emtbs are greener than analogue bikes!

[steve_sordy]

Bike Radar has reported on a study comparing how green is walking, cycling, ebike, cars.

The report is here:

How green is cycling? Riding, walking, ebikes and driving ranked

Key findings

• Cycling has a carbon footprint of about 21g of CO2 per kilometre. That’s less than walking or getting the bus and less than a tenth the emissions of driving
• About three-quarters of cycling’s greenhouse gas emissions occur when producing the extra food required to “fuel” cycling., while the rest comes from manufacturing the bicycle
• Electric bikes have an even lower carbon footprint than conventional bikes because fewer calories are burned per kilometre, despite the emissions from battery manufacturing and electricity use

I confess to being a bit surprised by that. I would never have thought to take into account the food consumed by the rider as a factor.

 

[Gary]

Oh FFS!
That really is clutching at straws to justify having a motor on your bike

 

[Mteam]

Bike Radar has reported on a study comparing how green is walking, cycling, ebike, cars.

The report is here:

How green is cycling? Riding, walking, ebikes and driving ranked

Key findings

• Cycling has a carbon footprint of about 21g of CO2 per kilometre. That’s less than walking or getting the bus and less than a tenth the emissions of driving
• About three-quarters of cycling’s greenhouse gas emissions occur when producing the extra food required to “fuel” cycling., while the rest comes from manufacturing the bicycle
• Electric bikes have an even lower carbon footprint than conventional bikes because fewer calories are burned per kilometre, despite the emissions from battery manufacturing and electricity use

I confess to being a bit surprised by that. I would never have thought to take into account the food consumed by the rider as a factor.

I once cycled to work (on a normal bike), I think I spent more on food that day than I would have spent on petrol to get to work in the car.

From that point onward I always drove.

 

[Gary]

once cycled to work (on a normal bike),

How far?

 

[Mteam]

How far?

18 miles each way

 

[steve_sordy]

Oh FFS!
That really is clutching at straws to justify having a motor on your bike

i would never have thought of using that as an argument. Knee problems was enough for me.
I didn't read the whole article as its point was made very early on. Are you saying that somewhere in the article that someone claims your point as a justification?

 

[Dazzling1984]

anyone using battery packs in their mtbs, computers, cars or smartfones has blood on their hands, there is nothing green about it >>>

 

[Dazzling1984]

 

[Kingerz]

Thanks for linking this excellent video. Rogan had a podcast on this too.
My eMTB is powered from solar so it is as green as it can get, but I know it'll never justify the cost of making the solar panels, Lithium battery, the bike itself etc inabsolute global terms.
Normal bikes can last MUCH longer too. I have a steel DAWES from the 80s, for example.
The problem is much, much bigger than a bicycle battery though. Whatever device you posted on is 'part of the problem' and you probably have a car, go on planes etc.
Not all cobalt comes from the Congo. It is mined here in Australia, for example, too, as well as Canada and other places.
LiFePO4 batteries, which are becoming common in other devices as they can last for 3500 full charge cycles are cobalt-free.

 

[Dazzling1984]

Thanks for linking this excellent video. Rogan had a podcast on this too.
My eMTB is powered from solar so it is as green as it can get, but I know it'll never justify the cost of making the solar panels, Lithium battery, the bike itself etc inabsolute global terms.
Normal bikes can last MUCH longer too. I have a steel DAWES from the 80s, for example.
The problem is much, much bigger than a bicycle battery though. Whatever device you posted on is 'part of the problem' and you probably have a car, go on planes etc.
Not all cobalt comes from the Congo. It is mined here in Australia, for example, too, as well as Canada and other places.
LiFePO4 batteries, which are becoming common in other devices as they can last for 3500 full charge cycles are cobalt-free.

Hey, no sweat mate, i think as the video mentioned there is a whole lot of corruption and cover ups regarding the mines and that of course means we are not privy to many of the real facts and figures...Yes i recently brought a 3rd hand ebike but own no car and have used planes in the past but very very rarely...thats is no excuse thou, i am aware i am contributing to this problem and am in a round about way actually funding and condoning this horrible situation, even if it is only in a small way...its a terrible problem that seems to just be about making money as cheaply as possible while having no real remorse or conscience for what is being done to these people or our planet...its an eye opening video for sure, i doubt many people are even aware of what goes on to create these batteries as they float around in their Teslas claiming to be green and saving the planet=/=/=/

 

[Tooks]

Don’t forget cobalt isn’t just used in some types of battery, it’s used to refine road fuels from oil, as well as used in specialist steel manufacturing.

Amongst other things…

As ever, the actual truth is somewhat more complicated than the linked video, illegal cobalt mining in ‘artisanal’ mines can be the difference between a family eating or not.

There are many things that damage the planet we all live on, it’s not purely down to ‘Tesla drivers floating around claiming to be green and saving the planet=/=/=/‘, which is actually just a divisive and trolling remark that is unhelpful at best.

Nobody is doing that last time I looked, but ignoring the benefits of EVs over equivalent fossil powered cars over their lifetime is confirmation bias of the highest order.

 

[Dazzling1984]

Don’t forget cobalt isn’t just used in some types of battery, it’s used to refine road fuels from oil, as well as used in specialist steel manufacturing.

Amongst other things…

As ever, the actual truth is somewhat more complicated than the linked video, illegal cobalt mining in ‘artisanal’ mines can be the difference between a family eating or not.

There are many things that damage the planet we all live on, it’s not purely down to ‘Tesla drivers floating around claiming to be green and saving the planet=/=/=/‘, which is actually just a divisive and trolling remark that is unhelpful at best.

Nobody is doing that last time I looked, but ignoring the benefits of EVs over equivalent fossil powered cars over their lifetime is confirmation bias of the highest order.

I know its not just ‘Tesla drivers floating around claiming to be green and saving the planet=/=/=/‘, we are in an emtb forum where we are all guilty of using rechargeable batterys that probably stemmed in some way (75% of the world’s Cobolt supply comes from the Democratic Republic of the Congo) from child labour and/or some form of slavery, i am well aware the problem is way bigger than teslas cars and the drivers. I wasnt aware that cobolt was used in road fuels or steel production so thanks for that! What i was really trying to do was highlight (if you didnt notice) how our mission to create "cleaner living" using natural resources is killing (who knows how many?)people and being swept under the usual rug, many of the dead and dying being children....

I also think the benefits of ev's has been way overestimated, as its far easier to exploit the third world than drill for oil or mine coal in Wales or up North where people can earn more "working from home" than down pit...And we havent even touched on our growing appetite for copper or nuclear which is just another train wreck but i have no doubt they will be pressing those buttons rather than tackle the real problems associated with this multiple-pronged toxic travesty. And this I think you will find is just the tip of the iceberg...

 

[johnnystorm]

I haven't read the article linked above yet but remember Trek's one.

iirc, a bog standard Marlin hardtail would be carbon neutral once you'd used it instead of your car for 400 miles and an e-alternative took a couple of hundred or so extra miles. Once that was covered it was feasible that electric wattage generation was less harmful than food wattage generation.

As a parallel to the videos anyone who eats meat is responsible for more CO2, potential deforestation, etc. Palm oil production is a far from pleasant industry, etc.

 

[Dazzling1984]

I haven't read the article linked above yet but remember Trek's one.

iirc, a bog standard Marlin hardtail would be carbon neutral once you'd used it instead of your car for 400 miles and an e-alternative took a couple of hundred or so extra miles. Once that was covered it was feasible that electric wattage generation was less harmful than food wattage generation.

As a parallel to the videos anyone who eats meat is responsible for more CO2, potential deforestation, etc. Palm oil production is a far from pleasant industry, etc.

An emtb may be carbon neutral after a few hundred miles riding but that will never justify the thousands of deaths of children dying in the mines?

 

[Dazzling1984]

"BMW, for instance, recently stated that it will purchase all of its cobalt from Australia and Morocco to ensure that child labor isn't used in the mining of this material".
Meaning up until it was highlighted and they got caught with their pants down they where using child labour and their batteries where using unethically sourced lithium and cobalt period....

"In sum, it's true that the majority of the world's cobalt supply comes from the Democratic Republic of Congo, where numerous reports of child-labor and human-rights abuses have been uncovered. It's also true that cobalt is a chemical element that is used in electric car batteries. However, it's misleading to claim that these children are "living a hell on Earth so YOU can drive an electric car," because the majority of cobalt is not used for electric car batteries, and electric car manufacturers, such as Tesla and BMW, procure their cobalt from sources outside of the DRC".

But lets not be too quick to believe any of these filthy corporations bcuz they lie thru their teeth whenever they get the chance and as soon as we find them out they just move the goal posts...