Hi people

[118]

Pukmeister - which model Levo was you tempted by? I'm sure there's many a happy Levo owner out there, given the fact of how much that they have paid for their kit! I'm still trawling through all the Levo 'nonsense', to work out if it's just hype, or have I really missed something? Hence my q's to confirm my thinking.. Most I have seen are running 29s so they're not too much of a must for me at present. Although I know I can flip a chip and ride 650s on them. However tomorrow, I'll be taking a look at some in the flesh. And before you scream NOOOO, they'll be Giant's there too..2 birds, 1 stone.. With the impending 2020's coming, I'm simply looking to see what 'clearance' deals are out there, for now..

Then I'm hoping to get along to see some Scott/Cube at my old LBS. That's if they are still trading as there's been nothing updated online recently, so perhaps is now simply concentrating on the rental side of things, or uses Facemuck as their preferred media. I don't do Facemuck.

The terrible record of numerous repeated problems is just insane.
People pay around 5-6,000 US$ for what?
The dream of a great bike according to some fake review?

Is this still the case or have Spech now addressed this? Surely with so much bad press surrounding these puppies, it can't be good for future sales? Or again, have these issues been masked by clever marketing, brainwashed by the masses, who have spent a fortune on their choice? I've not seen too many reviews online, that don't praise the whole package. However elsewhere, it's a different story, so I'm glad I came onboard, to do some research before parting with my hard earned. Not everyone gets given the opportunity of increased dealer support/products, simply because their youtube channel is well subscribed. I'm very aware that youtube has become a very strong platform to endorse companies and products, and to give a, dare I say a potentially, biased review, having had the luxury of a few 'freebies'.. I prefer honesty and choice.

Pure nonsense!

Karsten

Can you expand on this please?

118.

 

[khorn]

Pukmeister - which model Levo was you tempted by? I'm sure there's many a happy Levo owner out there, given the fact of how much that they have paid for their kit! I'm still trawling through all the Levo 'nonsense', to work out if it's just hype, or have I really missed something? Hence my q's to confirm my thinking.. Most I have seen are running 29s so they're not too much of a must for me at present. Although I know I can flip a chip and ride 650s on them. However tomorrow, I'll be taking a look at some in the flesh. And before you scream NOOOO, they'll be Giant's there too..2 birds, 1 stone.. With the impending 2020's coming, I'm simply looking to see what 'clearance' deals are out there, for now..

Then I'm hoping to get along to see some Scott/Cube at my old LBS. That's if they are still trading as there's been nothing updated online recently, so perhaps is now simply concentrating on the rental side of things, or uses Facemuck as their preferred media. I don't do Facemuck.


Is this still the case or have Spech now addressed this? Surely with so much bad press surrounding these puppies, it can't be good for future sales? Or again, have these issues been masked by clever marketing, brainwashed by the masses, who have spent a fortune on their choice? I've not seen too many reviews online, that don't praise the whole package. However elsewhere, it's a different story, so I'm glad I came onboard, to do some research before parting with my hard earned. Not everyone gets given the opportunity of increased dealer support/products, simply because their youtube channel is well subscribed. I'm very aware that youtube has become a very strong platform to endorse companies and products, and to give a, dare I say a potentially, biased review, having had the luxury of a few 'freebies'.. I prefer honesty and choice.


Can you expand on this please?

118.

The person who made the statement is a troll and I would love to see any statistical evidence that his statements indeed are true and until hard proof...... just a statement. The reason why you hear about many specialized issues here is because it’s the dominant bike brand on this forum. By just reading threads here it is obvious that Shimano motors have equal or maybe even more issues. Myself have had a Levo for about 1 1/2 year with absolutely not a single issue at all. The loud crowd is usually those that have the issues and the rest are silent.

Karsten

 

[118]

The person who made the statement is a troll and I would love to see any statistical evidence that his statements indeed are true and until hard proof...... just a statement. The reason why you hear about many specialized issues here is because it’s the dominant bike brand on this forum. By just reading threads here it is obvious that Shimano motors have equal or maybe even more issues. Myself have had a Levo for about 1 1/2 year with absolutely not a single issue at all. The loud crowd is usually those that have the issues and the rest are silent.

Karsten

The person? I've replied to two people, so I'm a little unsure who you are directing the troll comment to? Dominant, through brand? Or elitist marketing?

I'll second your comment about the loud crowd. However I like to hear both sides of every story before making a judgement. I've already stated that, there must be many out there, who don't have an issue and are very pleased. Joining a forum was paramount for me to get this knowledge, good or bad. I need to hear more than a single review, from a well supported channel, promoting their shop or 'sponsored' products though. I'd rather read a 100 or more. honest, unbiased reviews, to get a better balanced understanding of whether a product would work for me, as I don't have the liberty of an extended, try before I buy. Very few do..
Whether I choose to buy something with a 'known fault', is my perogative. I'd have made a calculated choice, based on the above facts. Given this I would equally expect, should I have an issue, that the dealer I made the purchase from, would support both myself and preserve his reputation, on finding a suitable remedy.

118.

 

[khorn]

The person? I've replied to two people, so I'm a little unsure who you are directing the troll comment to? Dominant, through brand? Or elitist marketing?

I'll second your comment about the loud crowd. However I like to hear both sides of every story before making a judgement. I've already stated that, there must be many out there, who don't have an issue and are very pleased. Joining a forum was paramount for me to get this knowledge, good or bad. I need to hear more than a single review, from a well supported channel, promoting their shop or 'sponsored' products though. I'd rather read a 100 or more. honest, unbiased reviews, to get a better balanced understanding of whether a product would work for me, as I don't have the liberty of an extended, try before I buy. Very few do..
Whether I choose to buy something with a 'known fault', is my perogative. I'd have made a calculated choice, based on the above facts. Given this I would equally expect, should I have an issue, that the dealer I made the purchase from, would support both myself and preserve his reputation, on finding a suitable remedy.

118.

Sorry, just to clarify I referred to the 33red guy.

I totally agree with your last statement but when one state a specific product is inferior you have to back it up by hard facts or I would consider it gibberish.
Many people here tend to advocate for a specific bike or brand just because they own one themselves, they probably do that as they consider it the perfect bike for them(at least I hope so) but does it also count for me? By all means maybe yes, maybe no. I would turn it the other way around, if a specific bike or whole brand were such a POS, it would probably not sit on the majority of the market share, good marketing or not.

Karsten

 

[118]

Karsten - Thanks for the reply. I don't disagree with you. As previously stated, none of us are wrong, just a difference in opinions.
I can understand why a brand is more prominant than another. For some it will be elitist and a show of wealth. All the gear, and no idea types. Others will be persuaded, because in their mind it is a superior product. This is why one buys an SUV, whilst another will buy a Leaf - different modes and needs, however it's still a means of transport. I say tomato, you say tomatoe.

Should the founders of this site, have all started out on Spech's, then it's no surprise that these are so popular, as surely this platform was created with many likeminded riders wanting to share their tales of trails and woes. I've not idea of the origin's as I've only been here a week, and to be honest, it's not my concern either way. There's more than enough to keep me interested, outside of the rights and wrongs.

118.

 

[33red]

Pukmeister - which model Levo was you tempted by? I'm sure there's many a happy Levo owner out there, given the fact of how much that they have paid for their kit! I'm still trawling through all the Levo 'nonsense', to work out if it's just hype, or have I really missed something? Hence my q's to confirm my thinking.. Most I have seen are running 29s so they're not too much of a must for me at present. Although I know I can flip a chip and ride 650s on them. However tomorrow, I'll be taking a look at some in the flesh. And before you scream NOOOO, they'll be Giant's there too..2 birds, 1 stone.. With the impending 2020's coming, I'm simply looking to see what 'clearance' deals are out there, for now..

Then I'm hoping to get along to see some Scott/Cube at my old LBS. That's if they are still trading as there's been nothing updated online recently, so perhaps is now simply concentrating on the rental side of things, or uses Facemuck as their preferred media. I don't do Facemuck.


Is this still the case or have Spech now addressed this? Surely with so much bad press surrounding these puppies, it can't be good for future sales? Or again, have these issues been masked by clever marketing, brainwashed by the masses, who have spent a fortune on their choice? I've not seen too many reviews online, that don't praise the whole package. However elsewhere, it's a different story, so I'm glad I came onboard, to do some research before parting with my hard earned. Not everyone gets given the opportunity of increased dealer support/products, simply because their youtube channel is well subscribed. I'm very aware that youtube has become a very strong platform to endorse companies and products, and to give a, dare I say a potentially, biased review, having had the luxury of a few 'freebies'.. I prefer honesty and choice.


Can you expand on this please?

118.

Just yesterday i read more or less from memory
*** failure a few months old bike about 2,000km***
if you search you can read what people write.
To me it is not acceptable but some are happy not to pay for
repair/replacement so you decide. If my 2017 reached 3640 kms no issue i do think a 2018, 2019 should not fail so fast. If you value reliable read about that subject. You should consider most reviews like a disguised form of advertising. Some call it cool-aid.

 

[118]

33red - all reviews are promotion. If they are positive, it's to ensure everyone knows that they've made the correct choice. If it's negative, then it's to drum up support for a suitable replacement. Or sometimes, it's to try and convince others that their initial choice wasn't ill informed. All products can fail. The more that are sold, then the likelyhood is greatly increased.
It's that vast knowledge available on forums that allows you to make better informed choices. Providing, you can decipher the truth in it all.

118.

 

[Rusty]

Rusty - 70's monoshocks! I can remember riding twin shock as a kid, blimey.. certainly showing our ages now .. Is this because the Levo's rear triangle is too stiff, that you feel it's a bad design, transferring additional loads/energy through the top tube? Or just a poor pivot design? Perhaps to someone less experienced, the ride 'quality' is surpassed by simply getting out and riding. Clever marketing has created the specialized 'tax' I feel.. 20 years ago I has a FS Marin and no matter how much compression/rebound was dialled in, it hopped regardless, however I was 20 years younger back then...

I'm intrigued to see how much those flyon's lunch transmissions, given the increased torque that they produce.

May I ask you about wheels? As stated, I'm happiest on 650s. Given the additional weight of an ebike, do you think that the gyroscopics of 29s, is counteracted by this?

118.

Yup - old. Was testing for Suzuki and got called in to do a couple tests on Yamaha - walked away after a couple weeks as I hated the monoshock with a passion. Did race a YZ250C for a while but was faster on an older RH250.
Anyhoo - It is the suspension design with the shock pointing towards the top of the headset that is the issue. That transfers kinectic energy to where is really is not wanted. If you note with MX bikes, they all have a vertical shock in their linkage setup - for a reason.
As I said - for lightweight XC bikes or casual cruising it is not an issue.

Will be interesting to see how things happen with the Flyon. I have folded a derailleur on my Scott under load in a climb - and have also done the same thing on my analogue. My weight and putting out serious power in my legs really stresses things.

Wheel wise - I came from 26" to become a very early adapter to wagon wheels. Imported my first 29er before any were available locally and have stayed with them. Had a loaner eGenius with 27.5 for a month or so until my bike arrived in country and while it perhaps turned slightly better on very sharp switchbacks there is not a huge difference as the rolling circumference between 2.8 x 27.5 and 2.6 x 29 is marginal. With the 2.8 tires being of the same brand and build as the 2.6 x 29 tires the wheels were actually heavier by a few grams. Can't say I noticed any difference in acceleration but on gnarly, root infested climbs the 29 wheels seem to work better but the 27.5 with the bigger volume tire have a slight edge going down similar terrain.

Have stayed with 29 as it allows me to swap tires between bikes and I only need 1 size tube in my kit. Saying that, if Yamaha comes out with a quieter motor and a bigger battery I would be keen to pick up a Giant and they run 27.5.

 

[Rusty]

Just yesterday i read more or less from memory
*** failure a few months old bike about 2,000km***
if you search you can read what people write.
To me it is not acceptable but some are happy not to pay for
repair/replacement so you decide. If my 2017 reached 3640 kms no issue i do think a 2018, 2019 should not fail so fast. If you value reliable read about that subject. You should consider most reviews like a disguised form of advertising. Some call it cool-aid.

Have come across 3 or 4 Giants that are Yamaha powered which have failed on their first or second ride out. The reason you see more about failed Brose is that there are way more of them out on the trails than Yamaha powered bikes from my observation.

 

[33red]

Have come across 3 or 4 Giants that are Yamaha powered which have failed on their first or second ride out. The reason you see more about failed Brose is that there are way more of them out on the trails than Yamaha powered bikes from my observation.

Giants are Yamaha with a twist. I am lucky i am full Yamaha. In Quebec still many say when my knees are real bad or a version of that so i rarely see any Ebike live. The showrooms have many Shimano. Now that i have a better idea about Ebikes i will try to test them all because finally it is a good match for us or it is a pass. Marin and Giant have demos soon, hopefully some Ebikes will be available.

 

[Rusty]

The only twist is some firmware changes - the motors are exactly the same.

 

[33red]

The only twist is some firmware changes - the motors are exactly the same.

I tought they were using their own battery but i might be wrong

 

[118]

Rusty - I'm catching you up chap! RM or RH? I knew you'd comeback with shock position, being the key. That was the 'issue' I had with the Marin. Eventually got fed up blowing seals on the manitou's and wiping up spilt oil. Spent more time on the front end, as no amount of hanging my backside off the back of seat kept it planted. And I wouldn't say I was overly aggressive neither, way back then, although others would disagree.. Which Levo are you currently on, and have you found that the shock issue, still exists, or have we slowed up enough, to get by unnoticed? Plenty have made changes to theirs, whether it be the need to upgrade inferior/worn parts, or just to make theirs stand out from the rest, only they will be able to answer that..

By switching to flyon, are you hoping for less personal input, due to the torque gains? 120nm is quite a hike, I have to say..emtb's are forever evolving at present. I guess this is where the most interest is though. A world where some have never experienced the true delights of a 2T powerband, or even the nostalgic scent of one.

Thanks for your comments on 29s. Interesting to note. I guess the proof is in the eating. Like all things, there's a compromise. In my mind, 29s are faster in a straight line and 650s turn better. The few I know on them will only ride them. The same for 650s. I started on 26s like every boy (our age) had too, then jumped to 650s. I borrowed a 29HT, funnily enough, a Spech, however didn't feel happy on it. Felt more like i was sat inbetween the wheels rather than being on top of it, but appreciate that could have been the geometry that gave that impression. Perhaps because it wasn't mine neither, mentally that played a part in how it felt..

I was aware that Yam/Giant are the same motor with different firmware. I thought Giant sourced their own power pack, as I'm sure I've read somewhere, that it's quite heavy in comparison? I also believe that once the power has been set to suit, you can get some reasonable mileage out of them, providing you aren't full gas all of the time? I guess that can be said for any battery though. I too would prefer to have an extended range within the one pack. I like the fact that the Spech can be upgraded, power wise, without the need for a bolt/strap on, to give more range.
Keeping with the motorcycle theme, I see that Harley Davidson have taken a step into ebikes.. I can't imagine many a local trooper, trading in his iron horse, to get to the base, in the summer. Mind you, leather chaps, on an emtb, would make for an interesting look..

33red - do you not currently ride?

118.

 

[33red]

We had nice weather i was riding a lot, happy 2 improve my skills.
Bad luck broken rear derailleur about 5 days hoping to get my ebike the next day so i was bummmed ridind less on my backup. Finaly got it back, had a sweet ride = feel better

 

[118]

33red - what is it that you are currently riding?

 

[33red]

Last dec. i found an unsold Haibike 2017 so i did my snow fatbike season and started using it 4 months ago. The prior season i was on 21 pounds HT 100 mm 29er
https://winora-group.com/manuals/2017/specs/HAI_sduro_specs/HAI_SDURO_hardseven_60.pdf

 

[Rusty]

Rusty - I'm catching you up chap! RM or RH? I knew you'd comeback with shock position, being the key.

Was a test rider for the RM series. Had a dealer team RH74 had the RH75 rear geometry & that was faster and much better handling than my 1976 YZ250C. that

Which Levo are you currently on, and have you found that the shock issue, still exists, or have we slowed up enough, to get by unnoticed?

2019 Levo Comp. Yes, I still ride hard enough to notice the way it loads up compared to my Scott. Nothing I am too worried about as I am mostly just cruising at my advanced age & size.

By switching to flyon, are you hoping for less personal input, due to the torque gains? 120nm is quite a hike, I have to say..emtb's are forever evolving at present. I guess this is where the most interest is though. A world where some have never experienced the true delights of a 2T powerband, or even the nostalgic scent of one.

Not really planning a move - probably more likely to go for a Scott with the Bosch CX but a Yamaha powered Giant or the Haibike are options if the new generation motors are quieter and more efficient. Especially if they have bigger battery options.

I started on 26s like every boy (our age) had too, then jumped to 650s. I borrowed a 29HT, funnily enough, a Spech, however didn't feel happy on it.

Only started riding bicycles in my 40s - was on motorbikes from 11 or so as a youngster. Rode a few Speccys but thought they were over-priced crap and that 'brain' shock system was a total joke.

 

[118]

33red - you can never have too many bikes!

Rusty - c'mon man, you know it's all about the brass mass! Saves on additional twin lock cables surely Again, more hype for the masses.. It was obviously a winner, as it see lots of them out on the trials these days.. gotta love a gimmick!

118.

 

[JetSetDemo]

Hi 118, I grew up riding my Night Bomber around Thetford forest in the 80's and now live in the East Mids between Cannock and the Peaks, a recurring theme reading this post. I took the plunge in 2017 with my first Levo. I have always had MTB's usually GT hard tails but upgraded to a Specialized Camber around 6 years ago when I decided life in the midlands was too good an opportunity to miss hitting much bigger trails in the peaks and wales, you can pretty much get anywhere apart from Glentress in a few hours.

So what do I think. Well I rode my 17 Levo Expert for around a 1000 miles over 18 months and apart from a snapped chain on the very first ride, my fault not the bikes had no issues. Unfortunately both the motor and the battery died 18 months in, I was kind of looking at the new 19 Levo's anyway around that time. They were very few actually available for delivery at that time so I was just window shopping really and also not prepared to go back to my wife for permission so soon after dropping £5200 on a 'Bike that will last me years' or some other such nonsense I spouted after I surprised her with my new bike.

We were due on a forum ride in Swinnley that Sunday so I called Chris at Berkshire cycles to see if they could get me up and running. I called on the Monday after the ride that killed the bike that Sunday and Chris was amazing, I travelled down the following Saturday and they replaced everything under warranty inside of 2hrs whilst I waited, I didn't even get the bike from them originally!

Chris actually told me after talking to him about the new 2019 Levo I would do just as well to keep my 17 with the new motor and battery and keep on enjoying it, which I did for a while. However you know how these things go.

In April I was in a position to be able to afford a new 2019 expert, I knew from a few big rides that 500w was sometimes just not quite enough, especially if you go to a place like BPW without the up lift. I pulled the trigger on the bike whilst we were on vacation, a drunken holiday in Jamaica will allow you to get away with anything it seems.

I think my life had changed so much in the last 2 years that my wife was of the opinion that the whole EMTB thing had been so positive for me in many more ways than just ridding that life was too short not to indulge me, you are a long time dead after all.

I kind of loved the whole plus size tire thing on the 17 but remembered how much I had enjoyed the 29" on my old camber. In the end getting back on the new 2019 Levo sold that to me all over again, I also sized up. My 2017 was a medium, I am not much taller than you at 5.9" (and a bit) so never considered a large when I got me original Levo. However the Large Expert 19 just felt more right, and this came to be fact, as when I went ridding with a few of the well know guys on this forum on the new bike they all noted how much faster I genuinely was, and also I seemed to have found my bollocks!

I kept the 2017 for my wife. It's actually still a really good bike, its quieter than the 19 for sure, and with a women's specific saddle fits my wife a treat, we spent a fantastic weekend in the lakes ridding Whinlatter reds, something she has never done before. It was not worth selling, at 2 years old I would have been able to get back maybe half of what I paid for it so just better to keep it so we can both enjoy.

I also now work shifts, sort of. I had a change with my role at work and I now find my self free between 10am-4pm, I ride now most every day, either the local at Hicks lodge or just a 40min drive down the Chase, all good fun.

I think we have a lot in common.

So to sum up. Most if not all this generation EMTB's are great. The Levo is a good bike with the 19 being a good step forward over the 17/18 MY, even the faults that it does have I have not had issues with. I've already done 700 miles so I am ridding a lot more than I have done over the past 2 years, The Specialized warranty is superb and they have several outstanding dealers, not just Berkshire cycles, I know Thetford forest well and even though you wont have too much elevation a good EMTB will be awesome on the trail's and you will start venturing further a field for sure.

If I am ever down that way visiting family or friends I will drop you a message, I have leant my old Levo to a few guys on the forum when they have been bikeless so if you still haven't got one by the next time I am down I could always bring both bikes with me for you to try out.

Take it easy 118

D

 

[HikerDave]

Pukmeister - Aha, without looking into specs, I was thinking the 2 superseded the 1 and so on. How wrong you can be, lol..Without wishing to appear obtuse or crass, cost isn't the issue. Like you, I want the best bang for buck. My ambition will always outweigh my talent, as it mostly has my entire life, whether that be girls, work etc..

All the talk of the new bikes, seems to be better batteries and improved power plants. I too am a similar age and build to yourself, so I'm taking a lot of notice to what you are saying.. I can't spin my legs like Chris Froome, or dare I say Lance Armstrong, as I've got strong enough legs, or once had, to over gear my climbs and power through the inclines. For me it was less effort, rather than spinning away and effectively not going forward, fast enough. Maybe that's a thing I transferred from my motorbikes, as that was always, if it's spinning you aren't driving. Or it's a throwback to when i was riding racer type bikes as a kid and needing to get somewhere, I shouldn't have been to, quick...

I think that's where my LBS went wrong. Perhaps with all the numpties wafting in from Centre Parcs, wanting to hire bikes, he lost sight of those fun riders, who should have become regular customers. I couldn't justify buying a bike worthy of winning the world title on, to just rag round the woods. I chose to race, to learn new trials, as the well marked trials became full of over protective, aggressive parents, who also hadn't ridden a bike for years, deciding it was a good thing to do on their holidays. And seemingly know better than a local, who isn't on a hire bike. It takes all sorts as none of us are wrong, just a difference of opinion. However I digress..Yes I agree, I'm looking to buy not rent. You don't hire the car you wish to test drive do you? If they are concerned I'm about to pedal off into the sunset on a 6k bike, arrange for someone to ride with me, show me a new trial, and the full capabilities of what they are trying to sell me. Job done. Although I agree, that's not always easy to do should they be city centre based..

HikerDave - why professionally tuned? Manufacturers don't spend thousands of pounds and man hours on R&D to put an inadequate shock on the steering or rear end surely? Whilst every rider is different, adjusting the amount of air, or oil in shock is something anyone can do, given a bit of research? When a suspension unit is affected by simple atmospherics alone, there's a lot of tuning to be had given the difference in the trials we ride. Thus making every unit a compromise, every ride. I have an engineering background, so don't have an issue understanding how things work mechanically, however I understand some don't and like the comfort of someone else taking that responsibility. May I ask, why you bought a bike with a steep angle, then slackened it off? I'm guessing you've fitted a shorter rear damper, if your bike is FS? Did you buy a bike that wasn't particularly suited to how or what you rode? Which SDURO model please? I'm not taking a dig at you personally, I'm just interested as to why you made the changes... with regards to lock out, I've always rode uphill solid, then flicked a switch to come down the other side. I can't see why manufacturers fit a useful product, to some riders, where others decline to use it. My orginal question was, with an ebike, is the need for a lockout system neglected by some riders, because you have pedal assistance where you don't feel the power losses? In which case, why continue to manufacture them? Perhaps the manufacturers are tied to the shock support and simply build a frame around what is available to them..

118

When I bought my Haibike SDURO FullSeven LT 4.0 for commuting at a steep discount my primary consideration was that it fit me. I needed full suspension to protect my bad SI joint from road shock; otherwise I would have just continued riding my road bike.

At the time, local trails were closed to eBikes, but many riding areas opened up soon after. The 68 degree head angle wasn’t what I wanted; and the Suntour Aion fork didn’t work as well the my Fox36 / Avalanche fork on my old FS bike, which was 160mm travel instead of 150mm So I did a fork swap and used the larger front tire from the old bike. The Suntour Fork’s biggest flaw was so much high-speed compression that it wouldn’t move on a fast rocky downhill; it would turn rigid. (Removing all volume reducers didn’t fix this).

The new Fox Factory DPS rear shock doesn’t change the bike geometry at all; I haven’t yet gotten a custom tune for this; only adjustments were maximum open-mode low-speed compression and a larger volume spacer - running about 30 percent sag. It replaced the Suntour Duair shock which didn’t have enough low-speed compression causing the bike to sag and bob on steep climbs. Plus the air can was too large so I had to pump the shock up too much to keep from bottoming out; I was running about 15 percent sag which is a pretty terrible compromise.

With these changes my bike is well-suited to how I ride; except that the rear shock could use the same Avalanche modifications I have on the old bike. The Avalanche tuning for a rider like me has a high low-speed compression that blows off very quickly so both pedal bob and wallow when climbing while standing are considerably reduced; lots fewer pedal strikes result. The Fox I put on is pretty good, though - I intended to send it in for tuning but I’ll wait for the service interval to save money.

Avalanche doesn’t tune for one size fits all; a different rider might need something different.

I think that the tuning is off on my bike because the company has different goals than me; they want to sell bikes and minimize warranty costs; I want good traction and a smooth ride.

Again, on a mid-priced bike like mine (which I got at a steep discount) low-speed compression is set light because that’s what sells in the parking lot. To keep the shock and fork from bottoming, allowing increased stress on all components and causing increased warranty costs, high-speed compression is raised to compensate for the soft low-speed compression. The engineers are doing what they are paid to do. Then I send the fork and shock to another engineer who does what I pay him to do. Actually, you don’t tell Craig at Avalanche what to do; he asks you how, where, and what you ride, who you are, and then tailors the suspension to you and your bike.

The result on my previous non e-bike was a suspension that didn’t bob or wallow under any condition, even climbing a rough trail out of the saddle, and had excellent traction whether climbing, cornering, or descending.

A higher-priced bike might not have so many problems; the Specialized Turbo Levo Expert I test rode seemed to be pretty good but that was just a parking lot side plus some fooling around in a drainage basin that had some river rock for erosion control.

TLDR you don’t need lockout if you do get a better suspension.

 

[118]

JetSetDemo - The midlands! I so miss the choice of adventures, I once had the luxury of, when I lived there. however...

By the sounds of it, you could be a brother from another mother, my friend, lol... or a sister from another mister, I'll let you decide which..!

Yes I've pedalled every inch of High Lodge, Brandon Country Park and even the lesser skidded Santon Downham areas. I've been here 12 years now so there's not much I've not pedalled over in that time, for sure.. I was once an active participant of Timber, those are the guys that help maintain the trails around here. However I dont get to join up with those much, as most of them that I knew, have departed the group for pastures new, and more recently, my change of work has put paid to that, sadly...

Cannock Chase, Sherwood Pines, even the old railway on the Tissington Trail, used to be my regular haunts, along with some local trails around Leicestershire, which is where I'm originally from. Incidently, it wasn't your cannabis that the ranger found, up the lodge, about this time last year was it? You did mention you liked the Jamacian way of life earlier...

Berkshire cycles seems to crop up an awful lot. Whether it's because I'm 'researching' on here or youtube. They are either very good at their job, or some are promoting them very well. I've watched Robs footage of his visits, so maybe its a historical thing, as my history is turned off. That said they must be doing a reasonable job as all speak highly of them..

In summary, thanks for touching base, (without wanting to sound too corporate) with your above message. It's certainly food for thought for sure. Another Levo convert? I'll keep an open mind for now, however it was on my list to look at, prior.. It's also good to know you've found your 'minerals' again too, lol. Much to the detriment of your fellow forum riders!

Wow - thanks for the offer of a ride out. Much appreciated. Will the wife be riding side saddle? Or is that too much to ask on a first date fella? For sure, next time you are this way, and work hasn't got me to pooped, by all means drop me a line

My dear old mother lives in Derby, these days, so if I've not heard from you prior, I'll shout you up for a possible meet up at the Hicks, if that suits you better, as that'll only be a quick scoot down the 42. I'm due a visit in the next month or two, so maybe we'll hook up then, if not before chap..

Thanks again
118

 

[JetSetDemo]

Message me when your up, I’m only in Ashby and more than happy to help you on the journey. ?

 

[Pukmeister]

Scott, you sound like a smart guy who is doing things right by reading reviews and forums then making your own mind up regarding specification, performance, reliability/dealer support, budget and bang-per-buck.

The Levo I had in mind when looking was a basic alloy framed turbo fsr model. As I am not competitive, a good skilled rider, or a show-off type trying to impress others, I don't need high performance components just a good solid base spec will do on a bike for me.

I can upgrade components as they wear out if need be, or keep things stock at a moderate cost rather than high cost. I don't want a bike I will quickly outgrow or one that underperforms but also I don't want to pay more than is sensible for stuff I can't appreciate or benefit from. I tend to buy mid-range stuff mostly, hence my Trance E+2.

If you bought a Levo, no way would I scream Nooooo. It could be the right one for you ??
I confess I love my Giant but for reasons that suit me and my circumstances, not because I believe it is the right bike for everyone. I hope you get to test ride many bikes and find one that you fall in love with.

Good luck with the search.

 

[JetSetDemo]

Well said, I actually approached this the other way around. I had absolutely no one to impress apart from me as I have nobody to ride with, well at least that used to be the case. Since I move every few years with my work I have no friend base where I live, let alone people I know who ride, that’s all changed now thanks to this forum.

I rode solo for just over 1 year.

I went for the Levo Expert as they were one of the few emtb’s That had a 500e battery, if you check out the ebikes scene in 2017 you will be surprised to find out most manufacturers including Spesh were offering only 425wh batteries or something like that, I had to pay a premium to get the 504w as I wanted to make sure I did not regret things down the line.

Also I hate spending more money on something after I have purchased it. What works for me is buying something at the right spec at a price I can afford and then making the most of it. I see people who buy bikes at the base level and then spend what amounts to be more than the original bike on things like breaks and forks, that’s cool if it’s what they want but definitely not for me.

I do see comments on how the Levo is under specked for the price, and that’s it’s poor value. If I could have got the larger battery on the lower spec in 3017 and also earlier this year on the 19 I may well have done that instead of spending more on the Expert (I do love the colour mind you).

So in summary, Yes the Levo is a little pricey, the components may not be the best, but that’s down to perception I am just a plain old 40 something guy ridding his bike for fun, they are definitely up to the job and work better than my 90’s GT bikes did. The warranty is a big part of the specialized value proposition, it’s good and you might need it and value is always a personal thing, I have had times in my life when I could hardly afford to eat and now things are very different but I don’t take spending the money on these bikes up front lightly, it’s hard earned after all.

I actually wanted to get the 2018 Scott E genius tuned back in 2017 with the Shimano motor as it had also 500w, but I could not get one anywhere.

What I have learned over the last couple of years is manufactures love to show you bikes now that you cat get for months, you then have to be carful not to fall in to the waiting for the next best thing camp. The sooner you get one the sooner you will be ridding, tomorrow never comes and the next bike that’s comes out is always the one you would have wished you had waited for, think that’s how the marketing is designed to work.

D

 

[33red]

JetSetD and i see it pretty much the same. Being a light rider any brakes works for me and i avoid upgrades generaly. I like to buy used, here the sales taxes = 15% on new, but no used available yet with Ebikes so i found an unsold 2017 in dec 2018. The 500 Wh is enough for my use.

 

[118]

HikerDave - sounds like you have a very planted bike, given how and what you ride. Craig at Avalanche has got the measure of you and your ped.. Top job.

Scott, you sound like a smart guy

I think the jury is still out on that call..!
I will do my research as I like an unbiased view of all things. Not necessarily a commission based sales pitch. As for the NNOOO remark, I was only trying to get you to bite..
I totally understand your choice. Regardless of the reasons. It's not for me to question, as to whether you feel a higher spec'd bike, would enhance your riding further, as riding is an enhancement in itself.. Choices aren't usually made on one single factor alone. I like to hear the gripes as well as the recommendations.

JetSetDemo - Solitude out on the trials isn't all that bad. In my previous job, I worked alone 95% of my shift. My new job is split 50/50. However that's not the reason I took it (another story). Group rides are fun too. However, when your ambition has outweighed your talent, and you need to give yourself a good talking to, or you've blown your lungs out of your arse on a climb, it's sometimes advantageous, to be alone.. Wait, ebikes have assistance dont they? Doh!.. Agree that a below spec'd bike isn't a worthwhile investment. Upgrades/replacements are par for the course. Things naturally wear out, like we do in time. Warranty/Dealer support, 'can' be worth it's weight in gold. For me, now, it's about comfort and pleasure. Long gone are the days where I'd look to save an oz to make a lb, which is another reason I now avoid those comical mirrors in my bathroom.. Pleasure and pain are measured equally.
The one I want, is the one I'll buy. Once bought, I'll stop looking. That's how I've always been. Should've, could've, would've doesn't sit well with me. Make a commitment, then make the most of what's around you. Works for me, at least.. Your Levo - carbon & green?

118.

 

[JetSetDemo]

 

[118]

View attachment 17523

What brand of guards are you running on that fella?

 

[JetSetDemo]

Mud hugger mud on the front and the Sicomtb duel guard rear set up, you can find him on the forums, it’s the best rear mud guard solution and it also fixes the issue you see people talking about with mud getting in to the motor housing

 

[Pukmeister]

Those are stealthy, I had to zoom in to notice them. Any issues when in deep wet mud like clogging up ??