YT Decoy NOT Serviceable by Shimano and YT Customer Service Fail

[Doomanic]

It never was. At best it was a vote against a Tory majority.

 

[Zimmerframe]

Gentlemen ... whilst I'm always the first to try and derail any thread possible ..

I think in this case, having poor @Jedipip's thread turned into a political thread is a bit unpleasant for anyone !

This is an example of a suitable derailment .. Item no.6 on shock tokens :

Will these fit my Monarch/Cane Creek/non-Fox shock?
Unfortunately not! They are however able to be thrown at the back of your annoying co-worker's head without inflicting too much damage.

Now that's a website we like.

 

[Fx1]

Gentlemen ... whilst I'm always the first to try and derail any thread possible ..

I think in this case, having poor @Jedipip's thread turned into a political thread is a bit unpleasant for anyone !

This is an example of a suitable derailment .. Item no.6 on shock tokens :

View attachment 27445

Will these fit my Monarch/Cane Creek/non-Fox shock?
Unfortunately not! They are however able to be thrown at the back of your annoying co-worker's head without inflicting too much damage.

Now that's a website we like.

To be honest I think this was a hit and run thread for bad publicity. It's on the fb page too.

 

[Jedipip]

Fx1 it ain’t no hit and run....!

I am however, looking at buying some air volume spacers to throw at YT Service Centre staff when I head over there on my £9.99 EasyJet flight to sort this debacle out.

Up until we got a little Xenophobic and political the replies have been really useful.

I’ve waited 3 months and tried every avenue to get the glitch sorted, I’m giving YT a week to put their final offer to me. There’s always hope and the fact that at the end of the day, the bike will still work and a carbon repair is probably gonna be fine.

It’s the delay, the confusion with Shimano UK being told to do one, the unanswered emails and silence until I sent an email last week saying I was cancelling my bike order and wanted a refund! -l24 hours later and the email is responded to, LBS notified of the damage via the courier and all he’ll breaking out.

Shimano UK and LBS both really supportive as we would hope and know they are, YT have corresponded in a way that makes me feel like I’m just far too much hassle.

So the ‘hit and run for bad PR’ isn’t quite right, but I certainly wanted to create a ripple. However, like I said loads of times on FB posts, if YT sort this out, I’ll report the outcome and my pleasure (or pain).

Thanks for the responses you guys. Greatly appreciated.

I’ll let you know what the next week brings in terms of customer service.

 

[Fx1]

Fx1 it ain’t no hit and run....!

I am however, looking at buying some air volume spacers to throw at YT Service Centre staff when I head over there on my £9.99 EasyJet flight to sort this debacle out.

Up until we got a little Xenophobic and political the replies have been really useful.

I’ve waited 3 months and tried every avenue to get the glitch sorted, I’m giving YT a week to put their final offer to me. There’s always hope and the fact that at the end of the day, the bike will still work and a carbon repair is probably gonna be fine.

It’s the delay, the confusion with Shimano UK being told to do one, the unanswered emails and silence until I sent an email last week saying I was cancelling my bike order and wanted a refund! -l24 hours later and the email is responded to, LBS notified of the damage via the courier and all he’ll breaking out.

Shimano UK and LBS both really supportive as we would hope and know they are, YT have corresponded in a way that makes me feel like I’m just far too much hassle.

So the ‘hit and run for bad PR’ isn’t quite right, but I certainly wanted to create a ripple. However, like I said loads of times on FB posts, if YT sort this out, I’ll report the outcome and my pleasure (or pain).

Thanks for the responses you guys. Greatly appreciated.

I’ll let you know what the next week brings in terms of customer service.

I take it back

 

[Lee Dove]

This is a very odd story. My Shimano motor had bearing failure and was replaced by LBS (Edinburgh Bike Coop) no problem. they did not need to talk to YT at all.

The replacement was covered by the warranty from shimano

 

[Jedipip]

Lee tell me more. Which Decoy? And when did you get it sorted?

Many questions....! Which shop? I’ll get to the bottom of this somehow ?

 

[HORSPWR]

Take the Rail.
I don't imagine you'll get it sorted anytime soon with the current global pandemic.

Yep, I agree, take the Rail or see if you can get the Powerfly LT 9.7 G2

 

[Borist]

As Decoy owner I'm disappointed to read about OPs problems.
I do wonder though if YT's reluctance to provide "sync codes" might be related to their deal with the battery supplier. I'm skeptical that YT actually engineered the whole battery (other than defining physical size, mounting points, package mechanical properties like shock loads etc...). If this is the case then it is possible that everything related to software belongs to the battery manufacturer and YT may not be allowed to supply any related info. YT states that the battery is "SMP YT custom", which I understand to be a custom battery made by SMP (Simplo Tech Group, Taiwan).
However, even if this is the case, it would be prudent for YT to communicate the issues clearly and of course take care of the problem promptly.

It is all just a speculation on my part. While our company designs and builds custom Li-ion batteries, I'm working on mechanical design part only and have no expertise in battery software design.

 

[R120]

Yes SMP are the largest third party OEM battery supplier in the industry, their batteries are used in a lot of bikes. I think they are one of the biggest battery suppliers in the laptop and mobile phone industry too.

 

[Jedipip]

Quick update to keep you guys who have an interest on the hook a little longer:

YT have been in contact. Very happy to say it was a grown-up, professional conversation from one of their guys who knows what he is doing and what needs to be done. They are working this through, but Covid 19 is stalling some things obviously.

I will let everyone know when a resolution is decided upon.

Good Times? Almost.....

Until then, I’m putting myself into self-isolation and going riding. Without a motor!

 

[Jedipip]

So.....Good Times!

New frame being fitted to the Decoy Pro and it'll be shipped back amidst the Covid-19 lock down as and when it can be. No cost.

There's a new (British) guy at YT Industries that has sorted this out, he is an impressive addition to their team and has filled in all the gaps, explained the issues and given me insight into some spectacularly good things to hear about.

I have had many things clarified on the motor/battery coding, postal issues, delays and a little bit about how it's getting better at YT for us. He genuinely did make me feel like I mattered.

Faith in YT restored and things are definitely looking up for those of us that had cause to be concerned with the return to base service issues.

Fire a question at me and I'll explain all that I can.

But we have a Canyon Spectral ON to get our heads around this evening! Do I like the integrated handlebars? I think I do....


Jedipip (not a hit and run type of bloke Fx1!)

 

[Fx1]

So.....Good Times!

New frame being fitted to the Decoy Pro and it'll be shipped back amidst the Covid-19 lock down as and when it can be. No cost.

There's a new (British) guy at YT Industries that has sorted this out, he is an impressive addition to their team and has filled in all the gaps, explained the issues and given me insight into some spectacularly good things to hear about.

I have had many things clarified on the motor/battery coding, postal issues, delays and a little bit about how it's getting better at YT for us. He genuinely did make me feel like I mattered.

Faith in YT restored and things are definitely looking up for those of us that had cause to be concerned with the return to base service issues.

Fire a question at me and I'll explain all that I can.

But we have a Canyon Spectral ON to get our heads around this evening! Do I like the integrated handlebars? I think I do....


Jedipip (not a hit and run type of bloke Fx1!)

Can you share the interesting stuff.

Why couldnt it be fixed in the UK?

What's the deal with the battery and motor etc.

 

[Borist]

I'm glad it is working out for you!

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

yea, tell us everything!

 

[Jedipip]

yea, tell us everything!

Can you share the interesting stuff.

Why couldnt it be fixed in the UK?

What's the deal with the battery and motor etc.

On the motor and battery syncing: Shimano do have the code. Quite why Shimano UK (Madison the importer) and Shimano (Japan) didn’t exchange the info is as yet unclear. This goes someway to explain how Lee got his sorted but we still don’t have all the facts. The code does allow access to the data that could then be used, no doubt with ease, to vary motor outputs and speed limits etc. We know that’s a pretty sensitive subject. And lucrative if it falls in to the wrong hands. There’s some communication breakdown somewhere that will get resolved.

The guy sorting this out is UK focused. Has access to a lot of people and resource at YT and, as I said, has a first class honours in customer support and service. You’ll hear more from him and about him and what he’s doing in due course. Seriously Good Times for us UK based YT mob.

 

[Jedipip]

yea, tell us everything!

Dobby if I told you everything I’d never get to look at the new Spectral ON ?

Plus I haven’t got my bike back yet! AND I did promise to undo the social media grief I gave them, just a little bit. I’m not sworn to secrecy but I did get to hear about things and that some of the rumours are true. It’s a good thing if you are UK based and into your YT bikes! timing is everything and Covid 19 isn’t helping.

But YT are investing in sorting the customer service side of the model. It’s not just a story, it’s a fact. I’ve experienced it first hand and it’s just what we need.

 

[Fx1]

Sounds promising.

No way would they grow ebike share of market on this type of model and service.

Wonder if they are considering local service partners

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

Dobby if I told you everything I’d never get to look at the new Spectral ON ?

Plus I haven’t got my bike back yet! AND I did promise to undo the social media grief I gave them, just a little bit. I’m not sworn to secrecy but I did get to hear about things and that some of the rumours are true. It’s a good thing if you are UK based and into your YT bikes! timing is everything and Covid 19 isn’t helping.

But YT are investing in sorting the customer service side of the model. It’s not just a story, it’s a fact. I’ve experienced it first hand and it’s just what we need.

if they sort the customer service out, that would be a massive bonus... personally I would be waiting to start hearing how good it was when put to the test before I spent any cash though... as much as I would love a decoy

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

has a first class honours in customer support and service. You’ll hear more from him and about him and what he’s doing in due course

if its Chris Reilly, ill definitely be getting a YT

 

[Jedipip]

if its Chris Reilly, ill definitely be getting a YT

I can’t argue with that at all!
It’s not, but you have to trust me on this, it’s just as promising, based on the last 24 hours.

 

[Fx1]

Dobby if I told you everything I’d never get to look at the new Spectral ON

Plus I haven’t got my bike back yet! AND I did promise to undo the social media grief I gave them, just a little bit. I’m not sworn to secrecy but I did get to hear about things and that some of the rumours are true. It’s a good thing if you are UK based and into your YT bikes! timing is everything and Covid 19 isn’t helping.

But YT are investing in sorting the customer service side of the model. It’s not just a story, it’s a fact. I’ve experienced it first hand and it’s just what we need.

if they sort the customer service out, that would be a massive bonus... personally I would be waiting to start hearing how good it was when put to the test before I spent any cash though... as much as I would love a decoy

Thing is.

What other bike can you get that is 160mm travel full carbon and comes with the kind of spec on the decoy.. the 2019 bikes are a steal for what you get.

Would I pay an extra grand for some customer service... lol no.. people are paying 2 to 3k more for it though.

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

Would I pay an extra grand for some customer service... lol no.. people are paying 2 to 3k more for it though.

I would, customer service (for me) is way more important when these bikes have problems like they do..

 

[Fx1]

Would I pay an extra grand for some customer service... lol no.. people are paying 2 to 3k more for it though.

I would, customer service (for me) is way more important when these bikes have problems like they do..

You realise that with the exception of specialized brose motors most bikes get no problems. There is a fb page full of owners with not a single fault.

If Madison can replace the motor then there is little to be concerned about.

 

[WildGuy]

....maybe, but I kind of get the impression that 4 months into his new bike not working/being out of the country @Jedipip feels there is a little to be concerned about. Think I'd already decided to avoid mail-order only brands anyway, but definitely one that uses a proprietary battery after reading this. When a new battery is needed in 3 years and their current model is onto revision X of it what's the chance of being able to source the old one. Or is it the idea that the pace of change so fast in emtb that the whole bike is deemed obsolete by then anyway?

 

[Lee Dove]

Lee tell me more. Which Decoy? And when did you get it sorted?

Many questions....! Which shop? I’ll get to the bottom of this somehow ?

~Sorry for the slow reply. It was about 3 months ago and teh shop was Edinburgh Bike Coop as mentioned in the post.

 

[Rostle32]

Firstly, apologies to existing Decoy owners , but reading this just reassures the fact that all the glitz, and fancy blurb bullshit , ANY brand is only as good as the last happy customer! Hope they get there comeuppance, buy loosing sales like Jo fuck ????

 

[Fx1]

Firstly, apologies to existing Decoy owners , but reading this just reassures the fact that all the glitz, and fancy blurb bullshit , ANY brand is only as good as the last happy customer! Hope they get there comeuppance, buy loosing sales like Jo fuck

Sounds like it was resolved.

Given the world economy is on the brink I'm not sure I'd wish anyone to suffer over some customer service issues.

 

[Jedipip]

Sounds like it was resolved.

Given the world economy is on the brink I'm not sure I'd wish anyone to suffer over some customer service issues.

Just waiting on bike being rebuilt and shipped. YT Industries do appear to have done something about the customer service, look at their US operation.

I’ve had three calls this week to keep me up to date on progress, the ridiculous delay and ensuing costs all explained and waived as you would have hoped.

Once the bike is back and all is well I’ll repost.

YT service in the UK is on the cusp of becoming very different.

In the meantime we have other more pressing things to deal with, such as tracking down the muppets that bought all the loo roll and those that queue for an hour to be first in the door to buy up all the bread and milk. Turns out they are living amongst us. Find them, give them hell.

Perhaps all they need is a decent bike ride?

 

[Mac Sinclair]

Tragically bad news for us YT ‘believers’.

My faultless (until this) and superb 6 month old 1000 mile Decoy went to my LBS (Shimano approved) to diagnose an electrical motor issue in December 2020, speedo jumping to 20mph+ motor cutting out, then kicking in when speed dropped. Unrideable on any hills. Shimano UK got involved as LBS couldn’t diagnose from their software (see from about 19m in Rob’s video, this was my first little worry!). Shimano UK (Madison) did some over-the-phone and internet diagnostics with the LBS plugging the motor and software in directly to their computer and said the motor is at fault, send it to them. So we did. New motor supplied, Shimano asked YT for codes to sync battery, motor and bike. YT refused, despite Shimano UK protestations.

That’s correct. Zero Shimano capability to get the Shimano approved YT battery to work with a brand new E8000 motor. YT wanted the whole bike shipping back to Germany. YT emails have repeatedly stated to me that they DO NOT share any codes with third parties. Shimano are deemed a third party by YT!

YT box used by my LBS, YT postage and courier used, everything was sent to YT in January 2020, 1 month off the trails. Then a long silent wait.

March 8th 2020 YT send my LBS an email saying the frame is damaged and they are certain it was during the courier stage.

View attachment 27373

YT state that the frame is not deemed safe to use and it will cost the customer £1200 for a replacement frame.

Numerous emails, zero escalation within YT, total refusal to copy Markus or Stefan in to the issue and a point blank closing down on any questions regarding why it took 7 weeks to inform of the frame issue, nothing regarding the battery/motor issue. No proof of receipt of bike or contact/photos of the frame, box, damage or courier notes.

Deadlock was reached on Thursday this week (11th March 2020). Despite being overly patient and incredibly polite there is nothing, no goodwill (it’s my second YT bike). Nothing resembling customer service or bike electrical serviceability away from YT exists and I am left with a bike that has cost me £5 per mile to ride, I’ve ridden it for 6 months out of 9 and it is now, according to YT, scrap.

I’ve sent a direct message to Markus the CEO, Shimano UK are escalating within Shimano, the LBS is offering a Trek Rail in exchange for the scrap Decoy. This is why I was using the LBS, they need the business, even if it’s just handling diagnosis and tweaking. I did remind YT Service that the entire brand depends on its warranty and customer experience and that social media is no friend to a business model when it fails in customer service. That email resulted in a very strict response simply stating ‘if you don’t want to pay for the new frame we shall pack the bike up and send it back’. I’m not even sure the frame will arrive in one piece! It wouldn’t be sensible to send a customer a defective frame back would it?

Anyone got any ideas,? anyone in a position to ‘have a word’?

Anyone want a 6 month old Decoy Pro in black with a brand new motor and no frame?

I’m going to be a social media troll on any YT Decoy post if this sorry tale ends as it looks like it could.

One photo from YT that really helps me out!

Gutted for you
you may have a trading standards angle as your experience differs from their marketing claims that the Shimano system makes their products supportable
I almost bought one, but bought a levo because of the battery and the BS YT claim that they were going to put out a 700watt battery in 2019 then they didn’t... point being they sold bikes on the false promise one could soon upgrade to a better solution
Now it maybe that you can take them to a small claims court, if they don’t turn up they loose!
There are a number of angles.
As for YT they need to understand they are shredding their brand.