2020 Levo - Twitchy? Fixes?

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

Hi,

I have a 2020 base Levo. Been riding a long time. I'm no hero but a half decent XC rider. I notice that the bike is a little twitchy on decents. Nothing crazy. Fire roads and single track. Not resort or park riding.
Not sure if its the entry level 35 gold fork, running in the High flip chip position? I like the bike otherwise.
Climbs well and is responsive on single track. I ride other bikes and none of them seem to wiggle from under me when I start to go fast (maybe 15 mph?) on the downs. I have to focus to keep the bike settled.

Is running low any better? Would a Lyric or Yari help? Was thinking of going to 160 mm would that help or hurt? And finally offsett - I am guessing 42mm would help but hurt low speed handling?

Edit: Also just realized I've always run Minions (Highroller's or DHF / DHR's) on my other bikes. First time with Spesh tires

 

[eabmex]

Do you feel it is un-stable or chattery? I would suggest that you try the low position and make sure you have set up the suspension correctly, I found that the suggested tyre, shock and fork pressures too high for single track use, I also removed volume spacers.
In the end I went to a Lyric Ultimate 160mm 42 mm offset and the difference to the pike is quite remarkable, I would imagine that compared to the base gold 35 the improvement is dramatic.

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

Thanks, I'm close to the RS suggested pressure. I think it's close to a reasonable setting. Yesterday I almost fully compressed the fork on decending. Maybe a little soft. It's hard to set as they really cheaped out on the fork. No marks on the stanchions and the stiction is so great that it's near impossible to set the sag anyway. Set wide open on compression and rebound it seems compliant tho.

Are you in high or low and how did you decide on 42 OS vs stock 51?

 

[Mikerb]

From your description it sounds like the bike is not giving confidence at the front end on descents...at reasonable speed. Potential causes of that are the tyre not sticking to the ground, ie constantly loosing contact with the ground. That could be tyre pressure too high, rebound too fast combined with suspension too soft. If you run the fork fairly soft then rebound needs to be slowed down. Not sure why you would be concerned about "almost" bottoming out the suspension. If the run you were doing was fairly typical for your type of riding there is no reason not to use all your suspension! I assume you are giving the front end a reasonable chance of grabbing the terrain in terms of your body position and riding style?

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

From your description it sounds like the bike is not giving confidence at the front end on descents...at reasonable speed. Potential causes of that are the tyre not sticking to the ground, ie constantly loosing contact with the ground. That could be tyre pressure too high, rebound too fast combined with suspension too soft. If you run the fork fairly soft then rebound needs to be slowed down. Not sure why you would be concerned about "almost" bottoming out the suspension. If the run you were doing was fairly typical for your type of riding there is no reason not to use all your suspension! I assume you are giving the front end a reasonable chance of grabbing the terrain in terms of your body position and riding style?

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

Thanks Mike,. I don't think it's a problem with compliance of the fork. The steering is just sort of unstable. Tires are probably around 20 front and 24 rear. Just a little soft when you squeeze with thumb and forefinger.

My run yesterday was fast on a fire road with no really big hits. That's why I think the fork was set up ok. I'm as skier and long time mtb rider -. My skills are reasonably good. Conservative but good

 

[R120]

Silly question but sometimes best to start with the obvious - is the Stem straight and the whole sterrer/spacers/fork assembly tightened up correctly? And is the the bike the right size - common to see same complaint from people riding too small a bike.

The Gold may be a budget fork, but its still half decent, so I would really check all the set up on the bike first before swapping it out.

 

[Mikerb]

I agree. The last thing you expect from a 29er and from the geometry of the Levo is to be twitchy. So firstly there is no way rebound should be left wide open. The suspension will act as a pogo stick! Second the relatively relaxed geometry 29 wheels and high volume tyres combined with the weight of the Levo means it will plough through most terrain at speed downhill but does need to be "bossed" by the rider. It usually has more of a tendency to track so you have to be in the ready position and be pretty aggressive with weight transfer and moving the bike around. Fast downhill on techy terrain is where you fork set up really counts....it has little to do on flat firetrails or single track so maybe revise your settings and consider your riding style?

 

[Levo-Lon]

Flip the chip.
25% front sag, 12mm rear sag to achieve about 25%
That will sort the twitchy front end

Start with middle rebound settings

 

[comtn]

Change flip chip to lower position and get yourself a decent fork that doesn’t flex like crazy and ideally get a 160 fork. 25-30% sag in the rear and stiffer up front so your fork doesn’t dive. You want the head angle to be slacker, not steeper.

 

[Mikerb]

Of course throwing money at a more expensive fork will improve adjustability and response....but only if it is set up right...meanwhile there is no reason why the existing fork should not deliver reasonable performance on moderate terrain. The answer to every problem is not to rubbish what you have but to maximise it. If excessive stiction is an issue with the fork get it serviced or diy. Lower leg service takes 30 mins and hardly any cost. If the fork has lot of stiction its likely the air chambers are also not equalising. Strip it down and service it to at least get it working at its best and set up properly.

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

All great suggestions thanks! Twitchy may be the wrong word. Unsettled might be a better word. Other bikes I ride are more settled at the bar and inspire more confidence.
I'm not pogoing so will check the headset again for play, maybe do a short ride with my analog front 29 wheel even though it's only 2.3 vs 2.6. it's a maxxis DHF

 

[Ted]

Tires! Go back to Maxxis. That's what I did.

 

[Levo-Lon]

Change flip chip to lower position and get yourself a decent fork that doesn’t flex like crazy and ideally get a 160 fork. 25-30% sag in the rear and stiffer up front so your fork doesn’t dive. You want the head angle to be slacker, not steeper.

He rides XC not the Alps

 

[ebikerider]

Flip the chip.
25% front sag, 10-12% rear sag
That will sort the twitchy front end

Start with middle rebound settings

10-12% rear sag is a typo I'm guessing/hoping?

25-30% sag is suitable for the rear.

 

[Levo-Lon]

10-12% rear sag is a typo I'm guessing/hoping?

25-30% sag is suitable for the rear.

Yes 12mm to give 25% on a 50 mm stroke shock.

From a MTB site
For example, on a rear shock with a 50mm stroke, running 12.5mm of sag, gives you 25% sag. Use your shock pump to inflate or deflate the suspension until you are getting 25% sagged travel (25% is a good starting point in our experience as most bikes are designed around this figure).1 Mar 2019

Thanks ,I'll edit

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

Went for another ride yesterday, this time, just on a dirt road. Amazing scenery but nothing challenging. The fork just sticks in one position unless it takes a pretty hard impact or I bounce my weight fairly hard on it. Even going 15mph on a rutted dirt road
I'm about 175lbs with gear and running it at 85 psi

 

[Fluffymoose]

sounds like my fork, if I compress manually I can Feel it jump between steps almost, it is not smooth at all. was another thread on here talking about ´stiction` on the 35gold fork. So when I compress it goes for a bit, but hits a point where Even harder pressure is needed, it then suddenly seem to release noticeably for a few centimeters and sticks again..

running higher pressure than you due too rider weight, but I am very puzzled by this shocks behaviour. It seems very...special. I tried also deflating, reinflating while equalizing, lubricating stanchions etc.. no change really.

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

I'm pissed my bike came with this fork. A Yari is only a few OEM dollars more and it's a night and day difference.

 

[Choc3]

I have had the same problem with my 2020 Levo read my post (Turbo Levo 2020 fork problem) for more info.
This is an expensive bike and should bring a better fork as well as brakes. I have been struggling with this fork for around a month. I have bought a Lyrik and SLX brakes getting installed this week and will send the 35 for warranty.

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

sounds like my fork, if I compress manually I can Feel it jump between steps almost, it is not smooth at all. was another thread on here talking about ´stiction` on the 35gold fork. So when I compress it goes for a bit, but hits a point where Even harder pressure is needed, it then suddenly seem to release noticeably for a few centimeters and sticks again..

running higher pressure than you due too rider weight, but I am very puzzled by this shocks behaviour. It seems very...special. I tried also deflating, reinflating while equalizing, lubricating stanchions etc.. no change really.

Yeah, it's notchy - even when the stanchions are clean and oiled. After dust accumulates they are worthless unless they take a big hit. I own bikes with Yari, and Pikes. These are awful!

 

[Choc3]

Update I have not gone for a proper ride but what a difference with the Lyrik and SLX brakes. I can feel both suspension working now. There is a huge difference with the new fork It has transformed the bike completly. Now to get some riding and setup everything correctly, lucky I can ride where I live. Happy with the bike now not happy with extra £ spent.

 

[R120]

Well with a lyric you have gone from Vauxhall Nova to McLaren F1! Still the 35 shouldn't be sticking so badly

 

[Choc3]

Agree R120 but there is something not right with the 35. There are many having this same sticking problem. Maybe a production issue. Will send mine for a warranty check/replacement and report back on what the bike shop or RockShox say.

 

[mak]

Ive noticed on the 35 when manually pushing down on the bars there seems to be no disernable difference when adjusting the compression knob until it hits the lockout .

I tested the compression damping adjuster a few months back on a small jump. It does actually work, according to the rubber band travel indicator every click made a slight difference to the amount of compression the fork entered.

Would this suggest it is only noticeable as a high speed compression adjustment and the low speed is sort of non-existent as it doesn't have an option for both?

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

Who knows - but its a worthless piece of kit as far as I can tell. I've been riding off road for 35 years and this fork is worse than the ones that used elastomer bumpers for compression springs!

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

Update I have not gone for a proper ride but what a difference with the Lyrik and SLX brakes. I can feel both suspension working now. There is a huge difference with the new fork It has transformed the bike completly. Now to get some riding and setup everything correctly, lucky I can ride where I live. Happy with the bike now not happy with extra £ spent.

I dont mind the Level brakes so far. With 4 pot up front and a 200 rotor they stop OK. I don't like that SRAM uses DOT fluid instead of mineral oil like the Shimano's or Magura's

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

Called the shop where I purchased the bike today about the fork. They said it should not be sticking like it does. I brought it over to them and will post what they find / do to fix it.

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

The shop was great. Said it didn't feel good to them the second they tried it. They serviced it, said it still didn't feel right. RockS. Says it needs new lowers - which of course are back ordered. Promised for early June..... In the meantime I'm getting my bike back with a bollixed fork.
They steadfastly refused to upgrade the fork even offered to pay - but they said RS absolutely will not

 

[Fluffymoose]

Sad to hear about RS response to your issue with their product. That sound like piss poor customer handling to me, when they deliver a defective product and can not fix it quickly, refusing an upgrade when you offer to pay the `difference` should be an easy choice to ensure happy customers.

I have seen several threads here now about issues with this fork, and it seems obvious that QC is lacking on this product, at least it makes it clear to me which manufacturer I will no be Buying any suspension products from when upgrade time arrives, nor the brake upgrades that are needed on the bike.

Voting with my wallet