Flats, punctures and Tears Oh My!

[DanRad]

This is a constant battle for me. I currently using Maxxis tires and an insert that enables me to ride (slowly) without wrecking my rims. But actually SOLVING the problem (if it's even possible) seems the holy grail.

I've seen "CushCore" and other such products. I can see how these would minimize pinches and allow riding on a flat, but not preventing slices or punctures. Tannus Armour seems to be more of a prophylactic against an actual flat. So far, I haven't seen a test or review that really addresses different systems against the kind of issues I'm running into with so many punctures and tears that are big enough to not be "resealed" in the field.

Please, any input, experiences or ideas are welcome.

 

[High Rock Ruti]

High Rock Ruti

Big fan of Cushcore's, bought for one bike tried them loved them bought for the second bike. Haven't really had a super hard square edge hit, can run significantly lower pressures PSI, in the teens the cushcore supports the sidewalls so great traction and no wallow, oh yes NO FLATS either. Expensive $150 USD plus $35 to have them installed. It's really expensive until your walking your bike out of the woods with a flat, then not so much.

 

[Gary]

You don't even need inserts to eliminate pinch flats. Just run appropriate tyre pressure.

Rather than spending a fortune on them. Spend a little on a spare tube and inflator.

 

[High Rock Ruti]

High Rock Ruti

That's the old way Dad, plush ride, soft tires, no squirm, no flats. Moreover I've seen plenty of flats with pressure in the mid twenty PSI range, just a great time on a group ride making the decision to let the flat tired person walk out alone or walk with them? I'm riding a fifty pound bike an extra 2 pounds can't even notice

 

[Jackware]

Go tubeless and avoid the rocks?

 

[DanRad]

Thanks for the input. I'm currently tubeless.. but where I ride, can't avoid rocks and stickers unless I just stay home .

Can anyone share experiences with the Tannus Armour. It seems to me that the idea of getting the tube further away from the walls of the tire and adding another layer would make the flats less likely... whereas I don't see how the CushCore makes the air chamber less vulnerable.

Please share experiences and suggestions. I'm feeling very deflated!!!
DanRad

 

[Jamy]

I've used Tannus Armour from day one on the rear of my EMTB, On the front I went tubeless. After two punctures in the front and none in the rear I have gone to another insert in the front, this time Mr Tuffy. Its early days for the Mr Tuffy but the Tannus Armour is still going strong after 860 miles

 

[DanRad]

Thanks Jamy for the input. Anyone have BAD experiences with the Tannus?
Really appreciate the input.

 

[NULevo]

I've been running Tannus since December and have not had a puncture since, pulled lots of thorns out of the tyres, but no punctures. Here's a couple of threads to look at, worth doing a search too:

Tannus tyre armour - EMTB Forums

Can I pick your brains again? - EMTB Forums

 

[High Rock Ruti]

Go tubeless and avoid the rocks?

High Rock Ruti

"Avoid the rocks" Why that's downright sacrilege or is it profane?

 

[DanRad]

Anyone have any experience with Barbieri Anaconda internal mousse

 

[Jeff H]

High Rock Ruti

That's the old way Dad, plush ride, soft tires, no squirm, no flats. Moreover I've seen plenty of flats with pressure in the mid twenty PSI range, just a great time on a group ride making the decision to let the flat tired person walk out alone or walk with them? I'm riding a fifty pound bike an extra 2 pounds can't even notice

Wholeheartedly agree. Everyone's first thought on Cushcore is pinch flat protection. After running them a few months I mainly see them as the first stage of suspension. Pinch protection is just icing on the cake. They dampen out the smaller stuff and keep you on line (reduced squirm) while the fork/shock take over on the bigger hits. Hey, it's a progressive suspension system!

 

[Jdog]

Sounds like you need thicker cased tyres, Maxxis do a double down casing that might help:

Double Down | Maxxis Tyres UK

Maxxis tyre technology explained:

Bike Technology | Tyre Technology | Maxxis Tyres UK

 

[DanRad]

Thanks for all the great input... lot's to think about while sitting in Quarantine!!

 

[High Rock Ruti]

High Rock Ruti

Sitting in quarantine

I have been cutting a new trail through the woods for the last seven days, an hour and half a day, looks like 600-900 calories. So far Massachusetts has not ordered stay at home, essential businesses are furloughed. I avoid all people, zoom like crazy and when I have to be near people I dress like this.

 

[GrahamPaul]

Anyone have any experience with Barbieri Anaconda internal mousse

I think that's very similar to Octa-Mousse, which this chap I follow on YouTube has reviewed. (As he says, don't wash it out in your bathroom if you are married!)

I just had a tyre bead failure (day before the lockdown), so may well end up using this myself (either Octa or Barbieri) as it seems to be very popular here - and a lot cheaper than Cushcore.

I was running pressures in the mid-20s and possibly burped a tyre. These inserts would have prevented that. My missus is running Tannus Armour, but she doesn't do anything extreme, other than riding over every thorn she can find. No punctures so far, but I don't see it giving much protection against sidewall tears as it's only a couple of millimetres thick on the walls.

 

[Gary]

Read the link Jay posted. If you're tearing sidewalls and casings and it's not from pinching (which would confirm you are running too low pressure for your weight) Go with a tougher tyre casing such as Maxxis DD. (or DH casing if you're more aggressive or your terrain warrants it)

 

[davarello]

I"m running Cushcore on both wheels with a Butcher Grid in front and an Eliminator Blk Dmnd out back. Pressure is 20F/25R, giving me good traction without the squirm under my 125kg weight. No flats on this combo in 6 months, previous Grid rear tyre went a year before it go a flat. Looks like in your case thicker casings would be the way to go.

 

[DanRad]

Hey, thanks again for all the great input... AND, all these recommendations and follow up research has my head spinning. One issue I've run into is that the Maxxis Double Down tires don't seem to come in anything larger than 2.75x2.4 I'd need at least a 2.8 and prefer 3.0.
I was looking at the Continental Mountain King ProTection which comes in 2.75x2.8.
The Eliminator also looks like there isn't a 2.75 model.

As for the various "insert" systems, I bought this bike used and now realize it DOES have CushCore installed... and yet, I still get flats due to punctures and rock tears.

So... Where does that leave me. (Currently at home with a bike I can't ride)

Open to ideas. Thank you for your assistance.

Dan Rad

 

[DanRad]

The Schwalbe looks interesting.. any opinions on it vs the Maxxis DH (if I can find the right size) as far as puncture/rip resistance?

If it wasn't such a nightmare to install, the Tannus Armour System seems to be the most logical PREVENTION system as far as punctures and rips. But the reviews seem mixed.

Thanks again for helping out... this is a great community, glad I found it,

 

[Gary]

Why do you think you *need* 3.0" wide tyres when DH World Cup and Redbull rampage/fest series riders only need 2.4/2.5s?
What riding are you doing?

 

[Jdog]

One issue I've run into is that the Maxxis Double Down tires don't seem to come in anything larger than 2.75x2.4 I'd need at least a 2.8 and prefer 3.0.

First search on CRC found a 2.5 minion with DD, sometimes you'll find double down is abbreviated as DD.
The other option if you can't find DD is to look at the tyre TPI (threads per inch) the lower the TPI the better the cut resistance (for maxxis anyway):

As for the various "insert" systems, I bought this bike used and now realize it DOES have CushCore installed... and yet, I still get flats due to punctures and rock tears.

I don't think any tyre insert will or claims to help for tyre tears you'll need to explore the tyre options mentioned above.
I am keen to know what kind of punctures you're getting? I have not yet had tyre punctured with foreign material that tubeless wouldn't seal and if you're getting punch flats with a tyre insert then it is not set up correctly.

Can you clarify your current setup? (tyre, tyre pressure, tyre insert, tyre valve, tubeless sealant, rim tape)

 

[DanRad]

Thanks again for the help. My tire (now wrecked) is a Maxxis High Roller II 2.75x3.0.... 120 TPI...so that high thread count makes it more vulnerable. (I thought it was the other way around) With that in mind, I'll be looking for LOWER TPI... correct? Below is a picture of the the tire and the kind of damage I'm having. Can ANYONE give feedback, pro or con on Tannus Armour?

 

[NULevo]

Hi Dan, post 9 above is a review and my post on Tannus.

I have 29 x 2.6 tyres on mine, the website says max 2.4, but when I contacted Tannus they said there would be no issues running them in a 2.6. I'm not an experienced enough rider to know how/if they affect the ride, but I do know I have't had a puncture since installing them and dont worry about thorns or hitting a curb.

I'm sure there are some that will cringe at the weight or how they affect the ride, each to their own, I just love the convenience of not having to carry a pump and the paraphernalia that comes with tubeless and knowing even if I get a flat I can get home.

 

[DanRad]

NuLEVO..Yes, I saw your review and it is greatly appreciated... thanks so much for your reply. Did you install them? If so, what is your level of mechanical competence and how did it go?

 

[NULevo]

NuLEVO..Yes, I saw your review and it is greatly appreciated... thanks so much for your reply. Did you install them? If so, what is your level of mechanical competence and how did it go?

Hi DanRad, I did install them myself, without any problems. Believe me when I say if I can do it, anyone can!

The process is easy and does not take long. The only thing I would say is get a pair of slightly smaller inner tubes, as they advised as Tannus. Apart from that, you only need to take off one side of each tyre, if you can do that, you can fit Tannus

 

[DanRad]

Thanks... I'll take that under advisement.

 

[Gary]

20 TPI...so that high thread count makes it more vulnerable. (I thought it was the other way around) With that in mind, I'll be looking for LOWER TPI... correct?

No. not really.
most plus tyres use single ply casings. higher TPI makes a tyre casing more supple (better ride characteristics) as it reduces it's stiffness. the extra stiffness of lower TPI tyres only increases durability slightly. Bottom line is both tyres are still single ply construction (light but not too tough)
to increase tyre casing durability and strength you need to go to a tougher dual ply casing altogether like DD or DH casings.
Plus tyres generally have weak thin casings as otherwise they'd weigh far too much.
this is one of the reasons why DH/Freeride tyres with dual ply DH casings are only really made up to 2.5" widths. but mainly as super large volume tyres are complete garbage for fast technical riding where you want precise and consistent control.

 

[DanRad]

Ok. Thanks to all of you who helped me with this... I'm gonna go with a Maxxis DD, keep my CushCores in and see what happens.

DanRad

 

[Kentrider]

I’ve just bought two tannus amour things to go in mine, I’m fed up with little thorns in my tire.... had two this week already. Just out of curiosity I have a turbo levo with 29” wheels, the inner tubes I run now are continental 29” - 1.75 / 2.4.... would they be okr would I need thinner ones?

Thanks