Considering Selling My Rise H15

[BumblebeeTuna]

Just like the title says, I am thinking about selling my 2 month old Orbea Rise H15. I love the bike and would like to hold onto it, but it seems like people where I live are dead set on making it impossible to ride any of the local, or even further away, trails. I live in the bay area and between the on-trail bike thefts I've been hearing about and the fact that some of the local trail users, not so much MTBers but equestrians and hikers, seem to hate the idea of eMTB on the trails. I bought the bike because I have a baby coming soon and I would like to get as much riding in as possible in the little time I have, but if I can't ride most of the local trails what's the point? Am I crazy to sell?

 

[vladej]

Yes!

 

[BumblebeeTuna]

cant you just roll round with a ar15 on ur back and some hand grenades on ur belt

Lol there’s a thought! if I was in the south nobody would even bat an eye.

 

[Rod B.]

Just like the title says, I am thinking about selling my 2 month old Orbea Rise H15. I love the bike and would like to hold onto it, but it seems like people where I live are dead set on making it impossible to ride any of the local, or even further away, trails. I live in the bay area and between the on-trail bike thefts I've been hearing about and the fact that some of the local trail users, not so much MTBers but equestrians and hikers, seem to hate the idea of eMTB on the trails. I bought the bike because I have a baby coming soon and I would like to get as much riding in as possible in the little time I have, but if I can't ride most of the local trails what's the point? Am I crazy to sell?

Tuna,

As Yogi the Bear once said, "You need to be smarter than the average bear." Take a page from Yogi's playbook and think outside the box. Use the system against the very people who are using the system to prevent you from accessing public trails on your eBike.

Please don't sell the bike. If you do, you'll let those self righteous pricks win and push you off of the trails. You deserve to be on the trail just as much as anybody else.

Knowledge is power. You may not be aware, but no city, county, state or federal government can deprive you of access to public trails as a disabled person. This includes using an eBike as a disabled person to access those public trails.

What is a disabled person? Well that's a very very broad definition according to the American's with Disability Act. The American's with Disability Act (ADA) defines a disability as:

A physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities, a person who has a history or record of such an impairment, or a person who is perceived by others as having such an impairment. The ADA does not specifically name all of the impairments that are covered.

The above covers a wide scope of disabilities, as an example, bad knees, bad back, bad ankle, hearing impairment, medical condition, heart condition, trouble breathing, over weight, old age, high blood pressure, stress, post traumatic stress disorder, impaired hearing, etc.

If you have a disability, you can use your eBike to access city and state park trails and some federal BLM lands. Go to your doctor and tell your doctor about your knee(s), back, trouble breathing, stress, etc. Let your doctor know it's preventing your from exercising and leading a healthy life. Explain that you've tried to pedal a traditional bike, but it hurts too much. You have found that with an eBike you are able to ride, your quality of life as increased because you can exercise and get healthy. Explain to your doctor that local governments prevent you from riding your ebike on trails unless you have a disability and use the eBike as a mobility device. Ask your doctor to write you a letter stating you have a medical condition that requires that you ride an eBike for exercise. A couple of sentences is all you need.

With the letter, if you are ever stopped by a park ranger or other official, you have proof of disability. In most instances a verbal assurance that you are disabled is all you will need to send the park ranger walking. You are not required to disclose the nature of your disability, only that you are disabled. I have not had the need yet to pull out my letter.

The Americans with Disability Act recently changed it's definition of what a disabled "Mobility" device is. It used to be a wheel chair, cane, walker, etc. The ADA recognized that with advances in modern technology, people were using powered devices in new ways for mobility. As an example, instead of a wheel chair, a person with a disability may opt to use a Segway, golf cart, or an electric scooter, etc.

The ADA added the "Other Power Driven Mobility Device" (OPDMD) section to reflect new and yet to be discovered mobility device technology. The OPDMD section states the following:

In recent years, some people with mobility disabilities have begun using less traditional mobility devices such as golf cars or Segways®. These devices are called "other power-driven mobility device" (OPDMD) in the rule. OPDMD is defined in the new rules as "any mobility device powered by batteries, fuel, or other engines… that is used by individuals with mobility disabilities for the purpose of locomotion, including golf cars, electronic personal assistance mobility devices… such as the Segway® PT, or any mobility device designed to operate in areas without defined pedestrian routes, but that is not a wheelchair". When an OPDMD is being used by a person with a mobility disability, different rules apply under the ADA than when it is being used by a person without a disability.

People with disabilities have the right to choose whatever mobility device best suits their needs. For example, someone may choose to use a manual wheelchair rather than a power wheelchair because it enables her to maintain her upper body strength. Similarly, someone who is able to stand may choose to use a Segway® rather than a manual wheelchair because of the health benefits gained by standing. A facility may be required to allow a type of device that is generally prohibited when being used by someone without a disability when it is being used by a person who needs it because of a mobility disability. For example, if golf cars are generally prohibited in a park, the park may be required to allow a golf car when it is being used because of a person's mobility disability, unless there is a legitimate safety reason that it cannot be accommodated.

All cities and states must comply with the Americans with Disability Act. Here's the thing, NOBODY is going to tell you that you can use your eBike as a mobility device. The Sierra Club won't tell you this. Your area hiking club won't tell you this. Your local and state parks won't tell you this. Nobody will advertise that as a disabled person, you are allowed to access trails on your eBike. You need to check the area you are going to ride by going to the city or agency responsible for the area and do a Google search, i.e. "Disabled access to ACME TRAILS." Each city will have posted on it's website an ADA disclosure recognizing that disabled people can use a OPDMD to access trails.

Make sure you take a screen shot of the policy and download it to your phone. Don't assume the city official or park ranger will know policy or ADA law. If you get in a jam, whip out the policy and school them.

Here is am example of a California State Parks sign for Crystal Cove - El Moro Canyon State Park. Note the huge "No eBike" sign. I bring to your attention that nowhere on the state park sign does it say disabled eBike access exempted. Now, let's visit the California State Park's website.

If you go to the California State Parks website and do a bit of research under "Disabled Access to Trails" you will find the following written policy:

https://www.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=30653

In 2010, the United States Department of Justice amended Title 28 of the Code of Federal Regulations relating to Title II of the Americans with Disabilities Act to include another category of mobility aids known as OPDMD. Examples of OPDMD are golf carts, electric bicycles, and Segway scooters. The revised law directs public entities to make reasonable modifications in its policies, practices, or procedures to permit the use of OPDMD by individuals with mobility disabilities. In response, the Department developed the OPDMD policy included in DOM Chapter 2600, Section 2607.11. That policy required that a formal request for a change-in-use must be submitted for devices and locations that do not meet specified criteria and be evaluated per the process described in the Department’s trail Change-in-Use Policy. This DN revises current policy and establishes an OPDMD Deviation process that shall be utilized in lieu of the Change-in-Use process.

2607.11
Other Power Driven Mobility Device (OPDMD) Policy
It is the policy of the Department to permit the use of Other Power Driven Mobility Devices (OPDMDs) by persons with mobility disabilities when such use does not negatively impact the natural and cultural resources of the park or the health and safety of the public. Title II of the ADA defines an OPDMD as any mobility device powered by batteries, fuel, or other engines, whether or not designed primarily for use by individuals with mobility disabilities that is used by individuals with mobility disabilities, for the purpose of locomotion. (28 C.F.R. §35.104)

Unless otherwise authorized in a park unit, the use of OPDMD in California State Parks is restricted to people with mobility disabilities as defined in §35.104 of Title 28 of the Code of Federal Regulations. All users of OPDMD must provide credible assurance that the mobility device is required because of their disability. Credible assurance is a valid State-issued, disability parking placard or card, or other State-issued proof of disability issued to the person who will be using the OPDMD. However, if a person does not have a state-issued placard or card, employees must accept as credible assurance a verbal representation, not contradicted by observable fact, that the OPDMD is being used for a mobility disability.

Here is an example of an Orange County park sign for Laguna Coast. I really like this signage, very fancy, your tax payer dollars at work....basically everything including fun is prohibited. Don't even think about scratching your ass. You will also note that eBikes are prohibited. Nowhere on the sign do you see anything about disabled eBike access exempted.

If you visit Orange County's website and do a search on disabled access to trails, you'll find the following:

ADA Mobility Devices | OC Parks

ADA Mobility Device Rules Effective March 15, 2011 Introduction On September 15, 2010 the United States Department of Justice (DOJ) revised rules to the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) effective March 15, 2011. These rules allow a mobilty device defined by DOJ rules as a wheelchair to be...

ocparks.com

OPDMD Devices
An OPDMD device is any mobility device powered by batteries, fuel, or other engines--whether or not designed primarily for use by individuals with mobility disabilities--that is used by individuals with mobility disabilities for the purpose of locomotion. This includes golf carts, electronic personal assistance mobility devices (EPAMDs), such as the Segway PT, or any mobility device designed to operate in areas without defined pedestrian routes, but that is not a wheelchair within the meaning of this section. This definition does not apply to Federal wilderness areas; wheelchairs in such areas are defined in section 508(c)(2) of the ADA, 42 U.S.C. 12207(c)(2).

(b)(1) Use of other power-driven mobility devices. A public entity shall make reasonable modifications in its policies, practices, or procedures to permit the use of other power-driven mobility devices by individuals with mobility disabilities, unless the public entity can demonstrate that the class of other power-driven mobility devices cannot be operated in accordance with legitimate safety requirements that the public entity has adopted pursuant to § 35.130(h).

(c)(1) Inquiry about disability. A public entity shall not ask an individual using a wheelchair or other power-driven mobility device questions about the nature and extent of the individual´s disability.
(2) Inquiry into use of other power-driven mobility device. A public entity may ask a person using an other power-driven mobility device to provide a credible assurance that the mobility device is required because of the person´s disability. A public entity that permits the use of an other power-driven mobility device by an individual with a mobility disability shall accept the presentation of a valid, State-issued, disability parking placard or card, or other State-issued proof of disability, as a credible assurance that the use of the other power-driven mobility device is for the individual’s mobility disability. In lieu of a valid, State-issued disability parking placard or card, or State-issued proof of disability, a public entity shall accept as a credible assurance a verbal representation, not contradicted by observable fact, that the other power-driven mobility device is being used for a mobility disability.

Go get your letter...Keep you bike....and ride like your hair is on fire.

Cheers.

 

[ebsocalmtb]

@BumblebeeTuna I've ridden up in that area a lot. I've played the ranger danger game in marin etc. Your riding area is more politicized then anything I've ever seen or heard of before. While I would like to say that I wouldn't sell my rise if I lived/rode up there... I have to be honest and say that I'm not sure it would be worth it to deal with the hikers, equestrians and theft. I live in socal and emtb's aren't particularly well received, but the lid is now off of them. Fortunately, our sierra club members are less powerful and less toxic... but even still it's an es show.

All that being said, looking at your situation in a vacuum, I think that the rise h15 is sorta the perfect bike to have if you're having a baby with that fresh baby smell. It is sorta the perfect way to maximize having only 60-90 minutes to ride. So, have you thought about altering your riding times in order to minimize your interactions? Have you checked out the riding in pacifica or some of the other areas that are more mtb culture friendly? Do you think your situation would improve without an ebike or at least with one that was even more stealth then the rise (trek ex-e)?

I catch a slight amount of shit for riding my ebike locally. I own and ride mine mostly because I can, but I do have a life changing injury where the ebike facilitates me riding a handful of months of the year where I otherwise wouldn't be able to. Even though about 70% of my time on the ebike in our local parks is medically justified... I simply don't engage in conversation with people that are angry. I usually just say, "I'm sorry that you're having such a terrible day recreating outside, hopefully it turns around for you, good bye." and I'm on my way. People still yell, kick, scream and throw tantrums all the same... but I just move along on my way. I realize, this anecdote doesn't help much... because the few times I've gotten caught doing something in your area that is technically off limits... the person that saw me called the ranger on me and a high speed pursuit was the result.

I sympathize with you man... it's crazy that the small little area where this sport was born... is the area with the biggest culture and legislative push back against the sport. I generally lean, F-the man and do my sport/things respectfully and mind my own business, but if I lived in your local, I'd likely be asking myself the same questions.

Good luck.

 

[Mike C]

The E-Bike industry needs to lean more heavily on federal, state and local entities and land managers who decided to ban E-Bikes from trails. Where I ride E-Bikes are at least 50% of the bikes out there, even with "No E-Bike" signs posted. Land managers who have the authority to allow or ban them (like many in So. California) defaulted to the easiest - for them - solution. It was the same thing when horse owners tried to kick MTB's off the trails. Stand your ground is my advice. Email your governmental representatives. Soon E-Bikes will outnumber pedal bikes. Something's got to give and soon. All the bluster about E-MTBs speeding, causing unsafe conditions, tearing up trails etc. is total B.S. Hang in there!

 

[BiGJZ74]

Where in the bay do you live? I ride my Rise everywhere around Napa, and North Bay. I also don't ride one like a douche and I'm an insanely courteous trail user so I've never had an issue even in places I shouldn't. I ride hard but don't care about slowing down for a hiker or stopping for an equestrian.

 

[Doug Stampfer]

I can't actually believe the anger towards Emtbs in your country. Over here in NZ they are almost out selling analogue bikes. There used to a bit of cheating type attitude a few years ago however today noone really gives a rats arse. Technically we can't ride in national parks however the powers that be turn a blind eye as the legislation banning them was written before the bikes were popularised and a very large brushstroke attempt to protect the sanctity of the parks
One upside of the situation in your area is that there seems to be incredibly proactive & vocal advocates for the protection of the environment even if in this case they're somewhat misguided.
In a nutshell are they really worried about the effects of emtbs or simply not wanting another group of users on their patch of land?

Also on track bike thefts? like by criminals or vigilantes?

 

[BiGJZ74]

I can't actually believe the anger towards Emtbs in your country. Over here in NZ they are almost out selling analogue bikes. There used to a bit of cheating type attitude a few years ago however today noone really gives a rats arse. Technically we can't ride in national parks however the powers that be turn a blind eye as the legislation banning them was written before the bikes were popularised and a very large brushstroke attempt to protect the sanctity of the parks
One upside of the situation in your area is that there seems to be incredibly proactive & vocal advocates for the protection of the environment even if in this case they're somewhat misguided.
In a nutshell are they really worried about the effects of emtbs or simply not wanting another group of users on their patch of land?

Also on track bike thefts? like by criminals or vigilantes?

There was a bunch of armed Bike jackings throughout the San Francisco Bay Area but the people were caught....no eMTB's just analog.

 

[Rod B.]

I can't actually believe the anger towards Emtbs in your country. Over here in NZ they are almost out selling analogue bikes. There used to a bit of cheating type attitude a few years ago however today noone really gives a rats arse. Technically we can't ride in national parks however the powers that be turn a blind eye as the legislation banning them was written before the bikes were popularised and a very large brushstroke attempt to protect the sanctity of the parks
One upside of the situation in your area is that there seems to be incredibly proactive & vocal advocates for the protection of the environment even if in this case they're somewhat misguided.
In a nutshell are they really worried about the effects of emtbs or simply not wanting another group of users on their patch of land?

Also on track bike thefts? like by criminals or vigilantes?

In the United States, there are special interest hiking groups such as the Sierra Club that actively fight to keep eBikes off of trails across America. The Sierra Club has massive lobbying power and huge financial backing. In general, these hiking groups hate all forms of mountain biking and do everything they can to keep mountain bikes off of hiking trails and out of wilderness areas. Fortunately, mountain biking coalitions have formed and which have been successful in gaining traditional mountain bike access to trails.

Unfortunately, groups like the Sierra Club have been able to push a public safety narrative that electric mountain bikes are dangerous due to their motors and the speeds in which they can travel. They have been largely successful politically in getting ordinances passed which ban mountain bikes from public trails.

APB Alert: E-bikes in our Wilderness Parks

Are you bothered by the increasing presence of e-bikes on the trails in our OC wilderness parks? Their presence is illegal. But the OC Parks Commission is under pressure to amend the regulations governing our wilderness parks that would permit e-bike use (ultimately subject to action by the OC...

www.sierraclub.org

Changing e-bike policy for Mount Tamalpais Watershed risks water, soil and wildlife

A debate is underway about allowing electric bikes on Marin Municipal Water District (MMWD) land. E-bikes are currently prohibited on the watershed. However, an assertive lobby aimed at reversing the policy has succeeded in getting the board to reconsider e-bike restrictions. The Sierra Club...

www.sierraclub.org

https://www.sierraclub.org/sites/www.sierraclub.org/files/Bicycle-Policy-May-2022.pdf

Much of the hate at least in California towards eBikes is based on a total lack of understanding of how eBikes work and a perceived notion that eBikes are "Faster" than traditional bikes, and also more "Trail Destructive" than traditional bikes. These perceptions are not supported by fact and environmental impact studies which have been conducted. The studies have shown there to be no difference between electric and traditional bikes. However the Sierra Club and other hiking groups have their hate of all mountain bikes and the ear of local, county and state governments.

Fortunately, the tide is starting to turn in favor of eBike acceptance within the general mountain biking community. Where there was once outright hatred of eBikes, there is now a more tolerant feeling of acceptance. There will always be those traditional riders that hate eBikes, but the group is growing smaller on a daily basis.

Many mountain biking coalitions, such as the International Mountain Biking Association, in years past have either actively lobbied against eBikes or have taken a neutral position. There was a false fear within the mountain bike coalitions that if they supported and pushed for eBike access to trails, they could loose trail access for all mountain bikes. This is an understandable position but in hindsight was a mistake. The refusal to support eBikes allowed the hiking and special interest groups such as the Sierra Club to gain political traction and pass laws that will prevent eBike access to trails for years to come.

If the mountain biking coalitions and mountain bike industry were to actively support and campaign for eBike riders, they would have access to a much, much larger mountain biking public and the associated financial contributions which come from the increased membership. These funds and increased membership could be used to educate the public and roll back the damage caused by the Sierra Club and other special interest groups. When this eventually occurs, the tide will turn.

 

[BumblebeeTuna]

Thanks to everyone for the responses. I currently live in Marin. I moved here 6 months ago from Sonoma County and before that was in San Francisco. As stated above, the special interest groups here are crazy wealthy and led by bored, angry people. The amount of wealth these groups hold cannot be overstated. It's honestly shocking. In my time riding mountain bikes in the North Bay Area I have come across some crazy stuff including traps on legal trails set by, you guessed it, bored, angry people. I'm sure given enough time, maybe a couple years, public opinion will shift and the anti-ebike folks will be the outliers, but for now they seem to be the loudest at the very least.

There's also the issue of trail etiquette. Most, and I do mean most, emtb riders I have come across on the trails are obviously new and have no interest in following any trail etiquette. Getting charged at by someone who is going downhill at full speed while you're climbing on a narrow singletrack is not a fun experience. I always try to follow trail etiquette and this is a huge bummer to see people not even trying to learn the most basic kinds of trail etiquette.

I'm leaning toward keeping my bike and riding it out. Pun intended. Eventually these bored, angry people will find something new to fixate on. At least that's what I figure. Thanks again and have fun riding!

 

[BiGJZ74]

Thanks to everyone for the responses. I currently live in Marin. I moved here 6 months ago from Sonoma County and before that was in San Francisco. As stated above, the special interest groups here are crazy wealthy and led by bored, angry people. The amount of wealth these groups hold cannot be overstated. It's honestly shocking. In my time riding mountain bikes in the North Bay Area I have come across some crazy stuff including traps on legal trails set by, you guessed it, bored, angry people. I'm sure given enough time, maybe a couple years, public opinion will shift and the anti-ebike folks will be the outliers, but for now they seem to be the loudest at the very least.

There's also the issue of trail etiquette. Most, and I do mean most, emtb riders I have come across on the trails are obviously new and have no interest in following any trail etiquette. Getting charged at by someone who is going downhill at full speed while you're climbing on a narrow singletrack is not a fun experience. I always try to follow trail etiquette and this is a huge bummer to see people not even trying to learn the most basic kinds of trail etiquette.

I'm leaning toward keeping my bike and riding it out. Pun intended. Eventually these bored, angry people will find something new to fixate on. At least that's what I figure. Thanks again and have fun riding!

In the Bay Area I ride my eMTB in the Marin Headlands starting Tennessee Valley lot and head in any direction for as many miles as you can get, China Camp, Moore Creek, Tamarancho, Ponti to Big Rock, OatHill Mine, Skyline Wilderness, & Annadel (technically not legal but Rangers don't seem to care). eMTB not an issue in any of those spots. When it comes to Trail users...in my "on trail" experience the worst are other mtb'ers. I've never had negative experience with an equestrian, a few rude hikers but hundreds of mountain bikers strangely enough. These days I rarely see eMTB Newbies on the trails I ride....mostly experienced riders who ride both. Even on an eMTB, newbies wouldn't want to ride that much Techy terrain

 

[BumblebeeTuna]

In the Bay Area I ride my eMTB in the Marin Headlands starting Tennessee Valley lot and head in any direction for as many miles as you can get, China Camp, Moore Creek, Tamarancho, Ponti to Big Rock, OatHill Mine, Skyline Wilderness, & Annadel (technically not legal but Rangers don't seem to care). eMTB not an issue in any of those spots. When it comes to Trail users...in my "on trail" experience the worst are other mtb'ers. I've never had negative experience with an equestrian, a few rude hikers but hundreds of mountain bikers strangely enough. These days I rarely see eMTB Newbies on the trails I ride....mostly experienced riders who ride both. Even on an eMTB, newbies wouldn't want to ride that much Techy terrain

I must be getting lucky because I ride a lot of the same trails with the addition of 680 trail in Lucas Valley and have had some weird encounters. I love riding Annadel but they took a hard stance against emtb and so did Tahoe recently. Tahoe seems to go back and forth so hopefully they'll change course again soon.

Now that I'm thinking about it, the most problematic trails I've been on have been the most beginner oriented trails(fire roads, Helen Putnam, China Camp, etc) which are the easiest trails to ride after work, meaning I spend a decent amount of time on them. Thanks for chiming in. I've decided to keep my emtb for now and see how it goes. With any luck, people's minds will change with time and this whole thing will be remembered as a weird moment in time. Just like suspension mtb or fat tires lol

 

[cookie70]

wow very sobering stories! Luckily we have not got to this level in AU

There has been explosion in uptake of ebikes and now seeing the increase pressure on the trails, the big issue being ebikes going up the wrong way or cutting in shortcuts for their own use. I definitely think MTB clubs need to look at this changing use and adjust the trails to accommodate them!

 

[Richridesmtb]

Cutting corners or whole sections of trails has been a huge issue in my area of AU. It has started with the COVID boom and emtb is making it worse in many cases. Every trail feature looks like a three lane highway with all the ride arounds. Longer ebikes have meant many tight sections are challenging and slow, so they just cut them off the trail. Hey it makes you looks quicker on strava too.

 

[flash]

Cutting trails is a small thing where I ride (north of Sydney). Biggest problem is those who don't understand what "trail closed" means. Not just eBikes though. A selfish pathetic few entitled souls on all types of bikes. Same guys who don't turn up to dig days to repair the damage they cause. We've had double our annual rainfall already this year with more to come. Stay home or ride a fire trail FFS!

As for eBikes? No one gives a shit. They're everywhere. Most of them are established riders now, unlike 4 years ago. Last year we had a rush of COVID families turn up for six months. Riding was one of only a few permissible activities during the lockdowns so they came out in force on their old clunkers. They're gone now. Back to whatever they were doing before.

eBikes are just another ride here. And mtb is booming. Money is coming in and new trails and parks are opening. I think we see that eBikes mean more riders and more riders means more money for more trails. More trails are good. Even the greenies like them because a trail can help protect a wilderness. My council are retarded and corrupt but even they are working on an MTB plan. Sure we get a few rabid walkers but since we don't tend to share trails we have less issues. And they're not organised into a militia like the USA.

I do think the fact we don't share most trails has really helped us avoid the issues that the US has had. Here horses are the ones who are considered to be the most damaging and they're the ones who have no access in many national parks. But they have places they can ride. Walkers have tracks and we have trails.

I do feel bad for you guys in the US. Unfortunately it seems, from the outside that you are really divisive on many issues whereas we just don't have the energy to argue about it. Surely the rest of the world just proves that MTB is MTB and it doesn't matter whether it's assisted or not? Keep riding. I hope it works out for you.

Gordon

 

[BiGJZ74]

Cutting trails is a small thing where I ride (north of Sydney). Biggest problem is those who don't understand what "trail closed" means. Not just eBikes though. A selfish pathetic few entitled souls on all types of bikes. Same guys who don't turn up to dig days to repair the damage they cause. We've had double our annual rainfall already this year with more to come. Stay home or ride a fire trail FFS!

As for eBikes? No one gives a shit. They're everywhere. Most of them are established riders now, unlike 4 years ago. Last year we had a rush of COVID families turn up for six months. Riding was one of only a few permissible activities during the lockdowns so they came out in force on their old clunkers. They're gone now. Back to whatever they were doing before.

eBikes are just another ride here. And mtb is booming. Money is coming in and new trails and parks are opening. I think we see that eBikes mean more riders and more riders means more money for more trails. More trails are good. Even the greenies like them because a trail can help protect a wilderness. My council are retarded and corrupt but even they are working on an MTB plan. Sure we get a few rabid walkers but since we don't tend to share trails we have less issues. And they're not organised into a militia like the USA.

I do think the fact we don't share most trails has really helped us avoid the issues that the US has had. Here horses are the ones who are considered to be the most damaging and they're the ones who have no access in many national parks. But they have places they can ride. Walkers have tracks and we have trails.

I do feel bad for you guys in the US. Unfortunately it seems, from the outside that you are really divisive on many issues whereas we just don't have the energy to argue about it. Surely the rest of the world just proves that MTB is MTB and it doesn't matter whether it's assisted or not? Keep riding. I hope it works out for you.

Gordon

From the inside were to divisive LOL, everyone too worried about everyone else is doing. LOL. Let's have fun and ride. EMTB, Mtb, Gravel who cares. I've definitely noticed the same thing you did out here as well, less newbies on eMTB, and more seasoned riders. I honestly hardly ever see newbs on the trails I ride anymore.....when I did during the peak of the pandemic....they'd be walking through all of the Techy rocks looking miserable....probably never came back.

 

[Cell4soul]

Keep the bike, you won’t regret it. It will put a huge grin on your face every time you ride it.

 

[MikeL_mtb]

Sounds like you just need to cut the motor when you approach other people and pedal past silently, if you happen to have the display on your bars, switch it out for the little box with the led's instead. I've literally stopped and talked with other bikers and they were surprised when I told them my rise was an ebike (as in, they were looking at it, and couldn't tell).

 

[Longfellow78]

Wow I can't believe the anti ebike sentiment in the US. In the UK where I ride ebike are probably over 50% of the bikes I see. In Europe we also have the 15.5mph assist limit whereas in the US it is 20mph which possibly is a contributory factor to the anti ebike feeling.

OP could sell the rise and buy a new Trek ExE. The motor is invisible and apparently almost silent. No one can tell it is an ebike...

 

[yolo_MTB]

I must be getting lucky because I ride a lot of the same trails with the addition of 680 trail in Lucas Valley and have had some weird encounters. I love riding Annadel but they took a hard stance against emtb and so did Tahoe recently. Tahoe seems to go back and forth so hopefully they'll change course again soon.

Now that I'm thinking about it, the most problematic trails I've been on have been the most beginner oriented trails(fire roads, Helen Putnam, China Camp, etc) which are the easiest trails to ride after work, meaning I spend a decent amount of time on them. Thanks for chiming in. I've decided to keep my emtb for now and see how it goes. With any luck, people's minds will change with time and this whole thing will be remembered as a weird moment in time. Just like suspension mtb or fat tires lol

Hey, curious what issues you have had at Annadel? I have ridden there a lot and never run into any issues.

 

[BumblebeeTuna]

Hey, curious what issues you have had at Annadel? I have ridden there a lot and never run into any issues.

Annadel took a hard stance against ebikes. I know people still ride them out there, but from what I understand they’ve taken steps to redirect some funds toward hiring more rangers to patrol trails. I pay enough to live here, can’t afford tickets for mtb, too! Lol

 

[BiGJZ74]

Hey, curious what issues you have had at Annadel? I have ridden there a lot and never run into any issues.

I ride there 2-3 times a month and have ridden past Rangers, waved said hello and never an issue. They took a "hard stance" but have yet to enforce it.

 

[BumblebeeTuna]

I ride there 2-3 times a month and have ridden past Rangers, waved said hello and never an issue. They took a "hard stance" but have yet to enforce it.

Good to know! I’ve never had run-ins with the rangers, but some of the riders have strong opinions for sure. I care less about them though. Regardless, I decided to keep my bike. F*** it, ya know?

 

[BiGJZ74]

Good to know! I’ve never had run-ins with the rangers, but some of the riders have strong opinions for sure. I care less about them though. Regardless, I decided to keep my bike. F*** it, ya know?

I think most e-mtb haters see worse case scenario when they think of e-mtb riders. Most who I actually speak to, usually have no issue when they here about how I ride.... I'm not flying uphill, for me boost is at most 6-10mph if its really steep.....little fellas are still faster. I usually ride in trail mode to keep up with my normal sized friends and I'm still working harder then they are....even when I'm an in shape 260 with a 34" waist in still way slower on my regular bikes. I'd still ride the emtb just lower the assist level to keep pace the same. For me to get to 200lbs I'd have to stop lifting weights lose 40lbs of muscle which just isn't happening.