All New 2019 Specialized Turbo Levo launched

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Still not sure how the shuttle mode works. If the remote toggles betweeen Eco/Trail/Turbo do you have to enable shuttle with a phone ? If I then change to trail mode and do a run downhill in do I need to re-activate shuttle with the phone again ? Thats a bit tedious.
I would like to use the 'S' button for shuttle mode but I am sure I read somewhere it only changes into turbo mode.

I just looked through the manual to try and work out how to turn on Shuttle mode but there's no reference to it. I'll see if I can ask Specialized.

Spesh say: "There’s even a new Shuttle Mode feature that takes the sting out of long climbs by giving you maximum motor support with less required effort at the pedals."

 

[Al Boneta]

I'd like to genuinely know why its even 5.3% more, that's absurd year on year increase. The car industry doesn't do this, new cars are the same price each year, it really doesn't matter how you spin it, these bikes are massively overpriced for what you get spec wise.

If they are putting 100% of the profit into development, its a real slap in the face that they give you the 3 year old battery in the majority of the builds, and also include components that are worse than the 2018 model, doesn't seem like the money filters back into any of those aspects.

Great bikes, sure, but massively, massively overpriced for the spec, its purely for aesthetics/customer support, they are all about 30% too expensive, but that is the premium you often pay for "designer" brands and the like.

What spec are you referring to? What derailleur or fork they have? Or the most powerful motor on the market with all new 21700 cell batteries and exclusive software?
By designer brand, do you mean a brand that actually designs and engineers their own products? Or a catalog company that hangs a one level higher derailleur and fork on a generic frame that is the exact same one that 12 other companies use all around the world, hoping you won’t notice?
Why is it absurd that it went up 5.3% when I already explained that with all of the factors I added up in my earlier post?
How is the battery 3 years old? It uses 21700 cells when the previous model’s battery used 18650 cells.
How do you come up with your 30% overpriced figure? Were you involved in the design, development, engineering, sourcing, testing, marketing, distribution and know what Specialized operating costs are?
A fork, a derailleur, Shock etc are much more practical, possible and cheaper to replace than a motor system or a frame.
You can hang all of the boutique components you want on any bike with a Yamaha PD-X bike and it still won’t come close to the performance, weight and handling of the base level 2019 Levo
A pivot shuttle only has Fox Elite Level suspension, but I’d take that over just about any other E8000 bike with Fox Factory

 

[R120]

Can you do it off the top tube button?

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Can you do it off the top tube button?

Ill go and have another look

 

[R120]

Don't spend too much time looking, we want to see a video of some riding!

 

[Al Boneta]

Ill go and have another look

You set the shuttle mode in the app. It’s default setting is “0”

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Don't spend too much time looking, we want to see a video of some riding!

Heading out this morning! I'm going to ride the bike for a good few days and get some a real good feel for it then get a vid out next week (ish). You'll see it first as a Patreon

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

You set the shuttle mode in the app. It’s default setting is “0”

Ahh there it is!! So how do we engage Shuttle mode? I wonder if its the same as the old Turbo mode button?

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

If its the 'Turbo Boost' button, as referred to in the 2019 Manual, then I guess its just been rebranded as Shuttle mode? IE no different to before...

 

[Al Boneta]

Ahh there it is!! So how do we engage Shuttle mode? I wonder if its the same as the old Turbo mode button?

It’s 2AM here, I am too tired to go back to shop to check

 

[R120]

I think the cost of the levo is a distraction - you will always be able to get a better value, and probably just as good a bike as a Specialized, whether its and emtb, road bike, or whatever.

The same goes for the likes of Pivot, Yeti, Intense, Santa Cruz etc.

However you can see that with the majority of higher priced bikes, they have a lot more thought gone into the detail, and thats what you are paying for - now this doesn't mean they are actually a better bike, but it does mean you are getting a premium product. And if they aren't a direct sales brand, then again you will be paying a premium for the customer service you get from buying via a shop, which again is hard to value, but can be invaluable if the retailer is top notch.

Its bit like buying a shotgun - 2k probably buys you the best performing shotgun on a technical level that you can get, anything more that you pay beyond that is purely for the aesthetics and craftsmanship - a 100k shotgun is no better a shotgun than a 2k one, but its going to be a bespoke piece with hours put into the woodwork and scrollwork, and a lot of personal time put in by the retailer into fit and customer service. Some people value that, and others don't.

My Vitus is like the 2k shotgun, and a Pivot Shuttle is like a 100k shotgun. Same Motor, same end result, one you will lust after and the other you probably wont!

 

[CryptoBiker]

What spec are you referring to? What derailleur or fork they have? Or the most powerful motor on the market with all new 21700 cell batteries and exclusive software?
By designer brand, do you mean a brand that actually designs and engineers their own products? Or a catalog company that hangs a one level higher derailleur and fork on a generic frame that is the exact same one that 12 other companies use all around the world, hoping you won’t notice?
Why is it absurd that it went up 5.3% when I already explained that with all of the factors I added up in my earlier post?
How is the battery 3 years old? It uses 21700 cells when the previous model’s battery used 18650 cells.
How do you come up with your 30% overpriced figure? Were you involved in the design, development, engineering, sourcing, testing, marketing, distribution and know what Specialized operating costs are?
A fork, a derailleur, Shock etc are much more practical, possible and cheaper to replace than a motor system or a frame.
You can hang all of the boutique components you want on any bike with a Yamaha PD-X bike and it still won’t come close to the performance, weight and handling of the base level 2019 Levo
A pivot shuttle only has Fox Elite Level suspension, but I’d take that over just about any other E8000 bike with Fox Factory

Yes, those components are poor, and should not be anywhere near a bike upwards of 4k.

The battery capacity is 504w, same as 3 year old bikes, nobody cares about the cell density if it doesn't increase the overall watt hours.

There are actually plenty of bike brands that are designing and building their own frames and putting vastly superior components on at better value prices.

As for "most powerful motor" well, no its not, the TQ120 has been in bikes for going on 2 years now, and for a lot of people the amount of assistance is already plenty, and range and better components are what we are looking for, not a more powerful motor.

Obviously these bikes make you a lot of money or you wouldn't be defending them as if your life depended on them, but to try and claim they are in any way good value, etc, is leading people up the garden path, they are overpriced and underspecced.

 

[CryptoBiker]

I think the cost of the levo is a distraction - you will always be able to get a better value, and probably just as good a bike as a Specialized, whether its and emtb, road bike, or whatever.

The same goes for the likes of Pivot, Yeti, Intense, Santa Cruz etc.

However you can see that with the majority of higher priced bikes, they have a lot more thought gone into the detail, and thats what you are paying for - now this doesn't mean they are actually a better bike, but it does mean you are getting a premium product. And if they aren't a direct sales brand, then again you will be paying a premium for the customer service you get from buying via a shop, which again is hard to value, but can be invaluable if the retailer is top notch.

Its bit like buying a shotgun - 2k probably buys you the best performing shotgun on a technical level that you can get, anything more that you pay beyond that is purely for the aesthetics and craftsmanship - a 100k shotgun is no better a shotgun than a 2k one, but its going to be a bespoke piece with hours put into the woodwork and scrollwork, and a lot of personal time put in by the retailer into fit and customer service. Some people value that, and others don't.

My Vitus is like the 2k shotgun, and a Pivot Shuttle is like a 100k shotgun. Same Motor, same end result, one you will lust after and the other you probably wont!

I do find in lots of the examples you've given the components are of a considerably higher spec than on this levo though. I just think they've gone too far in both directions, too cheap components and too much of a premium in the price, you can go for the brands you've suggested and get a far better specced bike for the same price. These are the prices of cars, let's not forget that.

And on your gun analogy, you'd expect that on a 2k gun, you'd not have to replace the key components that contribute to it firing well/straight/successfully/safely each time.

 

[R120]

Yup - and as in cars people buy a Mercedes a class over a Ford Focus because it’s a Mercedes. Their choice

 

[CryptoBiker]

Yup - and as in cars people buy a Mercedes a class over a Ford Focus because it’s a Mercedes. Their choice

But the price of a top end Merc stays the same each year, and you don't need to upgrade the brakes, windows, car seats, steering wheel etc as soon as you get it, you get all higher end components from the start...

German made cars are better, that's what you're paying for, and I am sorry but this bike is american made and overpriced, there is no comparison with a top end German car that ACTUALLY performs better than the Ford.

 

[CryptoBiker]

I just think people need to be honest when it comes to things being overpriced.

You are paying for name alone, not performance or build quality or components.

If you know that going in, then you're making an informed decision and that's perfectly fine, but for a lot of people, they're going to assume that this bike has quality components given its price, which I think is harsh and unfair.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Components are only part of the experience though, right? In fact, I think that 'entry to mid level' components are probably good enough for most people (not everyone, but a big proportion of riders). Yes, you could get a cheaper bike with better components. Will it be a better bike though, because it had better components?

My experience of bike ownership is based on many factors, including dealer network and support. Yes, Canyon and Vitus are much cheaper through a variety of different reasons. But we've already had examples of 3-4 week wait on warranty work resulting in no ride, poor service on delivery of bikes with huge wait times with zero communication etc etc. That to me makes a huge difference to ownership experience.

I'd honestly recommend you ride this new bike to make your mind up. Its vastly different to anything, in my early impressions of riding it.

 

[CryptoBiker]

Components are only part of the experience though, right? In fact, I think that 'entry to mid level' components are probably good enough for most people (not everyone, but a big proportion of riders). Yes, you could get a cheaper bike with better components. Will it be a better bike though, because it had better components?

My experience of bike ownership is based on many factors, including dealer network and support. Yes, Canyon and Vitus are much cheaper through a variety of different reasons. But we've already had examples of 3-4 week wait on warranty work resulting in no ride, poor service on delivery of bikes with huge wait times with zero communication etc etc. That to me makes a huge difference to ownership experience.

I'd honestly recommend you ride this new bike to make your mind up. Its vastly different to anything, in my early impressions of riding it.

"Yes, you could get a cheaper bike with better components. Will it be a better bike though, because it had better components?" - As long as the frame has reasonable geometry then 100% yes.
I just don't see why it has entry-mid level components given the price is four thousand pounds.

The better option would have been for them to sell it frame/battery/motor only and let you upgrade, but they'd lose out on the huge premium on the cheap components imo.

 

[CryptoBiker]

Isn't this a more fair price for the spec?

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

"Yes, you could get a cheaper bike with better components. Will it be a better bike though, because it had better components?" - As long as the frame has reasonable geometry then 100% yes.
I just don't see why it has entry-mid level components given the price is four thousand pounds.

The better option would have been for them to sell it frame/battery/motor only and let you upgrade, but they'd lose out on the huge premium on the cheap components imo.

What about the motor? Battery? Integration and look? The Levo has a motor housed in magnesium to save weight. What about the software that controls the bike? Theres way more to it that what the spec sheet says, IMO.

Specialized had 18 engineers work on the new Levo full time.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Isn't this a more fair price for the spec?

Again it all depends on what you're looking for. Like I mentioned above I'm looking at the entire ownership experience. I dont like the look of that bike at all and I would never buy it.

But I also appreciate that we live in a world where we are free to choose whatever makes us happy

 

[Albez]

I'd like to genuinely know why its even 5.3% more, that's absurd year on year increase. The car industry doesn't do this, new cars are the same price each year, it really doesn't matter how you spin it, these bikes are massively overpriced for what you get spec wise.

If they are putting 100% of the profit into development, its a real slap in the face that they give you the 3 year old battery in the majority of the builds, and also include components that are worse than the 2018 model, doesn't seem like the money filters back into any of those aspects.

Great bikes, sure, but massively, massively overpriced for the spec, its purely for aesthetics/customer support, they are all about 30% too expensive, but that is the premium you often pay for "designer" brands and the like.

I can't believe they are putting 100% of the profits back into development, that's like kamikaze business ethics.

 

[CryptoBiker]

What about the motor? Battery? Integration and look? The Levo has a motor housed in magnesium to save weight. What about the software that controls the bike? Theres way more to it that what the spec sheet says, IMO.

Specialized had 18 engineers work on the new Levo full time.

I am not disputing those all took r&d and a lot of time and effort went into it, but other companies are using the same motors and making sleeker looking bikes with better components, and charging 30% less. I am sure it rides really well, but its too expensive for what you get.

 

[CryptoBiker]

I can't believe they are putting 100% of the profits back into development, that's like kamikaze business ethics.

They aren't is the short answer.

 

[Albez]

What about the motor? Battery? Integration and look? The Levo has a motor housed in magnesium to save weight. What about the software that controls the bike? Theres way more to it that what the spec sheet says, IMO.

Specialized had 18 engineers work on the new Levo full time.

I wouldn't call the levo a looker but then I wouldn't call the iPhone a looker either. Some people prefer labels over substance and are prepared to pay a premium for it.

 

[CryptoBiker]

Again it all depends on what you're looking for. Like I mentioned above I'm looking at the entire ownership experience. I dont like the look of that bike at all and I would never buy it.

But I also appreciate that we live in a world where we are free to choose whatever makes us happy

You haven't really addressed any of the points though Rob. That was just one bike, there are plenty of different and varied designs all around 30% cheaper than the 2019 Levos, all offering vastly superior components.

Paying for looks is fine, but paying 3k extra for looks? Come on... surely better ways to spend it?

 

[CryptoBiker]

I wouldn't call the levo a looker but then I wouldn't call the iPhone a looker either. Some people prefer labels over substance and are prepared to pay a premium for it.

Yeah, personally I think the comments about mobility scooter were quite accurate, to me the motor housing looks huge compared to 2018 bikes and downright hilarious compared to some of the proposed 2019 models.

But, people will pay the premium for the brand name.

insert whichever smiley you want here

 

[Kimmoi]

I have Specialized Levo HT, if i am going to fullsus it won't be spes. Why?
Look at this, for example:

Haibike xDuro AllMtn 10.0 FLYON 2019

And look at the components.

 

[Koro]

I have Specialized Levo HT, if i am going to fullsus it won't be spes. Why?
Look at this, for example:

Haibike xDuro AllMtn 10.0 FLYON 2019

And look at the components.

never seen an uglier bike

i think this whole discussion leads to nowhere..
it‘s like discussing about iphone and samsung and other brands (someone already mentioned the iphone which is not even relevant...) .. so yeah probably you get other brands cheaper and with better components, but it is everyone choice to make what to buy and there is also emotion and the optics and the feel when you ride it... specialized but a lot of effort into this bike, so you can value that by buying it or you don‘t... let‘s just stop this

 

[CryptoBiker]

I have Specialized Levo HT, if i am going to fullsus it won't be spes. Why?
Look at this, for example:

Haibike xDuro AllMtn 10.0 FLYON 2019

And look at the components.

Originally I thought these were quite expensively priced, but now they are venturing into bargain territory.

Love the Eagle XX1 look..

never seen an uglier bike

i think this whole discussion leads to nowhere..
it‘s like discussing about iphone and samsung and other brands (someone already mentioned the iphone which is not even relevant...) .. so yeah probably you get other brands cheaper and with better components, but it is everyone choice to make what to buy and there is also emotion and the optics and the feel when you ride it... specialized but a lot of effort into this bike, so you can value that by buying it or you don‘t... let‘s just stop this

What are we supposed to be discussing in here exactly?