Cliff trail aid ?

[Jaspy]

Sometimes a single track can end up on a questionable very narrow section overhanging steep walls and death if you go over. I usually don’t feel super comfortable riding these sections , But how about just walking your bike through the section, but how? It’s too narrow to walk along side the bike so either carrying it or maybe making some kind of aid to help. How about some kind of telescoping rod that hooks on the bars that is long enough to enable you to stand behind the bike and still push and steer from behind ? I dunno just thinking , how do you guys manage these sections ?

 

[Jackware]

Maybe a perfect time to dismantle the bike, hiding the parts in various places under your previously purchased camo nets and then just take a stroll along the track?

 

[RustyIron]

Please send pictures of these trails that you've found to be so vexing.

 

[Jaspy]

Please send pictures of these trails that you've found to be so vexing.

Hey Rusty I sure would but currently there is so much snow I am finding it near impossible to get above 1000 meters but that is changing so hopefully soon !
Here is one , you can see the snow covered trail up to the ridge line

 

[SteveSSS]

Why not just pull the bike up onto its back wheel and walk it in front of you? Works through narrow gaps / gates.

 

[RustyIron]

Here is one , you can see the snow covered trail up to the ridge line

Very cool. Frankly, I can't even see the trail.
Maybe it's time to trade that bike in on a rope, crampons, and an ice axe!

When I ride areas where riders or hikers have died, I try to remember that they didn't get a trophy for their effort, I'm not going to get a trophy for my effort, there's no shame in walking, and everybody walks sometimes. And sometimes it's best to just say no, and choose another route.

 

[urastus]

Why not just pull the bike up onto its back wheel and walk it in front of you? Works through narrow gaps / gates.

I'm surprised the question came up . Because it did it might be worth adding the bit about controlling the bike with the rear brake too

It is an awesome technique, easy to walk up stairs (lift with knee under the seat) and down stairs too - using that rear brake of course. And, you can also pivot it on the back wheel to turn it around in tight space.

 

[Jaspy]

Guys I certainly appreciate your comments and concerns that’s for sure. As far as popping the front wheel up, I have done it a lot , not as much with the E. The problem I have rollin just on the rear is the surface difference. On smooth or even fairly chunky gravel all is well. Now change that to multifaceted rocks everywhere of varying shapes and sizes. Slate slides always make my butt pucker. Once you start to slip on those it’s near impossible to stop except at the bottom dead. In an ideal situation the back wheelie works marvellous. Another concern doin the one wheel is how you have to constantly keep the bike in balance and even the slightest unexpected jar or fast move can send your ride crashing into oblivion. So this was why I thought perhaps keeping both wheels on the ground and somehow guiding the bike from the back, kinda like a walking tractor idea.. haha

 

[Pdoz]

Have you practiced using the bike in walk mode on its rear wheel? I'm not sure how that works in low traction situations - heat and snakes are our dangers

 

[Hobo Mikey]

Just find a different trail if your scared.

 

[B1rdie]

I am trying to figure how a telescoping rod with a 25 kg bike hanging at the tip of a clif would look like… fishing a crocodile on florida swamp, maybe…

 

[Jimbo Vills]

I am trying to figure how a telescoping rod with a 25 kg bike hanging at the tip of a clif would look like… fishing a crocodile on florida swamp, maybe…

Much easier to control than putting the bike on the back wheel, close to you, with a rear brake and walk assist to aid control. Apparently.

Man skipped day 1 of physics school

OP - if its that precarious for you, don't take the bike lol

 

[Mikerb]

I am afraid the OP sounds like he is merely trying to impress folk with how dangerous his trails are!! There is no solution other than making the obvious decision. Its a ctually very simple. If riding any section of trail is so precarious that any slip results in death......you dont ride it..........and if its too dangerous to ride it is likely too dangerous to try walking it whilst controlling a 20kg + bike regardless of the method.

 

[Jaspy]

Omg, chilax boys , been living in the mts forever, seems quite normal to ask a pretty straight forward question. From the responses so far I guess you’re not too familiar with the territory out here or are just plain flatlander’s.
cheers haha

 

[Stihldog]

Omg, chilax boys , been living in the mts forever, seems quite normal to ask a pretty straight forward question. From the responses so far I guess you’re not too familiar with the territory out here or are just plain flatlander’s.
cheers haha

It’s rare to see another bike in some of the areas that I ride. And if by chance I see another bike (eMTB or analog), I will give them all the praise I can.
I’ve found myself in a few situations at higher elevations where I wish I had help. Sometimes in the snow and sometimes on a steep slippery decent. (Once was pinned by my bike in a steep ravine, took an hour to get out). All I can say is; if you ride alone, like I do, at high elevations, like I do, in the snow, like I do…make sure they can find your body. There’s a number of things we can do to lessen the anxiety for family and friends. Fine tune your risk management skills before these rides, like I do, and give them someway to track your progress. That’s all you can do…and take pics.

 

[Mikerb]

Omg, chilax boys , been living in the mts forever, seems quite normal to ask a pretty straight forward question. From the responses so far I guess you’re not too familiar with the territory out here or are just plain flatlander’s.
cheers haha

Not at all. Its a matter of risk v reward and it applies in many sports not just mtb and not just in mountanous terrain...not even just on terra firma.............always keeping in mind that the risk is not just yours but also for those that depend on you in some way or are tasked with helping/finding you when you get into trouble.

 

[Jaspy]

It’s rare to see another bike in some of the areas that I ride. And if by chance I see another bike (eMTB or analog), I will give them all the praise I can.
I’ve found myself in a few situations at higher elevations where I wish I had help. Sometimes in the snow and sometimes on a steep slippery decent. (Once was pinned by my bike in a steep ravine, took an hour to get out). All I can say is; if you ride alone, like I do, at high elevations, like I do, in the snow, like I do…make sure they can find your body. There’s a number of things we can do to lessen the anxiety for family and friends. Fine tune your risk management skills before these rides, like I do, and give them someway to track your progress. That’s all you can do…and take pics.

Thank you! An understanding mate, who’s down the same trail. I use to Really be caught up in safety everything , but over time I have cut back quite a lot. Let common sense prevail…

 

[Stihldog]

..........always keeping in mind that the risk is not just yours but also for those that depend on you in some way or are tasked with helping/finding you when you get into trouble.

You’re absolutely right @Mikerb .Biking on a mountain can be risky and many in here have experienced those risk failures. The heart ache and cost of a screwup can be extreme. They’re can also be risks for dog-walkers in our area too. (See the book, Three Dog Nights). The extent of people involved for three days and nights was amazing. I see Anett regularly on my rides and now she takes more precautions for herself and the dogs . 2 years ago she found and rescued my dog high in our mountain …thank goodness.
I don’t know the extent of @Jaspy ’s experience but he’s from Bea Sea too, so probably slightly off like me.

 

[B1rdie]

I like riding exposed trails, did the infamous portal trail in Utah and also some acquaducts built by the Incas at the Andes that are way more scary than that, so much so that it was only time I can remember to have walked my bike on a downhill.
Still cannot figure a situation where a rod could help handling a bike… to give agressive dogs a slap, maybe.
I did a short video showing how to use the walk wheelie technic to climb a slippery step, while chilling, to demonstrate that with a pull at the bars so that the bike goes past 90 degrees you create a forward force that helps the wheel to top, have the rear brake finger ready to control it.

IMG_1669.MOV

• B1rdie
• Jan 26, 2022

Step climb

 

[Jaspy]

Thanks for the demo b1rdie I appreciate it ! I also have a fair number of years doing rear wheel maneuvers and have come to the conclusion that a bike that is standing up on the rear wheel can/is a lot more unstable under certain circumstances (ie; big rocks ,side hills etc) then a bike standing on two wheels. “If” one’s footing or terrain interferes for a split second causing a potential instability bringing the front wheel down or off to one side even for a second , the results of trying to stabilize/balance the bike can be devastating. Where as a bike on two wheels is easier to control and will only fall over hopefully on the uphill side . With the front wheel in the air you have traded a shorter wheel base for a much higher degree of weight up in the air that requires way more attention and balance. With both wheels on the ground the only real issue is being able to move the bike without having to be along side it. That’s why I figured if there was some way to guide the bike from the back or perhaps from the front, in the normal upright position it would be safer and perhaps easier.

 

[Stihldog]

@Jaspy, this can be tricky. I don’t think your solution of a rod to push/steer the bike through a narrow and very steep trail is the answer. Neither is standing the bike on the rear wheel and pushing forward.

I’ve found myself in this situation a few times. I know that the grass must be greener around the corner so I carry on. My method is to hug the cliff while I carefully guide the bike along side of me…slowly and carefully. I don’t like painting myself into a corner but if I need to back-out …slowly and carefully.

If you really like the trail and plan on using it often …take a bit of time and fix it. . That’s what I would do. Then you (probably only you) will know every inch of trail. If this is also a rock garden, take the time to remove the wheel-busting sharp rocks.

 

[Jaspy]

@Jaspy, this can be tricky. I don’t think your solution of a rod to push/steer the bike through a narrow and very steep trail is the answer. Neither is standing the bike on the rear wheel and pushing forward.

I’ve found myself in this situation a few times. I know that the grass must be greener around the corner so I carry on. My method is to hug the cliff while I carefully guide the bike along side of me…slowly and carefully. I don’t like painting myself into a corner but if I need to back-out …slowly and carefully.

If you really like the trail and plan on using it often …take a bit of time and fix it. . That’s what I would do. Then you (probably only you) will know every inch of trail. If this is also a rock garden, take the time to remove the wheel-busting sharp rocks.

Stihldog you have a great understanding of the situation I am looking at. Unfortunately the particular mt/area is quite a gruelling distance. There may be the odd thing a person can do but mostly it’s a natural unspoiled trail rarely traveled except by the local wildlife I don’t do much trail blazing anymore because it’s usually a horrendous task that always seems to have a million fallen trees . Carrying an ebike over obstacles (usually trees) just saps the energy and fun out of a ride for me. After the fifth or sixth tree I am done and realize it’s either turn back time or continue on. I usually revaluate my route by leaving my bike and hiking ahead to see what’s coming.Nine times out of ten it’s more of the same. So unless you’re carrying a chain saw with lots of fuel it’s basically a no go.
With the narrow slide hills the trail is made by deer and I still don’t know the best technique to roll through. Standing alongside the bike can and does work to a degree but I have found myself dangerously close to the edge because there isn’t enough room for both the bike and myself. Hence the “push stick “ idea. Anyway a lot of food for thought. Thanks again for your valuable feedback. Cheers

 

[Stihldog]

Carrying an ebike over obstacles (usually trees) just saps the energy and fun out of a ride for me. After the fifth or sixth tree I am done and realize it’s either turn back time or continue on. I usually revaluate my route by leaving my bike and hiking ahead to see what’s coming.Nine times out of ten it’s more of the same. So unless you’re carrying a chain saw with lots of fuel it’s basically a no go.

I hear ya. After the winter storms the obstacles (usually trees) can be across many of the trails. I’m not into new-trail -blazing but I will cutout those obstacles.
I don’t carry a chainsaw (I did for 30+years) but sometimes a Milwaukee sawzall and 4-5 batteries. (30-40lbs in the backpack). I take a few pruning blades with me too. I have the luxury of staying out there all day. Or more. Whatever it takes to clear the trail. And I still get to ride.

 

[Zimmerframe]

Personally, I think this thread is just the introduction to the main follow up thread.

"Does anyone know how to get my giant balls up a tiny skinny little track which is really steep and rocky"

 

[DirtFarmer]

Sometimes a single track can end up on a questionable very narrow section overhanging steep walls and death if you go over. I usually don’t feel super comfortable riding these sections , But how about just walking your bike through the section, but how? It’s too narrow to walk along side the bike so either carrying it or maybe making some kind of aid to help. How about some kind of telescoping rod that hooks on the bars that is long enough to enable you to stand behind the bike and still push and steer from behind ? I dunno just thinking , how do you guys manage these sections ?

I’ve ran into this on a very short section of trail I didn’t think I could ride but was sure I could walk.
I dismounted to the rear of the bike and then swung the bike to my downhill side with it facing backwards. I carried it across the narrow section and swung it back on the trail in front of me. That was the only way I could do it without getting tangled up.
Check out the video from Roxy’s Ride and Inspire for a demo of the rear dismount.
Also carry a 30 foot section of 3mm (?) climbing rope with you. If you end up over the side you may be able to self rescue and drag your bike up after.

 

[Jaspy]

I hear ya. After the winter storms the obstacles (usually trees) can be across many of the trails. I’m not into new-trail -blazing but I will cutout those obstacles.
I don’t carry a chainsaw (I did for 30+years) but sometimes a Milwaukee sawzall and 4-5 batteries. (30-40lbs in the backpack). I take a few pruning blades with me too. I have the luxury of staying out there all day. Or more. Whatever it takes to clear the trail. And I still get to ride.

Hey Stihldog sawzall !! Ya right for what ? Gathering twigs for a fire? I happened to stumble across an old posting of yours showing your saw set up. Nice job did you have a hitch on your bike to pull that thing ?

Its about the right size for the deadfall out here.

 

[Jaspy]

I’ve ran into this on a very short section of trail I didn’t think I could ride but was sure I could walk.
I dismounted to the rear of the bike and then swung the bike to my downhill side with it facing backwards. I carried it across the narrow section and swung it back on the trail in front of me. That was the only way I could do it without getting tangled up.
Check out the video from Roxy’s Ride and Inspire for a demo of the rear dismount.
Also carry a 30 foot section of 3mm (?) climbing rope with you. If you end up over the side you may be able to self rescue and drag your bike up after.

Hey DirtFarmer you have got me thinking now… maybe designing a carrying strap that would lift the entire bike off the ground and enable me to carry it in these sections might be a plan… hmmm

 

[Stihldog]

Hey Stihldog sawzall !! Ya right for what ? Gathering twigs for a fire? I happened to stumble across an old posting of yours showing your saw set up. Nice job did you have a hitch on your bike to pull that thing ?

View attachment 81057
Its about the right size for the deadfall out here.

View attachment 81059

Haha. I’m old but not that old. (Another sip of “gerotol”)

 

[Jaspy]

Haha. I’m old but not that old. (Another sip of “gerotol”)

Haha and here I thought it was you taking the picture ! Haha Nice try to cover that up.

 

[Jaspy]

Eureka!!!! I FOUND IT !! Thanks to DirtFarmer he got me thinking in a different direction and…
It looks like I’m not the only one

Developed in Munich by mountain bikers looking to get higher up into the Alps with their bikes !! Yahoo!

Outentic puts a bike on your back - modular backpack for enduro portages

The Outentic Bike Backpack makes hike-a-bikes easy, in a modular solution to portage your enduro bike & gear high into the mountains in search of new trail!

bikerumor.com