I Backed Out of New E-MTB Purchase

[jimborae]

So I was all ready to purchase a new Whyte E150 29er" from my LBS and then I heard I was going to lose my job due to Covid. Well thankfully I didn't and continued to proceed with the order. However as days passed I started thinking more about it and cancelled the order following reasons:

1. I test rode a Levo from another shop and to be honest I wasn't that impressed apart from going uphills. It felt incredibly inert, the weight of it was a really issue for me and generally it just felt really cumbersome going through relatively easy trails local to me.

2. I'm really worried about the longevity of curent e-bikes in general in comparision to the cost. I tend to keep bikes a long time, 5-10 years generally, but I had an old Orange Clockwork that I bought new 26yrs ago (I loved the steel frame feel of it). My point is that if I invest say £5-6K on a E-MTB now, will I be able to get a new battery or compatable motor & spares for it in say 7yrs time. Bearing in mind that unlike conventional bikes, there are no standards for motors or battery sizes and fittings etc. Then on top of that is the insane cost of replacement batteries which are generally around a 1/5th of the cost of the bike, in part probably due to lack of said standards. What I don't want is to be effectively left with a very expensive paperweight 7yrs from now due to high cost or lack of availability of replacement parts.

So I decided to build another trail full susser to replace my old 2009 Whyte e-5 team, to tide me over till I'm more comfortable with longevity of e-bikes. Am I mad or am I right to have these concerns?

 

[Sander23]

That's the thing that worries me to, the motor.
I have a 2nd gen chipped motor with 6400km on it, but I have no clue how long the motor will last. I didn't find anywhere online a replacement Bosch motor, what it will cost, or how I can obtain one. Battery's can be bought anywhere online

 

[yorkshire89]

These are all valid concerns. You really need to be 100% sure before dropping so much money on a bike.
Most of my riding is shuttling up fireroads and dropping back down descents and repeat. I get so much more riding in on an ebike that it makes sense (to me atleast).
It's much heavier than my enduro bike and on some trails with flat corners you have to start taking the turn much earlier which does make it feel a bit like a boat to handle, but for the majority of stuff it feels pretty much the same as my normal bike.
I still have as much fun descending on it - sometimes more because the weight inspires confidence, and I get twice the amount of descending for the same effort.

Can't really comment on the longevity, I'd hope to get a replacement before anything becomes obselete.

 

[smtkelly]

Chances are as with power tools, phones etc there will be a market in reconditioned or grey batteries. Its just not an industry yet as few people have hit end of battery life.

For motors I'm guess there will be a cottage industry spring up on reconditioning older motors (like the bearing guy). When forks first came out I think there were like 2 places in the UK you could get them serviced. You might also find you could upgrade the motors e8000 to ep8 for example. Its doable but cost and parts availability is prohibitive. In the future new old stock/2nd hand parts and better 3rd party specialists might make that an affordable possibility.

I too also keep my bikes a long time my current bike is 2007 foe fly. I wanted to give it a cheap refresh ditch my heavy 3x DH cranks and change to a 1x11. It was a rabbit hole of changing standards by the time I added it all up it made no economic sense. So all bikes end up falling behind the progress of standards.

 

[Mteam]

Just because you cant buy a replacement motor from chain reaction or wiggle like you might buy a new bottom bracket, doesnt mean that you wont be able to replace a broken motor in (say) 5 years time.


The motors may not be on open sale , but you'll be able to pay your local bosch/shimano/specialized dealer to fix it for you. Exactly the same as you would do if the motor expires when in warranty, except it will cost you.


There may also be a market in 'unofficial' reconditioned motors.

Batteries will just keep getting cheaper, So a bosch battery now is ~£650 - in a few years I'd expect them to be much cheaper (because the new bikes will be coming with 20mwh batteries or something).

I think you'll have no problem in keeping an old e bike going, but it probably does have a shorter life span than a normal bike (which could be still going in 50 years time)

 

[B1rdie]

At 60 and having had the surprise to have a stent placed at my coronary last april, I am not concerned uf a new bike will last 10 years + anymore.
So, I would say: do not miss the chance of owning and riding an ebike. My canyon spectral is the most expensive bike I ever had and it has made me so very happy these last two years that it has already worth its price in return for the joy it brought to my riding experiences.

 

[Sidepod]

I'm just hoping this fad with electricity will fade and we can all get back to riding 500cc 2 strokes......

Seriously tho, don't over think it. Ebikes are great fun. Dive in.

 

[jimborae]

Chances are as with power tools, phones etc there will be a market in reconditioned or grey batteries. Its just not an industry yet as few people have hit end of battery life.

For motors I'm guess there will be a cottage industry spring up on reconditioning older motors (like the bearing guy). When forks first came out I think there were like 2 places in the UK you could get them serviced. You might also find you could upgrade the motors e8000 to ep8 for example. Its doable but cost and parts availability is prohibitive. In the future new old stock/2nd hand parts and better 3rd party specialists might make that an affordable possibility.

I too also keep my bikes a long time my current bike is 2007 foe fly. I wanted to give it a cheap refresh ditch my heavy 3x DH cranks and change to a 1x11. It was a rabbit hole of changing standards by the time I added it all up it made no economic sense. So all bikes end up falling behind the progress of standards.

Yeah I guess till things become more standardised we'll have to pin our hopes on the secondhand/reconditioned industry.

Re your Foes, I'm a bit surprised that you struggled to update that to a 1x drivetrain, my Whyte E-5 was fairly straight forward to update to a 1x config. Admittedly I kept it to 1x10 to keep costs down & increase compatability and had a few spares around that also kept costs down.

 

[jimborae]

And I guess I also have a 3rd issue, which is around trying out e-MTB's. Before I drop a vast amount of money on a bike, I really would like to try it out. With the Specialized Turbo Levo comp I was able to do this, albeit with a slighly ropey previous years model and it was enough to tell me that I didn't like that bike. The other bike shop assured me that Whyte was significantly different and would be better suited to me but crucially, due to Covid, they had no test bike that I could try out, except for a quick whip around the car park. In the end that made my mind up, until I can try one out, on my local routes, I'm not going to drop £5.5K on a bike. Internet research & YouTube can only take you so far but until you swing a leg over one & ride it you wont know if it's right for you.

 

[Konanige]

And I guess I also have a 3rd issue, which is around trying out e-MTB's. Before I drop a vast amount of money on a bike, I really would like to try it out. With the Specialized Turbo Levo comp I was able to do this, albeit with a slighly ropey previous years model and it was enough to tell me that I didn't like that bike. The other bike shop assured me that Whyte was significantly different and would be better suited to me but crucially, due to Covid, they had no test bike that I could try out, except for a quick whip around the car park. In the end that made my mind up, until I can try one out, on my local routes, I'm not going to drop £5.5K on a bike. Internet research & YouTube can only take you so far but until you swing a leg over one & ride it you wont know if it's right for you.

Have you tried the Levo SL, like you I wasn't keen on the handling of the FF Levo so I had decided not to bother, until that was my LBS manager said they had just had the first SL test bike in and would I like to take it out for the day. At 56 and not getting any younger I put down deposit as soon as and the last 1400 miles are history!!!

 

[jimborae]

Have you tried the Levo SL, like you I wasn't keen on the handling of the FF Levo so I had decided not to bother, until that was my LBS manager said they had just had the first SL test bike in and would I like to take it out for the day. At 56 and not getting any younger I put down deposit as soon as and the last 1400 miles are history!!!

Nope not tried the SL, the local Specialised Concept store had them in stock, but again no test bike available, they only had a ff Levo demonstrator.

Also interestingly the manager wasn’t very happy with the way Specialised were taking their geometry on the new models as he said they were going even slacker on the head angles, I’d tend to agree with that, especially for the type of riding you can do round where I live.

 

[Konanige]

Do you mean its too slack or not slack enough?

 

[steve_sordy]

At 60 and having had the surprise to have a stent placed at my coronary last april, I am not concerned uf a new bike will last 10 years + anymore.
So, I would say: do not miss the chance of owning and riding an ebike. My canyon spectral is the most expensive bike I ever had and it has made me so very happy these last two years that it has already worth its price in return for the joy it brought to my riding experiences.

I'm 100% with you @B1rdie. I have arthritic knees and if it wasn't for "e" I wouldn't be doing mtb at all.
I have posted elsewhere about Shimano's reluctance to be clear about spares back up for the e8000 motors. But when it comes down to it, if I end up with my Focus Jam2 being useless and fit only for spare parts, then I'd sell if for spares and shell out for a brand new bike. Just not one that has a Shimano motor.
Life is too short not to have an emtb!

 

[Monkey Dog]

I use mine every day for my commute. My last ebike kit paid for itself as I don't use my vehicle. My new ebike is quickly approaching 1000miles & eventually it will pay for itself.
That's my stance on it.

 

[Sidepod]

You could go the route I did and pick up a bargain on eBay. There seems no shortage of Lockdown-eebs people have tired of after two outings.

 

[jimborae]

Do you mean its too slack or not slack enough?

It'll be going too slack for me.

 

[jimborae]

I'm 100% with you @B1rdie. I have arthritic knees and if it wasn't for "e" I wouldn't be doing mtb at all.
I have posted elsewhere about Shimano's reluctance to be clear about spares back up for the e8000 motors. But when it comes down to it, if I end up with my Focus Jam2 being useless and fit only for spare parts, then I'd sell if for spares and shell out for a brand new bike. Just not one that has a Shimano motor.
Life is too short not to have an emtb!

So this is why I first started looking into E-MTB's, my right knee appears to be shot and sometimes I if I go on a long ride or too much uphill torquing the knee, the next day or two is absolute agony and my knee swells up.

I would have thought Shimano, being so massive, would have been a better bet for carrying spares etc into the future but what you're saying is concerning.

 

[jimborae]

You could go the route I did and pick up a bargain on eBay. There seems no shortage of Lockdown-eebs people have tired of after two outings.

I've looked into it but the lack of warranty & my ability to finance the bike via Ride to Work scheme means that the eBay route doesn't make sense to me in my particular circumstance.

 

[smtkelly]

Re your Foes, I'm a bit surprised that you struggled to update that to a 1x drivetrain,

My hope hub was the sticking point, I spoke to hope (always helpful guys) to get a modern freehub I'd need to replace every part inside hub. A quick glance on-line showed out-stock (yay ?2020).

What started as lighter cranks, became a whole new group set, freehub, and effectively a new rear hub

 

[jimborae]

I think I need to try & find a Whyte stockist in Berkshire/Hampshire area that actually has demonstrators available and see if that can help me come to right decision.

 

[KeithR]

I think I need to try & find a Whyte stockist in Berkshire/Hampshire area that actually has demonstrators available and see if that can help me come to right decision.

A Whyte is likely to be as much of a lump as you found the Levo to be.

Konanige makes a good point about the SL - it sounds more like the kind of bike you seem to be looking for.

An Orbea Rise might well be worth your attention too.

 

[Zimmerframe]

It'll be going too slack for me.

Not wanting to make things more difficult, but so you're going in eyes open ..

You do know a levo is 66 degree head angle and a whyte e-150 is 64.7 - so slacker than a levo ?

And an alloy Levo is about 21kg's, a size Medium Whyte is 23.8kg's - so heavier than a levo....

 

[jimborae]

Thanks, Old levo's were 66 degree, 2021 Levo is 64.8 degrees so pretty much the same, and yes the Whyte is about a kilo heavier. So you're right and it just re-enforces the fact that I need to ride the bloody things before buying & that I was probably right to have backed out of the Whyte purchase.

 

[KeithR]

it just re-enforces the fact that I need to ride the bloody things before buying

For sure - you're the only person who can tell you what works for you.

 

[Gary]

I backed out of a threesome with Cheryl Cole and Sarah Harding.
Still regret the decision almost 20years later.

Life's too short for regrets ?

 

[Zimmerframe]

I backed out and of a threesome with Cheryl Cole and Sarah Harding.
Still regret the decision almost 20years later.

Life's too short for regrets ?

Yeah, but think how happy you made them for the next 20 years !

 

[Dave_h34]

Buying a normal full susser 1 year before the ebike was the biggest waste of money for me. It's not been touched in 2 years...

 

[jimborae]

I backed out and of a threesome with Cheryl Cole and Sarah Harding.
Still regret the decision almost 20years later.

Life's too short for regrets ?

I think you dodged a bullet there mate, never know what you might of caught..?

 

[mak]

Seriously, planning life's financial issues 5-10 years in advance? Fu%k that, I'm 52 and realise I could be be dead in 3 months or sooner. I have no idea whats round the corner.

I've lived my life like this since I was 30, I'm also a hypochondriac so that's probably why I'm always skint but at least I've had some serious toys to play with over the years.

 

[jimborae]

Seriously, planning life's financial issues 5-10 years in advance? Fu%k that, I'm 52 and realise I could be be dead in 3 months or sooner. I have no idea whats round the corner.

I've lived my life like this since I was 30, I'm also a hypochondriac so that's probably why I'm always skint but at least I've had some serious toys to play with over the years.

It's not really about planning financial issues in advance, it's about wanting to make the right choice initially & keep my toys running if possible in the future. If there's one thing I hate about the world today its the seemingly disposable society we live in. Conversely I love fixing things, no matter if it's electronics, cars, bikes, DIY etc.