Converting to Tubeless, Personal Experience

[bissona]

Update: riding with 25 front and 30 rear feels less ‘bobbly’ or ‘skippy’ if that makes sense. Feels more like the smaller stuff is being cruised over rather than bumped over.

I tried those sort of pressures at first but, after feeling like the front wanted to wash out at every turn, dropped to 19F/21R. Eats the battery a bit but feels a lot more planted. Will probably drop down a little lower on the very steep stuff.

 

[steve_sordy]

...............Then it’ll be time to work on the suspension set-up, but that’s a whole other thread....

Try this:
https://bikerumor.com/2014/10/30/bikerumor-suspension-setup-series-full-series-pdf-free-download/

It will tell you far more than you want to know right now, but it will take you in easy steps from beginner to expert.

 

[Dee Scee]

 

[Tim29]

D

Agree, 40 is v high....

didn’t he say 40psi to seat and 30 is what he runs?

 

[Tim29]

If you ever want to see, mount a GoPro to your fork leg and video your tire flex in a corner, you be quite surprised at how far the tire flexes.
I found with a EXO+ case dhrii at 31 psi i was 80% on sidewall in hard G turns, after a week of testing i found for my corner speeds my rim was 8mm to narrow to keep the tire firm enough without going to 40psi range.
I now run a 42mm internal rear rim on my ebike with eddy current tire 27.5x2.8 at 30psi

 

[softtailcruiser]

D
didn’t he say 40psi to seat and 30 is what he runs?

If by he you mean me, then yes, I did.

I ended up 30 rear and 25 front. Felt very comfy.

 

[Tim29]

I would agree with that. I personally can’t get away with 30 in rear. I wish i could. Love how if feels everywhere but hard G corners then tire rolls and i take out rims.
With the 42mm internal wheels I’m getting close to 30 now. Was all the way up to 38pso with 34 internal

 

[steve_sordy]

I would agree with that. I personally can’t get away with 30 in rear. I wish i could. Love how if feels everywhere but hard G corners then tire rolls and i take out rims.
With the 42mm internal wheels I’m getting close to 30 now. Was all the way up to 38pso with 34 internal

I have no personal experience of using tyre inserts, but those that do use them swear by them. (There was a thread on here recently). From reading the thread, tyre inserts should allow you to run lower pressures without the attendant problems of rim dinging and/or tyre roll.

 

[Tibo]

View attachment 10160

I've noticed that you have a Levo. You can store a light tube (not an heavy one) in the frame just above the battery ! Seen that somewhere on the internet, can't remember where, I've tested it and it works !

About the original tubeless subject, I run SuperGravity Magic Mary 2.6 at 18F/22R with Stan no tube sealant. Hardest tyres I've mounted due to the strong casing but now it's ok, my plastic tyres mounting lever are a bit small, maybe I'll buy longer ones. I use a Schwalbe tire booster (similar to an Airshot) and soapy water to fit the tyres, works every times during last 2 or 3 years on Maxxis and Schwalbe.

 

[Tim29]

I

I have no personal experience of using tyre inserts, but those that do use them swear by them. (There was a thread on here recently). From reading the thread, tyre inserts should allow you to run lower pressures without the attendant problems of rim dinging and/or tyre roll.

have tried them all now exp schwalbe inner tire system
I have cushcore in there right now , hick Norris did nothing.

 

[softtailcruiser]

Update: Now done about 80 tubeless miles, and tonight on the way home from work along the canal, they have cut the hedge. Usually this is a disaster, as loads of hawthorn twigs litter the path, thorns a-plenty, and much flat-tyre woe.

Not tonight, though. I did get one which went right through and which would have flatted me previously, but I just pulled it out followed by a little bit of the sealant, before I carried on home.

Superb!

 

[steve_sordy]

My record is over two dozen punctures in one tyre without a flat. When the bike was left overnight, the slight damp patches or green dots (depending upon your sealant) emerge and can be counted.

Maybe the damp patches were just the larger holes, maybe the smaller ones were fully sealed!

 

[Kernow]

Update: riding with 25 front and 30 rear feels less ‘bobbly’ or ‘skippy’ if that makes sense. Feels more like the smaller stuff is being cruised over rather than bumped over. I think I will drop a bit more over the next couple of weeks to see what the effect is. Then it’ll be time to work on the suspension set-up, but that’s a whole other thread....

A rule of thumb that’s for me on tyre pressures for trail riding and max grip .hold your bike by the handlebars Lean the bike well over on a grippy solid surface as if cornering hard And push all your wieght down on the bars while watching the side wall flex .let it down until you can just see the sidewall begin to crease or fold under your max downward effort . This is your softest usable pressure , usually around 16-18 psi but will vary a lot on different tyre or rim sizes , I use this pressure on soft slower riding , and add a bit more air fir faster harder corners at trail centres . The rear tyre usually needs about 25 psi for me.or roughly 6-10 psi more than the front to prevent the walls folding . Iam using 2.6 tyres , and I have rat bites fitted which allows me to get away with lower pressures especially on rocky ground .

 

[steve_sordy]

Another tip:
Yesterday I swapped out the Maxxis Rekon tyres for Maxxis HRII. The rear tyre flew on because I had already removed the leaking OE rim tape and replaced it with Gorilla tape. That was when I first bought the bike!
I tried three times to get the new tyre to inflate, tried all the usual tricks. Close inspection revealed that the OE rim tape had sunk down into the spoke holes and the tyre bead was bridging those depressions. This was letting the air out!
I removed the rim tape (awful stuff, it was like ancient Sellotape, thin and crackly), replaced with two runs of Gorilla tape and the tyre went up with a bang at the first attempt. And the 40psi held over night too!

 

[2unfit2ride]

I set up my stock DT Swiss wheelset tubeless today, a couple of observations.

1, I was very surprised that once I took the tube out the wheels had already been fitted with tubeless tape which was a bonus.
2, the valves that came in the box with the bike fitted really snug & well
3, they went up super easy* & have been holding pressure for the last four or five hours
4, I was done in 20 minutes from start to finish

* So after years of using just a track pump I succumbed & bought a Beto tubeless air tank for £40, best accessory purchase ever !

 

[steve_sordy]

...............
4, I was done in 20 minutes from start to finish
...........

That is how it should be, and mostly is. But then you get an outlier! ........

 

[Akiwi]

I converted to tubeless last summer and it worked first time.

Tips: Cutting rim tape to the correct width.

I bought DT-Swiss Rim tape which was wider than my rims. To cut it down I put a hole cutter on my drill that was a little smaller than the roll of tape. then padded it out with masking tape so it was tight. Then running the drill I could use a sharp knife to cut the tape to exactly the width I wanted.
The perfect width is so the rim tape covers the beads on the left and right of yor rims preferably running edge to edge. The DT-Swiss tape was very easy to apply. By pulling it tight, it filled the rim form perfectly and only 1 layer was needed.

I went for the Finnish Line fluid, mainly because it doesn't need to be replaced every year or few months like some of the Latex based systems. It apparently doesn't seal as well as some. But up till now seems fine.

 

[steve_sordy]

@Akiwi Ingenious!
Instead of cutting down the width, I used narrower tape and went round twice, first one on the left, second one on the right.

By "tape" I mean standard Gorilla tape 25mm wide in a 30mm internal rim.

 

[Brianjonesphoto]

When I recently did my rims I tried to go edge to edge with the 25mm gorilla tape. I found the extra tight fit with the tape caused the tire to pop off the bead when there was no pressure. If I only covered the nipple holes the tire had a nice firm seat on the bead with no pressure more like an motorcycle tire. My thoughts were better to have a tire that seats well to prevent burping. So far so go. Been riding in the snow a very low pressures this week and no issues with air loss. I don’t think edge to edge is necessary. As long as there is enough overlap to seal the holes you will be good. Aluminum isn’t all that porous. Make sure you have a good seal at the seam.

 

[Dee Scee]

with regards to safety: you cannot really repair a flat when tubeless ya? so i’ve been riding with one of the big-assed tubes that came inside the 3” purgatorys that came on my levo. it’s freakin’ huge! i’m only carrying it so a flat is less likely to spoil a ride. but, since it wouldn’t be for long term or regular use, i could probably get away with packing a smaller tube ya? how small of a tube do you guys think could still hold a plus size tire on a rim?

 

[Brianjonesphoto]

Have you ever blown up a tube outside of a tire? They stretch quite a bit. I have a boat load of 26” tubes that I’ll make work as 27.5+ spares for now.

 

[steve_sordy]

If you use a smaller tube than it was designed for; yes it will inflate and fill the tyre. But the rubber wall will have been stretched and be thinner than was intended. Therefore it will be weaker. It may be fine as a get you home measure, but rein in the aggressive riding.

 

[softtailcruiser]

Like a balloon. ?

 

[Dee Scee]

ok - i guess more what i meant to ask or discuss was, when running tubless, a body still needs to carry a tube in case of a flat ya? but since plus size tubes are so big / heavy / expensive, do people carry smaller flimsier tubes with them, since they’re really only to avoid being stranded? if so, have you found some good options that take up less space and weigh less? (if i were going to run tubes regularly, i’d run proper sized HD tubes.) anybody found a compact, light tube out there that they’d rely on to keep their tire on the rim and get them back home?

 

[mark.ai]

ok - i guess more what i meant to ask or discuss was, when running tubless, a body still needs to carry a tube in case of a flat ya? but since plus size tubes are so big / heavy / expensive, do people carry smaller flimsier tubes with them, since they’re really only to avoid being stranded? if so, have you found some good options that take up less space and weigh less? (if i were going to run tubes regularly, i’d run proper sized HD tubes.) anybody found a compact, light tube out there that they’d rely on to keep their tire on the rim and get them back home?

Tubolito tubes (Tubolito - Not your normal tube - super lightweight innertubes for your bike) are lighter and take up less space - but more expensive. Handy for a backup though.

 

[Wiltshire Warrior]

Blow up the tyre and get it to seat without the valve core in.......gets more air in quicker and seating easier. Then simply let out the air and screw in the core.... reinflate.

If you really go off exploring tubeless is the only way to stop endless punctures....

View attachment 9887

if that bike was a child - social services would be all over you

Seriously though it can be a bit of a lottery with tire and rim matching, this week I had to swap a perished bonty jones tubeless and the first tire I fitted just wouldn't seal (conti trail king) but the second I tried did (Maxis LUST) this was on a Fulcrum Red metal rim!

Then I have some Stans Alpine rims (the are the opposite of deep) and if I run the tires at 20- they will burp and if I put 40 in they pop off, but if I run them at 30 they are happy all day!

Also if you have run a must rim with a tube in (on low pressure) the valve can jiggle about and wear the rim valve hole wider - making conversion more complex (hot melt glue can help this though)

 

[steve_sordy]

....................

Seriously though it can be a bit of a lottery with tire and rim matching, this week I had to swap a perished bonty jones tubeless and the first tire I fitted just wouldn't seal (conti trail king) but the second I tried did (Maxis LUST) this was on a Fulcrum Red metal rim!

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On my clockwork bike, Conti TKs are my favourite tyre (27.5x2.2 Protect, TLR, BCC). Despite using an Airshot, I used to have problems getting them to seat until I changed the rim tape. I got rid of the OE stuff (nasty) and used some Gorilla tape, two runs one on top of the other of 25mm tape in a 30mm id rim. Inflates first time now using my Airshot.