack, hopefully same control you are aware of with the former gen, and with better damping and control with the new X2. Came close to upgrading my OEM 36, but the jump up to 38 with the new X2 design may be worth it.

We'll see. Hope it works out. A few internal pics over here on pinbike fwtw. I'm not doing "Factory" going for the "Performance Elite" X2 with the black upper scansions, not the blinging gold stuff. Want to keep it subdued stealth looking...

First Ride: Fox Releases New Grip X & Grip X2 Dampers - Pinkbike

New dampers, and a limited edition run of gold lowers.

www.pinkbike.com

The nice thing about the new Fox X dampers are that they can be retro-fitted to an older Fox fork. It saves a bit of money and the need to upgrade to a new fork if a person's older fork is still fairly new.

When Fox manufactures suspension components for an "Off the shelf buy", the shock/fork has a generic damper tune which will suit the widest margin of rider weights. This doesn't work well for riders who are at the extreme ends of the rider weight bell curve, i.e. too light a weight or too heavy a rider weight. A custom shim stack/damper tune on your fork and shock, which is dialed in for your weight will work wonders for your riding and it doesn't cost much to have the damper tuning service done. You would be surprised at the impact a damper perfectly tuned to your weight and riding style will make on the way your bike handles.

I have my work suspension tune work performed by Brandon Olsen who works for Pro Bike Supply, located in Newport Beach California. I'm sure there are local people near you in Northern California who can also do the service. If not, give Pro Bike Supply a call and they can help you out.

Pro Bike Supply

Specializing in high end custom mountain, gravel, road and tri bikes along with the best selection of premium parts and service.

www.probikesupply.com

 

[decooney]

@Rod B. "You would be surprised at the impact a damper perfectly tuned to your weight and riding style will make on the way your bike handles.".

Good to know, I'm new and still feel novice to eMTB coming from 56 years of dirt motocross and single track riding. All of my enduro motorcycles have had the full-tilt suspension treatment, so I can kind of relate. Hoping the new fork internal redesign and new X2 damper is better than just okay out of the box. Or it'll likely be exceeding my eMTB skillset, however I'm a fanatic for a plush-off-the top suspension feel on dirt bikes skimming off tops of the whoops Not sure about eMTB yet!

 

[Rod B.]

@Rod B. "You would be surprised at the impact a damper perfectly tuned to your weight and riding style will make on the way your bike handles.".

Good to know, I'm new and still feel novice to eMTB coming from 56 years of dirt motocross and single track riding. All of my enduro motorcycles have had the full-tilt suspension treatment, so I can kind of relate. Hoping the new fork internal redesign and new X2 damper is better than just okay out of the box. Or it'll likely be exceeding my eMTB skillset, however I'm a fanatic for a plush-off-the top suspension feel on dirt bikes skimming off tops of the whoops Not sure about eMTB yet!

A while back I read this quote from another eMTB rider about eBike riding, the quote said "I get out more often, I ride further, I mostly ride in eco, it's still a great workout." I think the quote sums up eMTB riding perfectly. Good luck with your suspension upgrades.

 

[decooney]

A while back I read this quote from another eMTB rider about eBike riding, the quote said "I get out more often, I ride further, I mostly ride in eco, it's still a great workout." I think the quote sums up eMTB riding perfectly. Good luck with your suspension upgrades.

@Rod B agree. Same here. I sold my last dirt-enduro Husqvarna FE501S and felt like I cut off one of my arms seeing it get hauled away. Hung up that helmet after 52 years of dirt mc riding. Having withdrawals decided to try eMTB.

I too like the "ride further, faster" and "explore more" type of analogy. While I'm going into my 60s, some of the tough younger folks on analog bikes tease some, what they don't quite grasp is these bikes truly are getting us out there, and riding again. While I'm a few years late to the eMTB game, I really feel lucky we are at a time where these cool new capable bikes are available to us. Being able to ride up steeper climbs and get to more places has been a game changer for me so far.

 

[decooney]

2025 Fox 38 Performance Elite 29'er 170mm forks, Grip X2 damper - installed today.

Bike: 2023 Specialized Turbo Levo Comp Carbon S4 size
Has 29'er front 17.5" rear (mullet setup)

• Local dealer Mechanic (Pacos Bike Sacramento CA - USA) helped me backorder from Fox, arrived in 3 days
• Upgraded from Fox Rythym 36 Fit4 to the new 2025 Fox 38 Grip X2
• +10mm over stock 36s were 160mm
• 218lb rider kitted up (important to note)
• Wanted the all Black fork in Matte color to match bike

Initial impressions:

• Settings are set soft, 110lb in air fork pressure
• Rebound is 2/2 clicks from open slow/fast adjusters
• Compression is 8/9 clicks slow/fast adjusters
• Steering shims set the same two spacers under tool top
• Feels more "relaxed" off the top, not harsh with this new damper
• Front end is structurally more stiff, no flex or twist feeling
• Oddly enough I can feel the difference in slack, so slightly
• Front end does sit up just a tad higher, slightly
• Seem to sit with a tad less weight over handlebars; comfortable
• BALANCE: When I jump up/down on the pedals, I feel the front to rear balance is spot on
• Plush: it definitely feels plush in a nice and controlled way, not sure how to describe it more
• Looks: Forks just look right on the eBike, should have come this way OEM stock for Comp Carbon

Next:

• I may try dropping from 110lb to 100lb air in forks to see if it drops a tad sitting static
• For some reason i don't like it at 170mm, i am willing to reconfigure it to 160mm internally

Awaiting first real half day ride out, we'll see how it goes. Thought I'd share for others contemplating this

 

[Rod B.]

2025 Fox 38 Performance Elite 29'er 170mm forks, Grip X2 damper - installed today.

Bike: 2023 Specialized Turbo Levo Comp Carbon S4 size
Has 29'er front 17.5" rear (mullet setup)

• Local dealer Mechanic (Pacos Bike Sacramento CA - USA) helped me backorder from Fox, arrived in 3 days
• Upgraded from Fox Rythym 36 Fit4 to the new 2025 Fox 38 Grip X2
• +10mm over stock 36s were 160mm
• 218lb rider kitted up (important to note)
• Wanted the all Black fork in Matte color to match bike

Initial impressions:

• Settings are set soft, 110lb in air fork pressure
• Rebound is 2/2 clicks from open slow/fast adjusters
• Compression is 8/9 clicks slow/fast adjusters
• Steering shims set the same two spacers under tool top
• Feels more "relaxed" off the top, not harsh with this new damper
• Front end is structurally more stiff, no flex or twist feeling
• Oddly enough I can feel the difference in slack, so slightly
• Front end does sit up just a tad higher, slightly
• Seem to sit with a tad less weight over handlebars; comfortable
• BALANCE: When I jump up/down on the pedals, I feel the front to rear balance is spot on
• Plush: it definitely feels plush in a nice and controlled way, not sure how to describe it more
• Looks: Forks just look right on the eBike, should have come this way OEM stock for Comp Carbon

Next:

• I may try dropping from 110lb to 100lb air in forks to see if it drops a tad sitting static
• For some reason i don't like it at 170mm, i am willing to reconfigure it to 160mm internally

Awaiting first real half day ride out, we'll see how it goes. Thought I'd share for others contemplating this

Decooney,
Your bike looks great. When you increased the travel on your Levo to 170mm, you "Slackened" the head tube angle to approximately 64 degrees +/- from the stock 64.5 degree head tube angle.

A slacker head tube angle will make the bike behave more stable at higher speeds, especially downhill. The bike will also descend better in the chunk and on steep descents. A slacker head tube angle will slow the steering down, i.e. make it less twitchy at high speed. On the other hand, the bike's steering response will be slightly less nimble on tight and twisty trail negotiations. When climbing extremely steep trail sections, the front wheel will feel like it wants to lift up. This is because your center mass has been pushed back slightly by the increased travel. You'll need to weight the front wheel slightly on very steep climbs to combat front wheel lift.

I have a 170mm fork on my Levo and I love it. I tend to prefer technical trails, drops, rock crawling and steep technical descents. Whether you keep the 170mm air shaft, or install a 160mm air shaft is a personal choice with no right or wrong decision. You simply want to tailor your suspension to the terrain you ride and your riding style. If you are riding less technical trail and it doesn't involve steep descents, then changing your front travel back to 160mm may be a good choice for you.

If I may make one suggestion. I would ditch the handlebar gear bag and go with either a hip pack or backpack. A handlebar gear bag is great for bike packing, but for mountain biking it could lead to handling/steering issues due to shifting weight and the added weight over the front wheel. It could also lead to a trip over the handlebars on a steep descent should you stick a wheel slightly on a rock. It's a good idea to keep your gear weight biased more towards the rear of the bike.

Note: Specialized allows you to make two modifications to your Levo's geometry. Your Levo has a flip chip located on the rear triangle (Rear pivot) that allows you to change the ride height of your bike with a "Low" or "High" setting. Specialized also provides upper head tube headset cups that allow you to adjust the head tube angle by 1 degree either "Slacker", "Steeper" or leave it "Neutral. All of these adjustments will change the handling on your Levo quite a bit. It's fun to experiment around with the various settings. I myself prefer a neutral headset cup and I like my Levo in the high position for the added ground clearance.

 

[decooney]

Thanks @Rod B. I hope to ride the bike again two weekends from now on more serious downhill trails with rocks and bumps. From my MX days I guess I still like to bomb downhill faster than I probably should and one of the reasons I took the leap to 170mm. So, I guess I'm okay trying the extra slack for now. I do tend to lean forward some naturally so I'm hoping I won't have to compensate much on uphills, yet I'll now be aware of it thinking the next time I try some steeper uphill sections. I put light weight items in my front bag so that's someting I'll keep aware of.

What I noticed on a short few test rides yesterday was how the new fork just functions differently, seems more compliant over small bumps too, maybe its that new 23 shim stack and oil passing through the oraphases gently so, I don't know, just seems more "relaxed" on bumps. Hope to get a chance to go out again in a few weeks. Thanks.

 

[Rod B.]

Thanks @Rod B. I hope to ride the bike again two weekends from now on more serious downhill trails with rocks and bumps. From my MX days I guess I still like to bomb downhill faster than I probably should and one of the reasons I took the leap to 170mm. So, I guess I'm okay trying the extra slack for now. I do tend to lean forward some naturally so I'm hoping I won't have to compensate much on uphills, yet I'll now be aware of it thinking the next time I try some steeper uphill sections. I put light weight items in my front bag so that's someting I'll keep aware of.

What I noticed on a short few test rides yesterday was how the new fork just functions differently, seems more compliant over small bumps too, maybe its that new 23 shim stack and oil passing gently through the oraphases gently so, I don't know, just seems more "relaxed" on bumps. Hope to get a chance to go out again in a few weeks. Thanks.

A new fork is a beautiful thing....smooth as butter and the world just feels right. The new Grip X2 damper plays a part in the compliance your are feeling.

Here's the trick to keeping your new fork feeling complaint and smooth as butter. Underneath the black rubber wiper seal on each lower tube there is a foam ring. The foam ring soaks up the oil in the fork lower tubes. The foam ring's purpose is to lubricate the wiper seal, upper stanchion and the Teflon coated bushings in the fork lower tubes. Over time, i.e. about 20-30 hours of riding, the foam ring will begin to dry out and cause stiction. You'll know this is occurring because your fork will begin to feel harsh when you ride. Your hands will also start to hurt when you ride due to the harshness. You'll wonder why your fork has suddenly lost it's mojo. It's the foam rings, they need to be lubricated again. To lubricate the foam rings, all you need to do is turn your bike upside down and leave it that way for several hours, but preferably overnight. Doing so will re-saturate the foam rings with oil. Your fork will feel buttery smooth again,

Depending upon how often you ride and your local riding conditions, the foam rings will eventually begin to crud up with dirt particles that have made it past the black rubber wiper seals. Fox recommends a wiper seal service be performed at 125 hours. Don't neglect the wiper seal service. A dirty foam ring and worn wiper seal will eventually score and scratch your fork stanchions.

Be safe,
Rod

 

[decooney]

Hoping to hear from other 200lb + riders riding a Levo Comp or Turbo Levo Comp (alloy or carbon) who've decided to upgrade the OEM suspension, why, how, and the results you are getting. Having paid a decent price for my bike new, I guess I should have known this is not much different from dirt motorcycles, where they do their best to provide a universal spec and design, yet it does not always span the different rider weights and valving necessary to meet everyone's needs.

The stock Fox Rythym 36 fork might have been okay for me if I weighed 160lbs, and did not have to air up the fork so much to accommodate more for my rider weight kitted up. Also having the added rigidity of the more robust 38 was "immediately evident" in other's words I've read, there is no chassis twisting or wheel darting around in rough stuff now, again - for my total rider weight. Hope to hear from others doing something similar.

 

[decooney]

@Rod B. question for ya if you happen to know or have related experience. I live 100miles from Fox Racing, and they just started to put out the new version 2025 Grip X and Grip X2 fork and damper design about 4-5 weeks ago. My local dealer has only seen my backordered fork set come in so far. Still relatively new in my area, more orders trickling out now worldwide seeing comments on forums online as of May 2024. Not much to reference yet as I gather it now.

In your experience and circles do you by chance know if I were to drop from the recommended 110lb psi [for my weight], down to something like 95lb psi, [-15lbs] thus lowering the fork some [to experiment] with front ride height, could i damage the fork internally somehow even with easy riding? What I'm trying to do is simulate a 160mm ride height to first compare to what I had before at 160. Afterwards, I'll air back up, to see what 170mm truly feels like in the chunky stuff. If not recommended to do this, please let me know your thoughts, thanks.

 

[Rod B.]

Hoping to hear from other 200lb + riders riding a Levo Comp or Turbo Levo Comp (alloy or carbon) who've decided to upgrade the OEM suspension, why, how, and the results you are getting. Having paid a decent price for my bike new, I guess I should have known this is not much different from dirt motorcycles, where they do their best to provide a universal spec and design, yet it does not always span the different rider weights and valving necessary to meet everyone's needs.

The stock Fox Rythym 36 fork might have been okay for me if I weighed 160lbs, and did not have to air up the fork so much to accommodate more for my rider weight kitted up. Also having the added rigidity of the more robust 38 was "immediately evident" in other's words I've read, there is no chassis twisting or wheel darting around in rough stuff now, again - for my total rider weight. Hope to hear from others doing something similar.

@Rod B. question for ya if you happen to know or have related experience. I live 100miles from Fox Racing, and they just started to put out the new version 2025 Grip X and Grip X2 fork and damper design about 4-5 weeks ago. My local dealer has only seen my backordered fork set come in so far. Still relatively new in my area, more orders trickling out now worldwide seeing comments on forums online as of May 2024. Not much to reference yet as I gather it now.

In your experience and circles do you by chance know if I were to drop from the recommended 110lb psi [for my weight], down to something like 95lb psi, [-15lbs] thus lowering the fork some [to experiment] with front ride height, could i damage the fork internally somehow even with easy riding? What I'm trying to do is simulate a 160mm ride height to first compare to what I had before at 160. Afterwards, I'll air back up, to see what 170mm truly feels like in the chunky stuff. If not recommended to do this, please let me know your thoughts, thanks.

If you haven't had a chance yet, I encourage you to read my suspension articles when you have a free moment. You'll find them very informative. The articles are basic and will help you understand what is going on internally with your fork and rear shock. They will help you understand what happens internally when you lower your air spring pressure which will alter your spring rate. You've paid a lot of money for the suspension on your Levo. You want to get the most bang for your buck by tuning your suspension perfectly to your weight, riding style and local riding conditions.

Lowering the air pressure in your fork will not damage your fork. I want to add one exception. Internally, at the very bottom of your fork lower tubes there are black rubber bottom out pads. These rubber pads cushion the upper stanchions when they bottom out against the pads at full compression. Think of them as a bump stop. If you repeatedly bottom out your fork hard, i.e. the upper stanchions slam hard into the bottom out pads, you can damage the stanchions, bottom out pads and possibly the seals in the damper and air spring shaft. An occasional bottom out isn't going to do it, however you don't want to make a habit of bottoming your fork and rear shock out. When you bottom out a fork or rear shock, it places stress on the head tube, down tube or the rear triangle on the bike.

You'll notice a black rubber "O" ring on your Fox 38's upper stanchion. The "O" ring has two uses. The first is to set your initial sag. Secondly and more importantly, the "O" ring helps you tune your suspension as you ride. The "O" ring will let you know how your suspension is performing. All forks or shocks have a maximum travel. For forks, the maximum safe travel is typically around 10mm below the fork crown. When you ride, you never want to see the "O" ring pushed up hard against the crown. If you do, this means you bottomed out the fork.

Ideally, you want to see the "O" ring on or about 10mm from the crown after a hard series of jumps, drops, rocky descents, etc. This tells you that your air pressure/volume/spring rate is set correctly. On the other hand, you also don't want to see the "O" ring only about mid travel after a series of jumps, drops, rocky descents, etc. This means you're not taking full advantage of your suspension, your air pressure/volume/spring rate is set too high.

There is also another important aspect to running "Too" low an air spring pressure. In this picture, I'm on my Orbea Rise with Fox 36, FIT4 with 160mm of travel. I have about 9,000 miles on this fork. The rock face is at a fairly steep angle. When I reach the bottom, the fork will begin to compress due to my body weight, momentum and gravity. As the fork nears mid travel, resistance to compression will increase in the fork's air spring chamber. This is due to the tuning I have in the air chamber which is based on air pressure and or, air volume spacers. As the fork compresses further, the resistance continues to increase. Eventually the air spring's resistance nulls out the affect of gravity and compression. This air spring resistance is known as the air spring curve rate.

Where I to run "Too" low an air pressure, my fork air spring would not offer enough resistance to overcome gravity and the effect of my body pushing down on the fork. The fork would eventually bottom out and all compression absorption would cease. The sudden stop would immediately cause my body weight to shift downwards and forwards and a fantastic trip over the bars would result. Wahoo!

You can run a low air pressure. Just make sure it's not so low you bottom out the fork and crash. I hope this helps you better understand the effects of running an air spring pressure that is too low. Bottoming out a fork is never a good thing and it could lead to a bad crash.

You asked earlier about heavy riders on Levo's. My buddy John weighs 270 lbs. and rides a Levo Carbon Comp. He has a ZEB 170 of the front of his bike. He's running the stock Float X off of the rear. John has a sticker on his Levo that states "You ever seen a fat man fly?" John likes to hit jumps, big drops and rock gardens. He's never had an issue with frame flexing, etc. The Levo is an incredibly good bike.

Here are some pictures from my friends and I most recent bike trip to Hurricane Utah. We were trying to avoid all the rain California's been receiving. The rain and snow followed us to Utah, it was in the upper 30's and windy on some days.

Gooseberry Mesa

John on "Salt on the Rim", Guacamole Mesa

Precipice Trail, Saint George Utah

Sidewinder, Precipice and Suicidal Tendencies, Saint George Utah. Left to right my buddy Dan on his Trek Rail, Rob on his Pivot AM, John on his Trek Rail and Ed on his Orbea Wild. Not seen in the picture is Rob on his Pivot Lt and me on my Levo.

Guacamole mesa flow with Zion National Park as a beautiful back drop.

Sidewinder Trail, Saint George Utah. Rob aka Rusty Iron on eMTB Forum in blue. My buddies Dan and John on the trail above us.

My brother Rich (Background) and I on Gooseberry Mesa. My absolute favorite type of riding is technical rock crawling on the mesa's of Hurricane Utah.

The IMBA Hurricane Rim Epic Trail. Who doesn't love a little high speed flow...

Gould's Rim, Hurricane Rim Trail

John and my Levos, post ride beer stop at the Main Street Cafe. Awesome!

 

[decooney]

Excellent reply @Rod B. , and great photos and story too. Thanks for sharing all of that. The 10mm buffer at the bottom of the shock helped too. Was wondering what the mid-stage and ceiling limit should look like and how to check that., on the trails. Thank You!

 

[Rod B.]

Excellent reply @Rod B. , and great photos and story too. Thanks for sharing all of that. The 10mm buffer at the bottom of the shock helped too. Was wondering what the mid-stage and ceiling limit should look like and how to check that., on the trails. Thank You!

As I ride, I'll occasionally slide the fork and rear shock O rings down to their wiper seal before I hit a technical section. After the section, I'll glance down and see where the O rings are positioned. This lets me know where I'm at with my air spring tuning. What I tune in Southern California will not be what I tune in Las Vegas, Hurricane, Moab, Downieville, Tahoe, etc. Regarding the rear shock, you never want to see the O ring pushed off the back of the shock cylinder. That means you bottomed out the shock. That's a good way to break the rear triangle on a hard hit.

There's no hard or fast rule as to the air spring progression rate for your fork or shock. You can tune the spring compression rate via air volume spacers and air pressure. It very much depends upon how and where you ride. The fork/shock set up guidelines that Fox and Rockshox provide are just that, guidelines. They get you in the ballpark, they are not a hard and fast rule, they are made to be broken, however never exceed maximum pressure specifications.