Who needs a E-Fatbike??? (former Moose Manic 2 post ;) )

Guyt · Dec 16, 2024

Tons of E-MTBs out there, but when it comes to Class 1 quality E-Fatbikes, one hand has enough fingers to count them all. Not surprisingly, most of them come from Canada, since we have a bit of knowledge on what works on snow.

The latest to arrive in our bike shop is the Manic 2 from Moose Bicycles:

Check it out, it's pretty impressive:

The Manic 2: Powered by Bosch.

Designed with pride in Canada and powered by the cutting-edge fourth generation Bosch motor.

moosebicycle.com

Jackware · Dec 16, 2024

Looks good - but then I'm biased

Depending on the size of the chainring and how steep local hills are, a 11-50 cassette (with a longer chain) would be an easy upgrade, shame they're only fitting a 500wh battery.

Stihldog · Dec 16, 2024

I still appreciated the full suspension during the climbs.

…to get to the snow

…but once I got there I just followed the skidoo tracks.

Fat tires might have helped but I only used 2.6 Maxxis Assigia.

Guyt · Dec 17, 2024

Stihldog, Winter fatbike is very popular in Québec, we have quite a few centers with great trails All of them allow E-Fatbikes, but also require that the tires are a least 4.5 inches wide (E-Fats and Fats), as narrower tires mess up the trails. No suspensions are needed with the kind of trails we have:

Tire pressure varies from 3 to 8 PSI depending on the surface, so fat tires themselves add natural supensions to the bike

When it gets too rocky, it means that the season for double supension MTBs is started ! But no ways you would get me on My Orbeo Rise on snow, to each season its bike!

The Hodge · Dec 17, 2024

Guyt said:
But no ways you would get me on My Orbeo Rise on snow, to each season its bike!

Spoken like an Ad-mans dream

..while I would agree that fat -bikes are a lot of fun in snowy conditions ..to suggest that one is "needed" to ride on the white-stuff is ridiculous..
I've had some fantastic winter rides on snow & ice on my bouncer ..and look forward to a good few more..( climate change allowing

)

New item by Neil Hodgson

photos.app.goo.gl

The Hodge · Dec 17, 2024

Stihldog said:
Fat tires might have helped but I only used 2.6 Maxxis Assigia.

Is this tyre the shy twin brother of the Maxxis Assegai..who only comes out in winter when all other tyres are warming themselves by the fire

Guyt · Dec 17, 2024

The Hodge said:
to suggest that one is "needed" to ride on the white-stuff is ridiculous..
I've had some fantastic winter rides on snow & ice on my bouncer ..and look forward to a good few more..( climate change allowing )

New item by Neil Hodgson

photos.app.goo.gl

Like I said, winter bike centers where I go have a 4.5 inches minimum width, if you want, I can give you their emalls, so you can tell them how ridiculous they are.

The Hodge · Dec 17, 2024

Guyt said:
Like I said, winter bike centers where I go have a 4.5 inches minimum width, if you want, I can give you their emalls, so you can tell them how ridiculous they are.

I don't think I mentioned anything about bike centres ( that's the correct way to spell it by the way

) ..more the fact that you think a fat bike is necessary to ride on snow....as in " But no ways would you get me on My Orbea Rise on snow ..To each season its bike ! "
It was your notion that you needed a fat bike to ride on snow that I found a bit daft

Stihldog · Dec 17, 2024

The Hodge said:
Is this tyre the shy twin brother of the Maxxis Assegai..who only comes out in winter when all other tyres are warming themselves by the fire

Good catch

. My twin tires don’t get along, and one is always running from the Grammar Police. I also have twin boys …one is evil…I’m not sure which one is the evil one though.

I’ve only seen one fat tire full suspension bike on this mountain. (Bull). It was on the lower trails though, but he had 2 or 3 video cameras attached in different locations. I assume only him and I were on this mountain during snow conditions.

He’s followed my tracks a few times and is no longer surprised to see me.

I can see how larger tires would benefit me at times. If I lived in another area in Canada I would likely have a full-fat-wide-tire. But the snow season is quite short in this area (Fraser Valley, Vancouver). A full suspension is almost necessary.…especially at steep higher altitudes on my 2.6” assi-somethings.

One of my buddies is considering one for hunting.

Guyt · Dec 17, 2024

Anyways, the goal of my post was not to start a debate if wide tires are needed or not to ride on snow. There are not that many good quality E-Fats out there, so I was happy to see there is a new option available and I just wanted to share it with you.

Cheers!

Stihldog · Dec 17, 2024

Guyt said:
Anyways, the goal of my post was not to start a debate if wide tires are needed or not to ride on snow. There are not that many good quality E-Fats out there, so I was happy to see there is a new option available and I just wanted to share it with you.

Cheers!

If I lived in Ontario or Quebec (and I have) this type of bike would be in my sights. Being able to drop the psi to 3-8lbs would definitely help and the Bosch motor is one of the best (IMO).

My hardtail (or ridged) was never as good as my full suspension in the snow. That’s possibly because of the terrain where I ride. Now if I could fit a 4-5” tire on my full suspension bike… I would.

Goodmango13 · Saturday at 1:35 PM

The Hodge said:
Spoken like an Ad-mans dream ..while I would agree that fat -bikes are a lot of fun in snowy conditions ..to suggest that one is "needed" to ride on the white-stuff is ridiculous..
I've had some fantastic winter rides on snow & ice on my bouncer ..and look forward to a good few more..( climate change allowing )

New item by Neil Hodgson

photos.app.goo.gl

Totally agree!

Guyt · Saturday at 2:09 PM

Glad you all totally agree!

Stihldog · Saturday at 3:26 PM

In this area, and probably some areas in EU, the conditions for fat tires is fairly short. I could probably use a fat-tire eBike for 5 days a year. Within days, or sometimes hours, the snow turns to ice and is barely suitable to walk on. I would then need studded tires for a few rides.

An 80lb ridged fat-tire mid-drive would make sense for hunting. I could have used one years ago when I was bow-hunting in the snow and at higher altitudes on the logging roads. These ebikes are definitely regional, and sometimes seasonal.

Being a hunter for years I would have much rather used an ebike, rather than my atv or truck. If I lived in other parts of Canada I would probably have one of those in my stable.

NickJ · Saturday at 7:00 PM

I really like my Norco Bigfoot VLT. I’d definitely like to try the Manic2 and the RM Blizzard PP. Spherik also does a fat bike. Someone needs to do a thorough comparison and post online.

Guyt · Saturday at 9:18 PM

NickJ said:
I really like my Norco Bigfoot VLT. I’d definitely like to try the Manic2 and the RM Blizzard PP. Spherik also does a fat bike. Someone needs to do a thorough comparison and post online.

Finally someone to talk with!

There are lot's of VLT's where I live, must have crossed 5 or 6 while riding today. But I suspect they're at the end of their life cycle, since Norco has gone all Bosch for their MTBs. Almost bought one, but I went with a Spherik, I liked the idea of having an external battery. Mine has the EP8 like yours, but Spherik went with Bafang, not sure I would want one. But the guys at Spherik told me last year they were working on a new model, we'll see...

RM's Blizzard is very interesting, but they are going trough a difficult financial period right now, not sure they will survive. So, for now, I don't think I would buy a E-FAT with a proprietary motor/battery combo.

There's also the Moustache Samedi, but I don't think they upgraded it with the new Bosch motor. I don't know if it's still around, but there is also the Fantic Fat with the Brose motor.

Like you, I would love a thorough comparison of E-Fatbikes, but I am pretty sure the new Moose would win hands down right now.

Jackware · Saturday at 9:29 PM

Guyt said:
Finally someone to talk with!
There's also the Moustache Samedi, but I don't think they upgraded it with the new Bosch motor

In the UK, Moustache have dropped the RRP by £800, though the spec looks the same as last year's.
Unfortunately they supply the bike with rims that I had to ditch as I couldn't get them to work without tubes and there's also no non-suspension fork option for you snow riders.

darwink1 · Saturday at 11:21 PM

I too would ideally want an fs e fattie since I hardly ever ride the groomed bike path trails but the offerings were slim when I bought my vlt. I wanna say Foes and Bulls made them and the bulls isn't available in Canada. Not that I would have picked it over a Foes e mutz... money was the limiting factor here.

I actually own a custom Foes Mutz full suspension fattie that's pretty killer but I'm a full ebike convert now so it doesn't get ridden.

As far as the vlt goes, with some mods like real brakes/rotors/wheels, it's a pretty killer setup. The thing that really sucks is the weight, it's literally heavier than my coil sprung bullit lol. The 27.5 wheels are very ungainly at times as well, they roll great but trying to jump or manhandle the bike in tighter spots is cumbersome. I think smaller people would have a hell of a time trying to ride it and would be better off with 26" wheels.

Also, the frame on my old e8000 vlt was actually nicer than the new version that lacks a seatstay bridge of any kind which allows the stays to spring apart when you undo the axle. Kind of cheesy on a $9000 bike of any kind imop.

But, you can't win em all and overall I don't think I'd trade it for any efat offering (unless a Bosch equipped Mutz fell into my lap lol).

Ps, skinny tires are terrible in real snow even with studs lol.

D

NickJ · Sunday at 12:23 AM

I agree that I’d like a full suspension fat bike, but they’re just so much more money.

Also, I’ve really wondered if the 26” wheels would be better? I’m thinking they’d be wider and have more give. I don’t imagine the diameter would be much different.

Jackware · Sunday at 12:46 AM

I had a FS Haibike fat bike, but it just felt too bulky and heavy, compared to my HT.

darwink1 · Sunday at 12:47 AM

Honestly dude, the difference in diameter is quite drastic and the sidewall is about the same. Here's an old 26" vlt on 4.8 Dillingers compared to a newer 27.5 vlt with 4.5 cake eaters. The two bikes handle noticeably differently.

As an aside, that old vlt with the e8000 is a freaking workhorse. 1756km and still going strong (knock on wood lol)

D

Stihldog · Sunday at 4:02 AM

darwink1 said:
Honestly dude, the difference in diameter is quite drastic and the sidewall is about the same. Here's an old 26" vlt on 4.8 Dillingers compared to a newer 27.5 vlt with 4.5 cake eaters. The two bikes handle noticeably differently.

As an aside, that old vlt with the e8000 is a freaking workhorse. 1756km and still going strong (knock on wood lol)

View attachment 152188 View attachment 152189 View attachment 152190 View attachment 152191 View attachment 152192

D

NOW that’s a bike cave!

NickJ · Sunday at 4:30 AM

Stihldog said:
NOW that’s a bike cave!

I was thinking the same thing! Cool garage.

Also, thanks for clarifying the tire diameter difference. Given the difference, I prefer the taller tire as my bike is an xl.

I just checked the Manic 2 specs. That one is a 27.5. But it doesn’t come in XL.

Guyt · Sunday at 1:13 PM

darwink1 said:
Honestly dude, the difference in diameter is quite drastic and the sidewall is about the same. Here's an old 26" vlt on 4.8 Dillingers compared to a newer 27.5 vlt with 4.5 cake eaters. The two bikes handle noticeably differently.

Rare that someone has both tire sizes, so please tell us how they ride differently?

My Spherik SEF6 (EP8, 630Wh external battery, 26x5 studded Terrine Johnny 5):

darwink1 · Sunday at 1:37 PM

Guyt said:
Rare that someone has both tire sizes, so please tell us how they ride differently?

My Spherik SEF6 (EP8, 630Wh external battery, 26x5 studded Terrine Johnny 5):

Nice bike!

The difference between the 27.5 and 26 is pretty drastic imop. The centrifical forces are pretty crazy with the 27.5s and you really notice it at speed when turning or trying to maneuver the bike. Also, the butt to rear tire clearance suffers so you're constantly getting buzzed when shifting your weight. This probably doesn't matter too much on nice groomed trails but we ride the same trails summer and winter and they don't get any grooming so its a little more challenging.

Getting on the 26er after riding the 27.5 for a bit is like getting onto a kids bike. A kids bike that is so much easier to manhandle lol. Kind of like the difference between a 29 and a 27.5 or 26" skinny bike but with more mass at the wheels.

I'm used to the big wheels now but every once in a while I get reminded of how cumbersome they can be. That and how fast they can get rolling.

D

darwink1 · Sunday at 1:52 PM

NickJ said:
I was thinking the same thing! Cool garage.

Also, thanks for clarifying the tire diameter difference. Given the difference, I prefer the taller tire as my bike is an xl.

I just checked the Manic 2 specs. That one is a 27.5. But it doesn’t come in XL.

Thanks! There's a new project in the garage now (the c10 shortie) so the bikes got shoved in a corner lol. It's kind of nice because it gave me an excuse to kick all of my buddies bikes (3) out that they'd been stashing there. Just Dan's 26" vlt left now and that's hopefully gonna be gone soon.

PS, if anyone needs a 23 Foes mutz with winter/summer setups holler lol..

D

darwink1 · Sunday at 2:02 PM

Ride vid from the other day.

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

youtube.com

D

NickJ · Sunday at 6:51 PM

Guyt, I was close to buying a spherik with the shimano a few years ago but no XL in stock at that time.

I’m still curious if anyone can comment on power delivery. How would the Manic’s Bosch compare to my Bigfoot’s EP8? Would I really notice a difference?

Jackware · Sunday at 7:14 PM

@knut7
Have you tested and compared these motors?

darwink1 · Sunday at 8:46 PM

NickJ said:
Guyt, I was close to buying a spherik with the shimano a few years ago but no XL in stock at that time.

I’m still curious if anyone can comment on power delivery. How would the Manic’s Bosch compare to my Bigfoot’s EP8? Would I really notice a difference?

Interesting observation, my bigfoots ep8 seems to be way more powerful than my Bullit ep8.

D

Who needs a E-Fatbike??? (former Moose Manic 2 post ;) )

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