E13 TRS cassette -- general shifting issue

[squeegee]

I've had my decoy for about 1.5 months, Pro model, XT rear shifter/dera combo. Shifting has been a little less than stellar but I'm not having a problem getting into the 9 tooth cog (as others have reported), what I am seeing is sloppy skipping and erratic shifts from time to time especially when the chain is climbing the cassette to lower gears. I always try to shift cleanly under lessened load and while moving of course but every so often the chain just skips wildly.

I got really tired of trying to get the bar/brake/shifter ergos right for my hands, the HUGE body of the super-dated XT shifter that came with the bike doesn't exactly give you a lot of position options and is incompatible with Ispec adapters.

Anyway swapped over to Sram XO1 shifter/dera, my old friend on my regular bike however I am still using the E13 TRS cassette. Shifting was immediately cleaner, sharper and easier. I thought damn Shimano clutch or whatever it might have been, problem solved!

Well, after a few rides on XO1 I'm still finding the chain to still have the occasional "freak out" when climbing the cassette so I'm really starting to think the E13 cassette is the issue because on my regular bike which is all XO1 (including the cassette), I don't ever have this issue. I know the speeds and forces on the decoy are higher. Chain still within wear tolerance.

Anyone got some input on this or had similar happen? Has anyone swapped over to a SRAM cassette?

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

I've had my decoy for about 1.5 months, Pro model, XT rear shifter/dera combo. Shifting has been a little less than stellar but I'm not having a problem getting into the 9 tooth cog (as others have reported), what I am seeing is sloppy skipping and erratic shifts from time to time especially when the chain is climbing the cassette to lower gears. I always try to shift cleanly under lessened load and while moving of course but every so often the chain just skips wildly.

I got really tired of trying to get the bar/brake/shifter ergos right for my hands, the HUGE body of the super-dated XT shifter that came with the bike doesn't exactly give you a lot of position options and is incompatible with Ispec adapters.

Anyway swapped over to Sram XO1 shifter/dera, my old friend on my regular bike however I am still using the E13 TRS cassette. Shifting was immediately cleaner, sharper and easier. I thought damn Shimano clutch or whatever it might have been, problem solved!

Well, after a few rides on XO1 I'm still finding the chain to still have the occasional "freak out" when climbing the cassette so I'm really starting to think the E13 cassette is the issue because on my regular bike which is all XO1 (including the cassette), I don't ever have this issue. I know the speeds and forces on the decoy are higher. Chain still within wear tolerance.

Anyone got some input on this or had similar happen? Has anyone swapped over to a SRAM cassette?

Interested to hear any feedback on this as I was thinking of changing my current 10-42 cassette to the E13 specifically for the 9 tooth sprocket for a higher top speed.

 

[squeegee]

Interested to hear any feedback on this as I was thinking of changing my current 10-42 cassette to the E13 specifically for the 9 tooth sprocket for a higher top speed.

One way to look at your issue would be up the chainring 2T, not sure if chain guide can accommodate that. You're not going to get much of a top speed increase from only 1 tooth going to 9 from 10 on top gear. Assuming here you have a Decoy and switched cassettes?

For my issue I was considering buying an HG1195 (XO1) and putting on a Wolftooth 46T giving me 10-46 x 34T chainring, but that's a pretty good sized lump of cash so why I posted to see if anyone else had a fix for my issue.

I assume you don't have any issue with freakish chain skipping issues on your SRAM cassette?

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

One way to look at your issue would be up the chainring 2T, not sure if chain guide can accommodate that. You're not going to get much of a top speed increase from only 1 tooth going to 9 from 10 on top gear. Assuming here you have a Decoy and switched cassettes?

For my issue I was considering buying an HG1195 (XO1) and putting on a Wolftooth 46T giving me 10-46 x 34T chainring, but that's a pretty good sized lump of cash so why I posted to see if anyone else had a fix for my issue.

I assume you don't have any issue with freakish chain skipping issues on your SRAM cassette?

No chain skipping issues at all with my XX1 cassette and I have done over 3000km on it so far from new. I am currently on my 6th chain. I am on a 2019 Levo.
According to the gear calculator site which is my guide to all things geared, I would have to go from a 32 to a 36 on the front to get a similar top speed increase using the 10-42 compared to 32 x 9-46 or a 32 x 9-44
I don’t want to lose the 32 on the front as I need it to get me up the steep terrain that I ride where I am. For me personally a 9-46 would give me the best of both worlds as it would give me a higher top speed and even lower ratio gearing for climbing but only if it changed gears cleanly, otherwise I will stay where I am.

 

[squeegee]

Interesting, I did not know that the chainring was a lesser factor than cassette cogs in overall top speed, albeit by a small margin. I wonder how a 34T/10T would compare to the 32T/10T? Probably split the difference between 36T/10T and 32T/10T. I'm running a 34T.

Anyway this makes me wonder if the E13 cassette I have might need warranty, in other words maybe it shouldn't perform as badly as it does for me. I've thought about contacting them given all the complaining I've heard on their cassettes but haven't.

My regular bike's XO1 cassette has seen 2 replacements for the alloy large cog and 5 chains and is smooth to this day. Hands down better than this E13 cassette.

Hoping someone else chimes in, if not I'm definitely going to ask for warranty replacement.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Interesting, I did not know that the chainring was a lesser factor than cassette cogs in overall top speed, albeit by a small margin. I wonder how a 34T/10T would compare to the 32T/10T? Probably split the difference between 36T/10T and 32T/10T. I'm running a 34T.

Anyway this makes me wonder if the E13 cassette I have might need warranty, in other words maybe it shouldn't perform as badly as it does for me. I've thought about contacting them given all the complaining I've heard on their cassettes but haven't.

My regular bike's XO1 cassette has seen 2 replacements for the alloy large cog and 5 chains and is smooth to this day. Hands down better than this E13 cassette.

Hoping someone else chimes in, if not I'm definitely going to ask for warranty replacement.

Yes, more or less.
Here you go, 34 x 10-42
Also, Link to the site so you can try it yourself.
Sounds like a warranty job to me
Bike Gears calculator

Y

 

[Gary]

how often do you find yourself still pedalling at 57kmh (35mph?)
and more importantly where?

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

how often do you find yourself still pedalling at 57kmh (35mph?)
and more importantly where?

Quite often, around 50% of all my rides.
Where? Some of the fire road descents that link the various trails I ride and also my journey to and from the trails to my home on the tarmac road.

 

[Gary]

Quite often, around 50% of all my rides.
Where? Some of the fire road descents that link the various trails I ride and also my journey to and from the trails to my home on the tarmac road.

Fair enough.
But...
You realise you're probably quicker dropping the saddle and tucking at anything above 32?
I hit 42mph every morning on my way to work on tarmac. I don't pedal after about 32mph.

Guessing you're derestricted? If so, Aero dynamic position is also very important holding a high speed on the flat. and even there dropping the saddle, getting low and tucked is far more efficient than saddle fully extended open chested riding. (Not without the assist tho)

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Fair enough.
But...
You realise you're probably quicker dropping the saddle and tucking at anything above 32?
I hit 42mph every morning on my way to work on tarmac. I don't pedal after about 32mph.

Guessing you're derestricted? If so, Aero dynamic position is also very important holding a high speed on the flat. and even there dropping the saddle, getting low and tucked is far more efficient than saddle fully extended open chested riding. (Not without the assist tho)

Hey Gary,
yes, have already been doing all you suggest above for quite some time thanks
I know I can go faster down some of the fire road descents pedalling rather than tucking as I have already achieved this albeit at a horrendously high cadence.
A 9-44 or 9-46 will give me the best of both worlds of a slightly higher top speed and an even lower gear ratio for the super steep climbs I am taking on these days
My only issue is I am not sure of the E13’s historical reliability compared to the cassette I have on now which has over 3000km on it so far and is still looking and performing as good as the day I put it on.
Also more than happy to stay as I am if I hear horror stories about the E13 cassette with my 1 x 32, 10-42 and my baby crank arms as this set up suits my riding style and the particular terrain I like to ride.

 

[jbetker]

Your issue sounds identical to the one I had. 11th gear was often (but not always) unreachable, and I had a lot of skipping in the midgears when I maxxed out the adjustment; necessary to make 11th work. I got a new cassette from Yt and the problem was fixed.

 

[squeegee]

Your issue sounds identical to the one I had. 11th gear was often (but not always) unreachable, and I had a lot of skipping in the midgears when I maxxed out the adjustment; necessary to make 11th work. I got a new cassette from Yt and the problem was fixed.

Did they send you a whole cassette? E13 is only offering me the steel section in a couple weeks when they come in, kind of lame.

 

[jbetker]

Did they send you a whole cassette? E13 is only offering me the steel section in a couple weeks when they come in, kind of lame.

Yep, that's all that was needed though.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Yep, that's all that was needed though.

Good to hear, how does the E13 compare to a SRAM or Shimano cassette regarding smooth changes now you have had the steel section changed?

How long have you had the Decoy for? I suppose it might be too early to discuss wear rate on the cassette if you have only had the bike for a few weeks.

 

[Ozone08]

One way to look at your issue would be up the chainring 2T, not sure if chain guide can accommodate that. You're not going to get much of a top speed increase from only 1 tooth going to 9 from 10 on top gear. Assuming here you have a Decoy and switched cassettes?

For my issue I was considering buying an HG1195 (XO1) and putting on a Wolftooth 46T giving me 10-46 x 34T chainring, but that's a pretty good sized lump of cash so why I posted to see if anyone else had a fix for my issue.

I assume you don't have any issue with freakish chain skipping issues on your SRAM cassette?

I fitted a 38T chainring on my decoy and the chain guide accommodates it (just)

 

[jbetker]

Good to hear, how does the E13 compare to a SRAM or Shimano cassette regarding smooth changes now you have had the steel section changed?

How long have you had the Decoy for? I suppose it might be too early to discuss wear rate on the cassette if you have only had the bike for a few weeks.

Hey, sorry for the late response. I don't have much experience with newer Shimano cassettes, but it is smoother than the SRAM cassettes I've ridden in other bikes. It's also electric, so it's really tough to say whether the e-derailleur is what is making it smooth.

I've had the Decoy for two months now. I ride about 3 days/week to work with it, about 35 miles round trip, as well as some trail riding on the weekends. I've got about 1200 miles on it at this point, probably about 800 of which is on the new cassette. I spend a lot of time in 9th gear, so I'm pretty concerned about wear over time. I get chain skips occasionally in 9/10/11 but generally if I lube the chain it'll go away. I'll try and remember to report back when I have to change out the cassette. Likely I'll be going with a Shimano cassette or an off-brand since there's no way I can justify the costs of the ethirteen.

 

[squeegee]

I've ridden my E13 warranty cassette about 200 miles now and it is much better than the original. Not the smoothest I've ever had but is really fine, anyone who hasn't warrantied it and is having problems should, E13 was really easy to work with.

 

[Ozone08]

YT emailed me saying it’s a know fault with the older models and tolled me to get in touch with E13 for a replacement which is ludicrous. They want me to do their job for them and chase their own vendors for a replacement part that they ordered. That really pi$$ed me off! YT confirmed it was the older cassette by the serial number so the fact that all of this could of been avoided simply by them checking the number before they sent me the bike or even bothered to go through the gears on the bike stand. I emailed back telling them to either send me a replacement cassette or refund me.

 

[squeegee]

YT emailed me saying it’s a know fault with the older models and tolled me to get in touch with E13 for a replacement which is ludicrous. They want me to do their job for them and chase their own vendors for a replacement part that they ordered. That really pi$$ed me off! YT confirmed it was the older cassette by the serial number so the fact that all of this could of been avoided simply by them checking the number before they sent me the bike or even bothered to go through the gears on the bike stand. I emailed back telling them to either send me a replacement cassette or refund me.

it's really not that hard, [email protected] to reach E13 warranty support. You ask nicely for a replacement letting them know the shifting/performance issues and they graciously say: no problem we'll send you a free new cassette...seems like a lot less trouble than blaming YT for the issue considering the bikes are assembled in Asia and basically pass through YT USA's hands on the way to the end user. Besides all bikes have issues, at least it isn't a chronic motor failure issue...there's a good bit of that going around elsewhere. If you wanted white glove service you should have bought a big box bike...and paid extra for this convenience.

Personally I'll send an email and take care of it myself for the few thousand I didn't pay in mark up. Added to that, not dealing with the average bike store's lack of urgency.

 

[Hol47]

it's really not that hard, [email protected] to reach E13 warranty support. You ask nicely for a replacement letting them know the shifting/performance issues and they graciously say: no problem we'll send you a free new cassette...seems like a lot less trouble than blaming YT for the issue considering the bikes are assembled in Asia and basically pass through YT USA's hands on the way to the end user. Besides all bikes have issues, at least it isn't a chronic motor failure issue...there's a good bit of that going around elsewhere. If you wanted white glove service you should have bought a big box bike...and paid extra for this convenience.

Personally I'll send an email and take care of it myself for the few thousand I didn't pay in mark up. Added to that, not dealing with the average bike store's lack of urgency.

+ to this. E Thirteen sent a new cassette which was in my hands a few days later. I dont see what the issue is...

 

[Ozone08]

I understand it’s simple to get a replacement my annoyance is the fact that I/we have to in the first place. Just check/fit/test the cassette at yt. I have a transmission building company and if a customer came back saying my car won’t go into 3rd gear and knowing that I fitted a part with a slight known fault I wouldn’t even dream of telling a customer “here’s an email address for the manufacturer that’s in a different country, take up up with them”

 

[AdH]

Having had some issues with slipping and crappy gear changes from new I emailed The Hive in Europe and they offered to send me a new one no quibbles. Arrives on Monday. They were easier to deal with than YT, so no complaints from me

 

[squeegee]

Just fitted a KMC e11 chain replacing stock shimano....whoa what a difference...only have shifted in the stand but shifts are extra crisp and shorter
between cogs...can't wait to ride it on trail...will report back after a few rides

 

[squeegee]

Just reporting back on the KMC e11 chain (ebike specific) after about 150 miles of riding my regular spots.

This chain is fantastic and makes such a big difference over the Shimano chain that comes on the Decoy. Shifts are light and seem effortless compared to stock. Much more accurate and consistent as well. Previous skipping issues nearly eliminated aside from user error . I never would have thought a chain would make so much difference.

Anyone needing a chain replacement I highly recommend getting this one. I'd even go out and get one if your chain is still in spec, it's that good.

 

[Subzilla]

I have the KMC ebike chain and it made no difference to shifting on the e13, thinking the chain could be the problem I tried a couple more to no avail, even tried the ebike 12 speed chain which shifted the best of all but still skipping gears.
I bought the park tool hanger alignment tool and hanger was within tolerance.

 

[squeegee]

I have the KMC ebike chain and it made no difference to shifting on the e13, thinking the chain could be the problem I tried a couple more to no avail, even tried the ebike 12 speed chain which shifted the best of all but still skipping gears.
I bought the park tool hanger alignment tool and hanger was within tolerance.

For me chain made a difference but not enough. E13 cassette is the problem, get rid of it. The problem could be worse, if you had a Levo in the same price range you'd be spending a lot more upgrading suspension/components trying to get near the spec level of a Decoy.