Best All-Around EMTB?

[Doomanic]

where the motor is enough

For the Alps? I'm not convinced that's the case.

 

[nickfrog]

There’s a scary thread I. Here about Decoy water / motor connection System death issues.

I haven't seen it. I am not getting any issues yet either despite wet rides and repeated (but careful) washing.

 

[KeithR]

For the Alps? I'm not convinced that's the case.

From the OP:

Riding will be all over the Swiss Alps but probably mostly trails

SL all the way.

 

[routrax]

If you're back in the alps soon, I'd wait and go hire or demo a few different bike whilst there. From what I've seen most of the brands are available in hire shops if you look around.

 

[Doomanic]

From the OP:

downhills

SL all the way.

Have you ridden an SL? Or "trails" in the Alps? It's a bit different to Swinley.

 

[chirosuisse]

Thanks for everyone's feedback! So very much appreciated!!!

Key takeaways seem to be 1. large battery and/or able to exchange the battery if you're doing a whole day in the alps, 2. have adequate power for getting up the mountains, and 3. have a local bike shop that can service the bike.

I'll be riding a Turbo Levo this coming weekend so I'll get a feel for a Specialized. So I'm excited about that. However, it seems with all the bikes coming out in 2021, Specialized seems (at least on paper) overpriced for the specs you get. But then the are THE brand people have in the SF Bay Area since they are a local brand.

The current contenders I'm looking into (not in order of priority):

• Haibike Xduro AllMtn or Nduro
• Commencal Meta 29 - Ohlin's Edition (cuz I've always loved Ohlins on motorcycles
• Kellys Theos
• YT Decoy - I believe they are still running the 'older' E800 or have they upgraded to EP8?
• Specialized Turbo Levo Comp? - Love the S-Works but don't really see that it's worth it?
• Specialized Kenevo - Hard to get behind the looks though...
• Of course open to all other brands...

It's pretty impossible to test ride anything other than Specialized here, so I may just have to wait until Spring in Switzerland, which will when most 2021 bikes should be available (hopefully).

Thanks again for everyone's input! So much appreciated as a newb getting into the sport. Super excited!

 

[chirosuisse]

If you're back in the alps soon, I'd wait and go hire or demo a few different bike whilst there. From what I've seen most of the brands are available in hire shops if you look around.

Good call!

 

[whiterabbit]

Thanks for everyone's feedback! So very much appreciated!!!

Key takeaways seem to be 1. large battery and/or able to exchange the battery if you're doing a whole day in the alps, 2. have adequate power for getting up the mountains, and 3. have a local bike shop that can service the bike.

I'll be riding a Turbo Levo this coming weekend so I'll get a feel for a Specialized. So I'm excited about that. However, it seems with all the bikes coming out in 2021, Specialized seems (at least on paper) overpriced for the specs you get. But then the are THE brand people have in the SF Bay Area since they are a local brand.

The current contenders I'm looking into (not in order of priority):

• Haibike Xduro AllMtn or Nduro
• Commencal Meta 29 - Ohlin's Edition (cuz I've always loved Ohlins on motorcycles
• Kellys Theos
• YT Decoy - I believe they are still running the 'older' E800 or have they upgraded to EP8?
• Specialized Turbo Levo Comp? - Love the S-Works but don't really see that it's worth it?
• Specialized Kenevo - Hard to get behind the looks though...
• Of course open to all other brands...

It's pretty impossible to test ride anything other than Specialized here, so I may just have to wait until Spring in Switzerland, which will when most 2021 bikes should be available (hopefully).

Thanks again for everyone's input! So much appreciated as a newb getting into the sport. Super excited!

SVCS rental?

Got an idea where you are going to go? I took my demo to Calero/Santa Theresa. Calero has Chisnantuk trail which is kinda flowy, little speedy, all the way up to bald peak and the fireroads around Canada del Oro then back down. Then I charged it overnight and took it to Santa Theresa the next day to blast over Rocky Ridge, speed around Boundary, huff through Ohlone, and finish by both climbing then banging down Stiles Ranch. Gave me a good sense of how the bike would do in loose gravel, hardpack singletrack, rocks and roots, mid size boulders, steep ups and steep downs. I thought it was a pretty good demo area.

If it wasn't for a family trip down south for the weekend, you might have seen me this Sunday doing laps on Rocky Ridge on my Kenevo. In fact, I might try to steal away anyways and do just that . I have a new progressive spring on my rear shock I really want to put to work!

Your needs are different than mine, but after hearing the super loud whirring of non Brose motors, even the SL being louder than I cared to have, Levo/Kenevo was the only choice I could make. Noise was absolute paramount for me. Anyways, the point is, I recommend ignoring spec completely. I recommend buying entirely on motor, battery, and geometry, whatever you choose. Spec can be fixed, but you can't swap out a Brose for a Shimano if that's what you really wanted, or shorten your chainstay by 20mm.

So I ignored the abysmal spec and bought the cheap model. I spent another few hundred overnight to swap out brand new bike parts that are now in the bin and will never get used. At the end of the day I have better spec than the "expert" version (IMO), tailored to exactly what I want, and I paid less than if I bought the Expert or S-works (and had to fix up the spec anyways).

Just another perspective on strategy surrounding spec. Another brand (Whyte I think?) had exactly the spec and geo I wanted, but not the motor. So it was a no-go, and I bought Kenevo.

 

[jeroen]

Key takeaways seem to be 1. large battery and/or able to exchange the battery if you're doing a whole day in the alps, 2. have adequate power for getting up the mountains, and 3. have a local bike shop that can service the bike.

Note that the current Bosch CX has 85Nm (2021 models default, 2020 with upgrade), which is way more than enough for most trails. And especially stony ones the big problem is spinning wheels, thus more torque is not going to help much

I'll be riding a Turbo Levo this coming weekend so I'll get a feel for a Specialized. So I'm excited about that. However, it seems with all the bikes coming out in 2021, Specialized seems (at least on paper) overpriced for the specs you get. But then the are THE brand people have in the SF Bay Area since they are a local brand.

Don't drive what is cool, drive what is fit for your purposes.... which could be a Levo, not a bad bike at all, though I rarely see one here in my area.

Do try as many different bikes as possible, then you know what is good or not about one or the other.

Sidenote: one of the reasons that when we do winter-summer wheel swaps on our car, I request a demo car for the short time they take for swapping and take the demo out for a spin, and even though that one will be in a similar class as ours, I do prefer our own, which just confirms the correct decision --- hence even after getting one riding different bikes can be fun... and why many people in Switzerland have multiple cars: a SUV/offroad + cabrio combo is common (winter/long-distance + summer), same for bikes, though for bikes it seems the average is 3: two e-bikes and a road-bike.

Haibike Xduro AllMtn or Nduro

I would really suggest a big no for these. They look really awesome on paper, and actually drive pretty well..... but.... it is a ~30kg bike, with an engine that is too powerful (one does not need that amount of torque, really, especially on trails).
You run through a battery quicker than a sneeze, which is the worst problem.

You won't hop a fence easily with that bike either (enough places where a emtb does not go through, but maybe I should be following trails ), and the fun factor is limited in jumps with 30kgs (next to your own weight + supplies).

Also, more importantly, you will find only afaik mway and emotion (Haibike e-Bikes 2020 in der Schweiz | Jetzt Probefahren!) who actually have/sell them. The emotion Dietikon branch said they rarely sell them and that they rather not due to the many issues they seem to have (what exactly, no idea, but just be aware), they would have loved to sell a 30kg ries & muller though, but those bikes are that heavy as they do actually have a dual battery setup and are made for very long tours. R&M are not mountain bikes though, but then again, if you stick to the trails, they could do quite well.

The big problem with Haibike and the reason why I crossed it easily off my list (next to weight and short range due to battery usage): no support.

If anything happens there are only few stores that can actually service them, next to that, replacement parts are difficult to source.

Great weather in combo with free time is in short supply. As such, when something is wrong, I prefer being able to get my bike fixed asap so I can keep on riding with it. But as noted, that is also why most folks have multiple bikes.... gotta keep on riding

YMMV....

 

[Swissrider]

I live in Switzerland and probably do the sort of riding you’ll be wanting to do. I’m too old and scared of hurting myself to go for it in bike parks so most of my riding is natural single track which sometimes is pretty technical. I ride a 2018 Kenevo, which is sort of half way between a current Levo and Kenevo, in terms of geometry and travel and it suits me very well. A lighter bike would be more playfull, although one has to have the skills to exploit this and taking bigger jumps and popping off everything increases chances of a crash. What I really like about my bike is that it really looks after me and I can go down pretty much everything that can be ridden by mortal bikers, with a lot of confidence. Climbing, especially in Turbo, is an addictive hoot. I think the current Levo is very similar to my bike and several friends ride one and we seem to have about the same success both uphill and downhill. Biggest disadvantage of my bike is its 500 battery and I’m envious of my mates 700 battery in his Levo, as my battery is a limitation on rides together. Luckily, I can borrow the battery from my wife’s Levo if we’re doing a long ride. Because of the amount of ascent in Alpine riding, I would strongly suggest getting a bike with a big battery. It sounds as if I am simply recommending a Levo, which I can’t do 100%. because of the well-known reliability issues. Both myself and my mate’s Levo have had motor replacements. Hopefully, Specialized have sorted the problems out and the latest motors will be more reliable and in any case they are now offering 4 years guarantee. Levos are also expensive, and although your budget would cover one, other makes may offer more bang for your buck. Although tempting, given that in Zurich, you will be close to a good choice of shops, I would not go the direct sales route. It’s fine for analogue bikes, which can be fixed by the owner or any shop, but it seems when things go wrong with the electrics, the direct sellers often want the whole bike shipped back and you end up without a bike for months. In the end, almost any ebike will be great fun. Every ebike is a compromise somewhere, and it’s a matter of choosing what will suit where and how you ride

 

[Eddy Current]

A great all rounder is some 66 HA 450 chainstays not highly progressive suspension, 29er, big battery, pretty much all trail ebikes are like that if you steep furthering you get into enduro territory wich is obviously more downhill oriented and so less versatile

I think the Cube 140 is a great all rounder with decent prices if you don’t look for nothing extreme is a great option. Giant X is another good way to go if you want to be more planted on the descents with the longer reach and chainstays but will be less nimble at low speeds and tights corners.