Levo Gen 2 Crap! Too much wattage?

[Canmore TLCC 29]

I just noticed that local Pedal Assisted eBike Watts are limited to 500 watts. Then I noticed my 2020 Turbo Levo has a motor capable of 565 watts. Is my bike not legal then?

 

[RodC]

Don’t use turbo and you’re good to go.
PS. This is a joke. as Doomanic said it’s a 250W motor.

MOTOR

Specialized 2.1, custom Rx Trail-tuned motor, 250W nominal

 

[Doomanic]

You're fine, the restriction is nominal watts, not peak watts. Your Levo is 250W nominal. Or broken. It's Schrodinger's bicycle; you won't know if it's working or not until you take it out of the box (garage)...

 

[boBE]

What we don't know is how long the motor can provide 560 watts until the system backs off due to heat. I don't have a hill long enough to test it.

 

[Canmore TLCC 29]

You're fine, the restriction is nominal watts, not peak watts. Your Levo is 250W nominal. Or broken. It's Schrodinger's bicycle; you won't know if it's working or not until you take it out of the box (garage)...

Unfortunately the language in the Description of what is allowable as a pedal assisted eBike was up to a Maximum of 500 Watts. I wish Specialized would remove references to 560 Watts from literature. I spoke with a Banff National Park Ranger the other day and learned the pelalty for riding an eBike in the National Park off paved roads and paved trails is a mandatory court appearance and $25,000 fine.

• What is NOT a pedal-assist e-bike?
  • Throttle or power-on demand
  • More than 500 watts of maximum output
  • Provides power at over 32 km/h
  • An electric mobility aid

 

[Doomanic]

Well that sucks.

 

[Canmore TLCC 29]

No eBikes at all in the National park. The 500 Watt restriction is for Alberta Provincial parks.

 

[Slowroller]

I'm pretty sure I'd forget just how many watts my ebike can max at, it all gets very confusing. 373? 421? Certainly not above 500. Damn, I think I'm getting old....

 

[Mikerb]

I have never seen any of the brands specify the max power rating of their motors. They only ever specify 250 watt continuous since that is the regulated definition of a pedelec. I would have thought Alberta would understand that. I can see no way they could determine the max power of any given motor so their restriction is not enforceable.

 

[SquireRides]

Better buy a Levo SL, just to be sure....

 

[Canmore TLCC 29]

POWERFUL & PLANTED
At 565 watts of peak power, the ultra-smooth and quiet Specialized 2.1 motor system is the most powerful rider-supported electric mountain bike system available, giving you the ability to tackle the most demanding terrain. Match that with our proven FSR suspension design and the precision and control of our Sidearm frame, and the result is a powerful and planted ride that descends as well as it climbs.

I have never seen any of the brands specify the max power rating of their motors. They only ever specify 250 watt continuous since that is the regulated definition of a pedelec. I would have thought Alberta would understand that. I can see no way they could determine the max power of any given motor so their restriction is not enforceable.

POWERFUL & PLANTED
At 565 watts of peak power, the ultra-smooth and quiet Specialized 2.1 motor system is the most powerful rider-supported electric mountain bike system available, giving you the ability to tackle the most demanding terrain. Match that with our proven FSR suspension design and the precision and control of our Sidearm frame, and the result is a powerful and planted ride that descends as well as it climbs.

 

[Mikerb]

Ah but that is electrical power input not mechanical power output!!!
But if you are worried just set turbo peak power at 50% in MC and if you are challenged insist on them checking the MC setting.

 

[Mikerb]

I assume they also ban riders capable of more that 250w pure leg power? That would include most fit riders. What a nonsence. This is surely a case of not understanding the pedelec regulations otherwise why would they chose 250w as their benchmark. All pedelecs (ie no throttle etc) use a 250 watt motor and the majority have max power greater than 250.

 

[Canmore TLCC 29]

Ah but that is electrical power input not mechanical power output!!!
But if you are worried just set turbo peak power at 50% in MC and if you are challenged insist on them checking the MC setting.

I like the power input vs nominal power output argument. Let's just hope this issue never comes up for Turbo Levo riders in Alberta Provincial Parks. I think the 500 watt limit is arbitrary. Horses are allowed and they already use at least that much power. 1 Horsepower = 735.5 watts!

So there!

 

[Mikerb]

Better buy a Levo SL, just to be sure....

240w motor and capable of doubling your pedal input. So if indeed max power is 240w then you get no further assistance beyond 120w pedal input? Nah!!!! It would be at max outlut most of the time.

 

[boBE]

240w motor and capable of doubling your pedal input. So if indeed max power is 240w then you get no further assistance beyond 120w pedal input? Nah!!!! It would be at max outlut most of the time.

I rode my SL for about 11 miles on flat terrain at full power and from the battery usage it appears to be about 240 W.

 

[Canmore TLCC 29]

I second just getting an SL with the amount youre worried.

I mean, stress takes years off a life and the SL should add more with the increased need of fitness!!!

Saving your life here....

Too late! I bought it 3 weeks ago and lovin it! Planning a ride up Spray lake road, (315m assent) to check out a Banff trail, goat creek. No plans to ride the trail yet. I plan to get involved in the ebike regulation planning when and where possible. I hope both parks look at the USA’s National Park acceptance of eBikes on bike paths favorably. But Canada is very independent and anything Donald Trump has touched will be considered tainted.
I noticed the SL’s had a price increase here two weeks ago. I think it has been a popular bike. I bought Levo Comp because that was the only bike around in a Large frame. Bike shops around here are very low on stocks of ALL bikes. They have sold more bikes in one month than they typically sell all year.

 

[Canmore TLCC 29]

I often read on this site about other countries having restrictions on where emtbs can be ridden, here in Australia, to my knowledge, the authorities could not give 2 fucks where we ride them even if they are derestricted, (mine isn't) the laws here are very relaxed in regards to emtbs.
I ride mine constantly in a national park, I've spoken to a few different rangers as they will pull up for a chat, they couldn't care less, the place is usually full of dirt bikers too, but they must be registered according to the signs, but no one pays any attention to that.

I honestly don’t know what is holding up the Canada National Parks on this subject. I see it as inevitable, especially with an aging population. I’m pretty sure the environmentalist have a negative view toward anything other than foot traffic on trails. Then there are the secret society of Luddites who are against everyone and everything. I think people like me have our work cut out for ourselves. I am going to start with my local MP. Oz does have lots of Bennifits but it seems there are too many critters there that want to kill us with one poison or outher. ?

 

[Mikerb]

....."generate 500 watts or less....." Not very specific is it! Motor rating? Max power? Anyway at 565 peak for the Levo the mechanical output is likely to be no more 500 watts I would guess.

 

[Canmore TLCC 29]

....."generate 500 watts or less....." Not very specific is it! Motor rating? Max power? Anyway at 565 peak for the Levo the mechanical output is likely to be no more 500 watts I would guess.

While I would like to believe that was true, I do see up to 735watts support when in turbo mode. I don't think the motor can sustain that much power output due to heat up issues, but there it is in black and white. Actually Red and Black I think. 500 Watts is arbitrary considering current eMTB's on the market. What the laws should be regulating is speed. Speed is regulated, how much power is delivered to the rear wheel is a function of the sustained motor output and my physical fitness. When I was younger I'm guessing I could pedal with 300 to 500 watts of sustained output, but now I would be happy with 250 watts of sustained output. What is the fuss about anyway?

From what I have been able to gather the reasons are:
1- fear that people will be overusing trails
2- excessive rider speed putting riders and others at risk
3- inexperienced riders going where they shouldn't and getting into trouble that require rescue services.

I can argue against all but the 3rd point.

 

[crazyethnic]

That's peak power your bike is legal anywhere in the world, Here in OZ we can ride e bikes anywhere I can not believe that certain country's wont allow e bikes in some parks compared to normal MTB'S.

 

[daju]

Unfortunately the language in the Description of what is allowable as a pedal assisted eBike was up to a Maximum of 500 Watts. I wish Specialized would remove references to 560 Watts from literature. I spoke with a Banff National Park Ranger the other day and learned the pelalty for riding an eBike in the National Park off paved roads and paved trails is a mandatory court appearance and $25,000 fine.

• What is NOT a pedal-assist e-bike?
  • Throttle or power-on demand
  • More than 500 watts of maximum output
  • Provides power at over 32 km/h
  • An electric mobility aid

Holy Crappe!?

 

[boBE]

While I would like to believe that was true, I do see up to 735watts support when in turbo mode. I don't think the motor can sustain that much power output due to heat up issues, but there it is in black and white. Actually Red and Black I think. 500 Watts is arbitrary considering current eMTB's on the market. What the laws should be regulating is speed. Speed is regulated, how much power is delivered to the rear wheel is a function of the sustained motor output and my physical fitness. When I was younger I'm guessing I could pedal with 300 to 500 watts of sustained output, but now I would be happy with 250 watts of sustained output. What is the fuss about anyway?

From what I have been able to gather the reasons are:
1- fear that people will be overusing trails
2- excessive rider speed putting riders and others at risk
3- inexperienced riders going where they shouldn't and getting into trouble that require rescue services.

I can argue against all but the 3rd point.

Yow, that's over 20 A from the battery! The manufacturer can easily limit current draw, I am surprised they allow that much. Regulating speed might require a mechanical device like a centrifugal clutch. We would have to take our bikes in for an inspection each year (like our cars in some places) to verify the limiter is working.

 

[johnscioscia]

I assume they also ban riders capable of more that 250w pure leg power? That would include most fit riders. What a nonsence. This is surely a case of not understanding the pedelec regulations otherwise why would they chose 250w as their benchmark. All pedelecs (ie no throttle etc) use a 250 watt motor and the majority have max power greater than 250.

The turbo Levo expert and the comp both have the 700 watt batteries. I have the expert which is the longest lasting battery available today. That's what you're paying for how long it can go on a single charge The idea is to ride all day without worrying about anything which I can easily do on my 2021 turbo levo expert. Yes it says 250 watt on the bottom of the bike but it's up to 700 watt capacity run time

 

[Doomanic]

You are confusing power (watts) with capacity (watt hours)

 

[KeithR]

The turbo Levo expert and the comp both have the 700 watt batteries. I have the expert which is the longest lasting battery available today. That's what you're paying for how long it can go on a single charge The idea is to ride all day without worrying about anything which I can easily do on my 2021 turbo levo expert. Yes it says 250 watt on the bottom of the bike but it's up to 700 watt capacity run time

Battery capacity is entirely irrelevant, John.

 

[johnscioscia]

You are confusing power (watts) with capacity (watt hours)

Your right. I still like the 700 not seen any bike with more than that. Thanks for clarifying

 

[steve_sordy]

@Canmore TLCC 29 With a 500W-hr battery and a 250W average power output, you get a two hour battery life. If you ride your bike in turbo the whole time and it puts out 500W, then you will only get one hour. At 565W you will only get 53 minutes.

On that sign you posted it says generate 500W or less. The EU pondered this, asking questions like how to measure it, how to enforce it. They decided that an average of 250W was the way to go. This loophole was exploited by the motor manufacturers. If anyone stops you they have to be able to prove that you generated more than 500W. It is not enough to say that the bike is capable of it. By that argument every single car on the road would be guilty of speeding because it was capable of breaking the speed limit. Fortunately, they have to prove the car broke the speed limit.