Upgrade Rise or Buy Kenevo SL or buy Transition Relay

[johnson145]

I currently have the 2022 Orbea Rise H30. I'm interested in a slacker and longer travel bike. What's best:

1. On the Rise, upgrade brakes, put airshaft in fork and increase shock length. This is the cheapest option but would void the warranty and put the bike outside of its intended use
2. Sell the Rise and buy a Kenevo SL. The main cons are the price and small battery. This is probably my dream bike though.
3. Sell the Rise and buy a Transition Relay PNW. The main con seems to be the Fazua motor. I've heard they aren't super reliable.
4. Wait a year or two for more long travel SL ebikes to come out. Would it be worth it to upgrade the Rise in the meantime?

 

[Ou812]

I seriously want a KSL but want a frame only, I have enough spare parts to build up 2-3 bikes so don’t want a complete build. Only problem is Spesh doesn’t seem to want to put the frame only on sale, I can get the complete S-Works in my size for £6650 but the frame is still £6000! Makes no sense at all.

 

[Mik3F]

You answered your question already

2. Sell the Rise and buy a Kenevo SL. The main cons are the price and small battery. This is probably my dream bike though.

If its your dream bike, do it and enjoy it, dont worry about the small battery, theres always an extender

 

[Weeksy]

1. forget about the travel, forget about the geo, just ride it more and ride it harder. You're SO far within the bikes limits it's insane. Honestly...
That may be a bit flippant and harsh, but trust me, you'd be fine. I've seen the Rise do fantastic things and i'll see it do more. 30' gap jumps, 10' vert drops, sure it's not techincally designed to be a super enduro, but give the thing credit and just ride it.

 

[Chrysaor]

I just went from a decoy to a Kenevo SL, can't recommend the bike enough it's so light and maneuverable and a true enduro bike. You can even ride it 180/175ish if you want a true long travel bike. It's definitely more effort than a full emtb.
Regarding the battery size, you have to figure out what your usual loops are. You can get around 1100m elevation plus 500m extra with a range extender in trail mode without worrying about consumption during the ride. There is definitely room for optimization by lowering the assistance and running better rolling tires.
I am also surprised how well it pedals even without assistance, I was hesitating with a Levo SL 2 that I didn't test and at that point I can't see why going with less travel with the same battery/motor and a similar weight if built equivalents.

 

[Polar]

4. It's so much innovation and exciting stuff happening in the eMTB world.
In 2-3 years todays ebikes will be "outdated" just like it is in the EV world.

 

[cykelk]

Voted Relay - easy choice IMO. The bike is designed for your terrain (based on Vancouver) and is nicely discounted. Transition HQ is close by if you need help and the Fazua warranty pipeline is well established in North America.

1. forget about the travel, forget about the geo, just ride it more and ride it harder. You're SO far within the bikes limits it's insane. Honestly...
That may be a bit flippant and harsh, but trust me, you'd be fine. I've seen the Rise do fantastic things and i'll see it do more. 30' gap jumps, 10' vert drops, sure it's not techincally designed to be a super enduro, but give the thing credit and just ride it.

Sure talented riders can do impressive things at the edges of a bike's capability, and the Rise is great overall. However, I pretty much destroyed my Occam riding it outside of its design intent in the PNW and I have much more fun now that I'm on a bike that's designed for the terrain.

Waiting a year or two to be on a bike you want to ride every day is not an option IMO.

 

[irie]

I agree with @Weeksy's implied point. When a bike is better than you, as most of our (upgraded) bikes are, then any further upgrades or bike changes will not improve our riding experience.

(The need to add bling is another matter, of course. )

 

[Weeksy]

i do agree with the guy below me though (and Plummet from another thread) in that just because someone else can ride something, doesn't mean it's necessarily the appropriate bike.
But... i've found that if you won't do a 20' gap on bike A, then getting bike B won't mean you will suddenly start hitting it. It can be a small difference in what you'll ride, a bit steeper or a bit longer, but you're not going to go from BPW Blues to Blacks just because of a bike.
For most trails up to an average black, I'm convinced a Rise is perfectly capable... whether the rider is, well that's open to debate

 

[Mik3F]

i do agree with the guy below me though (and Plummet from another thread) in that just because someone else can ride something, doesn't mean it's necessarily the appropriate bike.
But... i've found that if you won't do a 20' gap on bike A, then getting bike B won't mean you will suddenly start hitting it. It can be a small difference in what you'll ride, a bit steeper or a bit longer, but you're not going to go from BPW Blues to Blacks just because of a bike.
For most trails up to an average black, I'm convinced a Rise is perfectly capable... whether the rider is, well that's open to debate

Damn, better cancel my order for a new bike then

 

[Weeksy]

Damn, better cancel my order for a new bike then

I've been there more than once. I bought for example a RM Slayer, 180mm both ends as me and the boy were hitting harder stuff, but then i found 1. I wasn't hitting bigger stuff and 2. it was restrictive on many other types of riding.

Like everything in MTBs it's always a compromise. A DH bike won't XC well, an XC bike won't DH well, an Enduro will do most things well, but it won't turn you into Kilian Bron

 

[Mik3F]

I've been there more than once. I bought for example a RM Slayer, 180mm both ends as me and the boy were hitting harder stuff, but then i found 1. I wasn't hitting bigger stuff and 2. it was restrictive on many other types of riding.

Like everything in MTBs it's always a compromise. A DH bike won't XC well, an XC bike won't DH well, an Enduro will do most things well, but it won't turn you into Kilian Bron

Too right, sadly

That's why I now have an Enduro Bike, at least I can't blame the tools anymore

 

[Ribinrobin]

Id personally get the new rise as its kind of done everything it already did but better. However your saying the kenevo sl is your dream bike, its an awesome bike if you want it get it! dont worry about range you got extenders and microtune to sort that.

 

[doochenozzle]

2023 alloy Rise with a 160 fork and cascade link for me is very capable. I’m tempted for run the slackr headset and bump the fork to 170 (Mezzer).
KSL is a bit gutless no? I find I can ride the logging roads with the full power e-bikes on my rise.

 

[Type1]

99% of members on this forum are riding bikes well within their designed capability. But at the same time 99% of us also ride purely for fun.

Additionally, the technology is always advancing so if you wait for the next big "break through", you'll always be waiting.

So if you can afford it, buy whatever makes you smile the most and gets you out riding the most.

 

[cykelk]

For most trails up to an average black, I'm convinced a Rise is perfectly capable... whether the rider is, well that's open to debate

I do agree with this as a general statement, and my comments take the OP locale into strong consideration. Vancouver area and the general corridor from Seattle up to Pemberton has an abundance of gnarly trails and gnarly weather. The new Rise is probably more up to the task than the 2022 model. Dropper insertion length is a real consideration here. The Kenevo SL would be below both the Relay and the new Rise on my personal option list.

 

[johnson145]

I do agree with this as a general statement, and my comments take the OP locale into strong consideration. Vancouver area and the general corridor from Seattle up to Pemberton has an abundance of gnarly trails and gnarly weather. The new Rise is probably more up to the task than the 2022 model. Dropper insertion length is a real consideration here. The Kenevo SL would be below both the Relay and the new Rise on my personal option list.

Didn't realize the dropper insertion length is so important. Is it that bad on the Kenevo SL? It hasn't been a noticeable problem on my 2022 Rise but then again it could be something that I've just gotten used to and I haven't been riding the steepest stuff on it

 

[cykelk]

Didn't realize the dropper insertion length is so important. Is it that bad on the Kenevo SL? It hasn't been a noticeable problem on my 2022 Rise but then again it could be something that I've just gotten used to and I haven't been riding the steepest stuff on it

It’s actually the sole reason I didn’t buy a KSL before there were other mid-power contenders in the geo category. That said, definitely depends on what you ride and what you’re adapted to. I ended up on a Heckler SL which is also insertion-challenged, and I notice (and manually adjust it at the collar when needed).

 

[Dax]

Didn't realize the dropper insertion length is so important. Is it that bad on the Kenevo SL? It hasn't been a noticeable problem on my 2022 Rise but then again it could be something that I've just gotten used to and I haven't been riding the steepest stuff on it

It seems to be a problem for some people, maybe on smaller frames? I haven’t had any issues with my s5.

Hard to comment because I haven’t ridden a relay yet, but the KSL is freaking brilliant. So fast, so capable, so fun. The bike just disappears as you ride, it’s just you and the trail.

 

[Doomanic]

I thought it would be a problem on my S3 but I don't notice the 20mm shorter drop than my Rail.

 

[Loamranger]

All I here on this forum is “it’s got more power”. Those people are barking up the wrong tree. 35Nm KSL is enough. Range on the other hand is another question.

 

[Dax]

All I here on this forum is “it’s got more power”. Those people are barking up the wrong tree. 35Nm KSL is enough. Range on the other hand is another question.

Riding them back to back, I didn’t feel much difference between the 35nm KSL and the 60nm Fazua.

 

[Loamranger]

Riding them back to back, I didn’t feel much difference between the 35nm KSL and the 60nm Fazua.

Glad someone’s got some sanity.

 

[Doomanic]

I've ridden a KSL1 and then an LSL2 on the same climb, with about 10km of riding between each attempt. The LSL2 was noticeably quicker up the climb but my heart rate actually peaked 6bpm higher at 178...
It's not enough to justify changing though.

 

[Desert_Turtle]

I’ve had all the bikes on the list. Although the Rise has its place, for me, it’s a hard no unless you’re riding XC trails. The Kenevo SL is a good bike but the power and range are both poor. Additionally, if you’re short like me, it’s a hard no because the seat tube is really high. After reading the other posts I think this is the same issue as the insertion depth being too shallow. I’m a shorty so that’s a deal breaker for me. The Relay and Heckler SL allow for the seat to be really low even with a long dropper. Thats one of the best things about my size M Relay. It has a 180mm dropper and I can flat foot with the seat down. I have a Relay PNW currently and if you’re going to ride big chunky DH then there’s no other choice. I just got back from Downieville and I was able to ride the Relay faster than my SWorks Levo & Heckler SL. I have 3 bikes with the Fazua motor and I love it. No issues with any of my ride 60 bikes. Anyway, specifically for fast chunky big DH the Relay PNW might be the best ebike bike that I’ve ever ridden. It’s heavy enough to give you that planted feel but light enough to not beat you up in the chunk. I couldn’t believe how easy it was to let it rip. The only downside the Relay has is that unless it’s steep, chunky, and fast the bike is a little boring. It’s really slack. On a side note, the Relay is also an amazing climber.

 

[Desert_Turtle]

Riding them back to back, I didn’t feel much difference between the 35nm KSL and the 60nm Fazua.

I will have to politely disagree. The ride 60 is a big step up in both range and power. I will agree that there’s not a huge difference in feel from the 35nm and 50nm specialized motors but the Fazua, for sure, is noticeably more powerful.

 

[squeegee]

I have a Rise and a KSL. When it comes to park riding and burley stuff, the KSL is much better. KSL is pretty slow and lethargic on tight singletrack, not really a "do-all" bike IMO. Relay is tempting however the issue I see is weight, will easily be a few pounds heavier than similar build on KSL, if that matters to you. Relay removable battery is a nice feature. Great deals on KSL's for sure. Relay is on sale but not as cheap as you can get a KSL right now. KSL motor is weak, I've done some miles on Fazua and is stronger than KSL, Rise motor is stronger than Fazua. Does motor power matter? No range extender for Fazua. I could go on but this is a personal decision, where you ride most, or what you want to ride...that's the question you need to answer yourself.

 

[Ribinrobin]

I've ridden a KSL1 and then an LSL2 on the same climb, with about 10km of riding between each attempt. The LSL2 was noticeably quicker up the climb but my heart rate actually peaked 6bpm higher at 178...
It's not enough to justify changing though.

We did a mini enduro at bike park wales with some friends and had all the levo's present. Me and my friend was on G3s and our two buddies had SL1 and the SL2.

The guys on the SLs are very fit riders, but the sl1 guy got dropped so hard compared to the SL2. The guy on the sl2 was def putting the work in but he kept up fine with us in 50-60% on MT. The guy on the SL1 was breathing out his...bottom and really struggling to keep up with our mellow esq ride up to the top.

 

[Doomanic]

G3s? Full fat Gen 3 Levo?

Is so I’m not surprised the poor sod on the LSL1 was blowing out of his arse; my Rail makes more power in Eco than my KSL1 makes in turbo…

 

[Ribinrobin]

G3s? Full fat Gen 3 Levo?

Is so I’m not surprised the poor sod on the LSL1 was blowing out of his arse; my Rail makes more power in Eco than my KSL1 makes in turbo…

yes G3 levo, trying be cool calling it a G3
Take our levos out of the picture and the main point was how the sl2 had no trouble and the sl1 struggled.