Official battery guidance?

[CJaMTB]

Hi all, I have owned multiple ebikes, purchasing my first back in 2010 (it was a real piece of crap compared to what we ride today!). However, I just joined this forum and am confused over some of the threads I've read in the last couple of days.

I have always fully charged my batteries after use, even if I've just been pootling up to the shops and back, as this is what guidance I have read in other manufacturers guidance. Reading the owners manual from my Kenevo, Spesh recommends regularly (no definition) charging your battery to at least 75%, then if you are not using it for extended periods (again no definition) you should charge every 3 months to a minimum of 4 bars.

With my own charging regime, my 700wh battery has done 35 full charge cycles and is showing 100% health in the MC app.

Having read several differing opinions of how a battery should be cared for, does anyone have any official guidance from Spesh, which differs wildly from the above?

Cheers,

Chris

 

[salko]

What is official from Spesh you have it in the manual. For other details about how to take care of the battery you already have several very good threads here, just check last pages of Specialized threads ...

 

[Jackware]

Have a read here;

Battery storage: - EMTB Forums

 

[CJaMTB]

Cheers chaps, much appreciated ?

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

The Li batteries we use all have similar characteristics: the guidance is easy to find if you seach online. Trying to brief:

These batteries are happiest at 3.7 volts - usually indicated to be at 60% charge level
They Dont like being fully charged or below 55%

Best if they spend as much of their lives at 60 to 65% as possible
Dont charge if you dont have to. If you are at 80 percent and only think you need 20 to 30% then
go ride WO charging. When you get back if you are 50-55 or below then charge for a bit to be 60 to 80 percent - 60 to 65 being ideal.

If you dont need a full charge the next ride only charge to 80 or 90 percent less is better. Think of a balloon filled to capacity.

Fully charge only when really needed or about every 5th charge cycle to let the BMS balance the cells

Come winter if u park your bike, charge to about 65 % and store in a cool dry place.
A refrigerator is great if you have room, DO NOT FREEZE

If your mindful they can last a really long time. I have a hand held marine radio that still has (or had last time I looked early fall) 80 percent of original capacity and will be 12 yrs old this summer. Used once or 2 a week during paddling season

 

[MrBrownstone]

Charge yer bike, ride yer bike. Rinse/repeat. I charge mine to full EVERY DAY and there are very few (2-3 per month) days that I don’t ride. My battery holds a charge Now as well as It did when new 6 months ago.

Enjoy!!!

 

[Mcharza]

MrBrownstone However, if the model you are telling is good for you, don’t share the wrong information as if it were the truth. Thanks

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

MrBrownstone However, if the model you are telling is good for you, don’t share the wrong information as if it were the truth. Thanks

For him it might be ok actually, if he's putting that many miles on his bike so quickly, the bike will probably fail first ?

 

[salko]

If he rides almost every day and consume most or at least 40-50% of the battery on every ride, then his method totally makes sense ...

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

If he rides almost every day and consume most or at least 40-50% of the battery on every ride, then his method totally makes sense ...

Still, would be better to only charge to 90 percent,. Not going to 100 takes much of the stress off. Could almost triple the number of cycles

 

[MrBrownstone]

Still, would be better to only charge to 90 percent,. Not going to 100 takes much of the stress off. Could almost triple the number of cycles

We shall see. For riders that don’t ride daily or only a few times a week, It could be even less of a concern. How long are riders even keeping their bikes before succumbing to the next battery/motor tech advancements????‍

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

To some extent I guess your right - if your only concerned about yourself. If your someone that doesn't like to throw things away prematurely, or cares about consumption in general, then being mindful is worth the minimal effort and benefits are far reaching

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

There's no we shall see about it. The chemistry that makes made the batteries is predictable science. Even if your a flat earther...

 

[OldGoatMTB]

We shall see. For riders that don’t ride daily or only a few times a week, It could be even less of a concern. How long are riders even keeping their bikes before succumbing to the next battery/motor tech advancements????‍

As a broke cheapskate I always hope to ride it for the rest of my life, but realistically I expect at least five years out of the current bike.

 

[aarfeldt]

Would be nice if MC had a ChargeTarget setting...

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

I haven't ridden the levo enough to understand the battery that well yet. I really don't like that you can't drop it out without laying the bike down or turning it over. The enclosed tube is nice but it creates other issues.

Anyway, the charger puts 4 amps an hour into the battery for most of the charge cycle. Looking at the battery charge level when you start, and charging for a set period of time and noting the new charge level will give you enough information in a few cycles to understand how many amps it takes to bring the battery to a desired charge level.
Note that The final 5 to 10 percent to reach 100 happens at slower charge rates as the charger throttles the amps\hr as the battery gets near full.

 

[Mikerb]

The advice I took came from generic research rather than the recommendations by various bike brands. Keep in mind that one the main issues ebike brands have been keen to address is range anxiety rather than battery longevity. On the positive side the batteries and chargers most leading brands supply have built in battery management systems to help ensure safety and battery protection. The generic research shows that most damage is done to lithium cells by fully discharging them and/or allowing the cells to remain in a fully discharged state. Some damage, albeit less, occurs when cells are fully charged largely due to heat. The BMS minimises this damage by reducing the charge level in the final stages of charging when it is equalising the voltage of each cell. The research proved that the longevity of a lithium battery is best if it is primarilly used in the charge levels between 30% and 60 to 70% and if the battery was allowed to "settle" for about 6 hours after charging before use. Hence the guidance from that research was to normally charge to c 70% unless you need the full charge and to charge to 100% occasionally to balance the cells. At the other end of the scale, store the battery at about 30% when not in use....recharging to that level occasionally. Finally, if possible allow the battery to settle for a few hours after charging before use.

 

[OldGoatMTB]

I only ran my Shimano battery down to zero once, but I suspect there was still some charge on the battery that the system wasn't telling me about!

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

30 is too low. Around 60% - or 3.8 volts is the target for least stress on the electrolyte barrier. This is the component that weakens over time from use and mishandling

 

[Mikerb]

I just quotedthe tabulated research results performed over an extensive period of time and with several different battery brands....it was not their opinion but the results of the experiment.

 

[MrBrownstone]

I only ran my Shimano battery down to zero once, but I suspect there was still some charge on the battery that the system wasn't telling me about!

Oh no YOU RUINED IT!!! ?

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

I just quotedthe tabulated research results performed over an extensive period of time and with several different battery brands....it was not their opinion but the results of the experiment.

Can you post a link? Its a very different recommendation than I have seen anywhere

 

[I want my 2 Dollars!]

Take a look at this:
How to Prolong Lithium-based Batteries - Battery University


In particular this for max life: Note that 3.7v is usually around 60% charge state because the cycle does not go to 0V. 3.3v is about the usual lower limit which is why the capacity is noted as 30% and less at 3.7v - its up to the battery maker to assign a charge % to a particular voltage.

What I think is important to note is that a charge cycle is a full trip from whatever the top voltage is to 0% - around 3.3 volts and back to max. Will any of us really use 1000 full cycles on our bikes? Maybe some but thats a lot of days riding if your season is only 6 or 8 months long. However, all this applies to phone batteries and all our other gadgets that are powered by Li polymer cells too.

 

[MattyB]

We shall see. For riders that don’t ride daily or only a few times a week, It could be even less of a concern. How long are riders even keeping their bikes before succumbing to the next battery/motor tech advancements????‍

The less often you ride, the worse it is to leave the pack at elevated SOC. The greater the time that is spent at or near full charge the greater the anode degradation which causes loss of capacity and reduced cycle life.

 

[kevinlongisland]

For me, the most important thing to note is that your batteries capacity is reduced much quicker if you don’t care for it. I prefer my battery has 96% of its capacity in a year compared to 80% if I charge it and leave it at 100% charge all the time. *

But each rider should decide for themselves what’s important; spending the time to care for their equipment or not worrying about it.

*Real world percentages will be slightly different, but this is the general trend for all lithium based battery tech.

 

[CJaMTB]

For me, the most important thing to note is that your batteries capacity is reduced much quicker if you don’t care for it. I prefer my battery has 96% of its capacity in a year compared to 80% if I charge it and leave it at 100% charge all the time. *

But each rider should decide for themselves what’s important; spending the time to care for their equipment or not worrying about it.

*Real world percentages will be slightly different, but this is the general trend for all lithium based battery tech.

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I use my battery more than just once per year...

 

[MrBrownstone]

If he rides almost every day and consume most or at least 40-50% of the battery on every ride, then his method totally makes sense ...

Yeah I never mentioned that I leave my battery fully charged when not in use because it’s never not in use except for maybe a day here and there, meaning every couple weeks or so. After yesterday’s ride using 3 out of 5 bars I fully charged it thinking that I might not be riding until tomorrow as today was calling for heavy rain and I’d ridden for two weeks straight so figured a rest day would be good. Well it’s a good thing I fully charged it yesterday because when I woke up early this morning it was clear and sun was coming out and my bike was FULLY ready to go so off I went. When I ride I never know how long I might be out so not charging to 100% would be very limiting. There is no off season for me and I ride my emtb down to zero degrees F. My bike is kept inside when not being ridden where it’s charged all winter. Use your equipment, don’t be a slave to it.