Another 'victim'.
EMTB manufacturers are price gouging.
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LeftItLancs
Member
Ooh, another conspiracy theorist!
Do you ever discuss these issues like a grown up, or do you just attack the person?
Another one who slumbers around this site, dictating what can be discussed or not, as if they own the place.
What do you want to discuss?
Do you mean the margin between retail price and the cost of manufacture? Gotta pay for the supply chain, distributiors, reps, bike shop mechanic, bike shop sales person, warranty claims, and sponsored riders. 40-50% markup in retail is quite common, business costs add up fast.
LeftItLancs
Member
What would I discuss with a grown man who hides behind a computer screen, insulting people online.
LeftItLancs
Member
Yes, everyone who believes that you are a sausage, an online tough guy whose go to stock insult is "another victim", clearly has a "thin skin", right?
Final product price is essentially determined by supply and value chain economics.
johnnystorm
Active member
Sounds identical to be honest. There are huge discounts across the board.
I think the problem is that some feel that a bike sold with 50% off is still making the retailer and manufacturer fat profits when the reality is they are minimising losses by trying to clear the decks of depreciating assets.
I'm still struggling with this concept that a full power eMTB is some kind of human right and not just a plaything. I consider myself very fortunate I can afford one but it's not a matter of life and death.
At this point, you just look like a Troll. You started this thread with a single sentence and refuse to back it up in any way shape or form.
None of the bike brands have a monopoly they are all competing for the same pie. Same goes for motor and battery manufacturers to a certain extent. If you think you can make bikes at half the price then get to it.
Can I say "put up or shut up" without getting told off? If so, please consider it said.
steve_sordy
Wedding Crasher
If I thought that my emtb supplier was "price gouging", I have a simple action to take: buy or not.
The fact is that a perfect market exists: many buyers and many sellers. The price goes up and down in line with the stock available to sell vs the demand. We have seen this before during and after the pandemic.
During the pandemic I sold my Focus Jam 2 9.6 for an unbelievably high price. All I had to do then was to buy another. After weeks of internet cruising (and many false leads), I found the bike of my dreams (Merida e-160 9000). It was the last one of its size that was for sale in the UK. Yet I paid £800 below rrp, plus some other benefits! Two years later, because of the same pandemic, that exact same spec brand-new bike is now up for sale £2500 cheaper! That has damaged the second-hand sale value of my bike, but I am not the least bit unhappy. I suspect that at the time, my supplier may have thought that I was the one doing the gouging!
You may not like capitalism, and it really is awful, until compared with all the other economic systems.
The fact is that a perfect market exists: many buyers and many sellers. The price goes up and down in line with the stock available to sell vs the demand. We have seen this before during and after the pandemic.
During the pandemic I sold my Focus Jam 2 9.6 for an unbelievably high price. All I had to do then was to buy another. After weeks of internet cruising (and many false leads), I found the bike of my dreams (Merida e-160 9000). It was the last one of its size that was for sale in the UK. Yet I paid £800 below rrp, plus some other benefits! Two years later, because of the same pandemic, that exact same spec brand-new bike is now up for sale £2500 cheaper! That has damaged the second-hand sale value of my bike, but I am not the least bit unhappy. I suspect that at the time, my supplier may have thought that I was the one doing the gouging!
You may not like capitalism, and it really is awful, until compared with all the other economic systems.
2WheelsNot4
E*POWAH Master
I could do so much better, but damn my fillet steak habit
The guys that make the bikes, parts and the guys that sell the parts, bikes are all in business. When you own a business the idea is to make money.
The guys that buy the bikes want them. They work and so spend there money how they please.
No one puts a gun to there head and makes them buy. It’s there choice.
Life is expensive but we are only here once so enjoy it. Buy your bike or stop moaning.
The guys that buy the bikes want them. They work and so spend there money how they please.
No one puts a gun to there head and makes them buy. It’s there choice.
Life is expensive but we are only here once so enjoy it. Buy your bike or stop moaning.
The real high end ones treat the civets badly according to
I got a great deal on a levo from Tredz one month ago then this week they add another 10% off I don't feel gouged but I do wonder if people were really buying at the rrp.
I paid RRP, £4900, back in March ‘22 for my stereo sl. You can pick up a TM for £3700 at the moment. I don’t feel gouged either. Mildly frustrated that it decreases the 2nd value of my bike but I’ve had 2 years use already. Back then I felt lucky just to find the bike I wanted in stock and not having to wait months for a factory order.
Same here. In January 2022 for wife and me found two Trek Rail 5's with 500w batteries for £4,600 each when they were in short supply. Recently on sale for £3,000 (35% off) because the market is overstocked. It's how markets work.
Now out of warranty but had two great years use out of the bikes, no complaints. Have nice upgrades on the bikes and the motors are still current. Have had absolutely no issues with the bikes, can't see any reason to change them tbh.
Now out of warranty but had two great years use out of the bikes, no complaints. Have nice upgrades on the bikes and the motors are still current. Have had absolutely no issues with the bikes, can't see any reason to change them tbh.
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I know it's a free market and supply/demand plus competition controls prices but I still can't fathom why a motorbike is so much cheaper. Look at the Tony Bou replica trials bike - alloy frame, monoshock rear, telescopic forks, hydraulic disk brakes - all the same tech but a highly sophisticated IC engine/gearbox compared to a simple electric motor £8,800 vs top spec eMTB £14k - Honda must have their supply chains nailed down or something.
johnnystorm
Active member
Honda annual turnover $132 billion
Specialized annual turnover $0.5 billion
Motorbike frame sizes = 1
Levo frame sizes S1-S6
First Honda motorbike 1949
First Specialized eBike 2009
That the two objects have wheels and a motor is a red herring. The two use cases place a higher burden on the ebike manufacturer's design process.
Strong? Light? Cheap? Choose 2.
Motorbikes don't have to be (as) light, and that makes a massive, massive difference to costs. Everything on a good mountain bike is at or past spec in terms of weight / strength. You can buy a full suspension bike from Halfords for peanuts but it'll be horrible as it will weigh a ton and the suspension will be awful. Also an S-Works Levo is equivalent to a £50k+ motorcycle, not a run of the mill bike.
Motorbikes don't have to be (as) light, and that makes a massive, massive difference to costs. Everything on a good mountain bike is at or past spec in terms of weight / strength. You can buy a full suspension bike from Halfords for peanuts but it'll be horrible as it will weigh a ton and the suspension will be awful. Also an S-Works Levo is equivalent to a £50k+ motorcycle, not a run of the mill bike.
Tubby G
❤️🔥 Hot Stuff ❤️🔥
Paying over £8k for an electric mountain bike is outrageous
You could buy a pen for that much cash!
You could buy a pen for that much cash!
I wonder how many pens like that get sold.
I wonder how many Tony Bou replicas are sold annually - I bet it's less than 1000 and that certainly isn't a run of the mill motorbike, compared to how many s-works Levos . .
Alloy frames have been around for 70yrs, disk brakes 50yrs - all the dev work has been done!
Too many older guys with disposable income buying ebikes maybe?
The motorbike frame is robot welded together in one size in 10 minutes from a dozen or so parts made from relatively cheap materials.
The typical carbon fibre emtb frame is made in 4+ sizes, laid up by hand in custom tooling from hundreds of panels from relatively expensive CF prepreg.
The typical carbon fibre emtb frame is made in 4+ sizes, laid up by hand in custom tooling from hundreds of panels from relatively expensive CF prepreg.
Tubby G
❤️🔥 Hot Stuff ❤️🔥
When I first considered buying an emtb I was comparing prices to motorbikes as I was riding motorbikes beforehand, and was also astonished at the prices of emtb’s. Then the cost of maintaining emtb’s v motorbikes just seemed outrageous too. However, when I account for the fun factor, the smiles emtb’s provide are priceless, so now it all seems reasonable.
I’m lucky that I can purchase bikes on a Cycle to Work scheme, so they’re almost half their retail price, there’s no way I’d spend £8k+ on an emtb, not a chance
Same - my eMTB mates all said don't worry about the cost because you forget as soon as you ride it out the door . . and they were right!
And strangely now I have one I have no desire at all to ride a motorbike.
Tubby G
❤️🔥 Hot Stuff ❤️🔥
C'mon, you realize you can still do both...LOL! Man, I love off road on two wheels in the dirt. I'll take it any way I can get it. And before some know-it-all...LOL!...chimes in about some rich 5%, disposable income malarkey, I'm retired on a fixed income, and it ain't no 6-digit retirement...a fraction of that. I still work part time to pay for my sins...ah, I mean habits. BTW, that's a 2009 Honda XR650, not a $14,000 KTM.
Apparently Bike manufacturers are not doing as well as some people would have you think. THIS guy apparently has lots of "connections" to explain it all and he seems to think that there are a "bunch of corrections" coming in 2024 which makes one think that no one is making that much money in the bike industry. I have friends in the industry (one co owns a pretty big bike store and the other owns a bike company), Neither of them are rich men.
Whitby Chris
Active member
EMTB prices have dropped significantly over the past year, I don't know if we could say the bubble has burst but with so much choice now and so many good brands and more been manufactured and with all the brand competition I think its a good thing they have come down in price, I think its more now of which manufacturers brand some one wants as to what spec as most are specked up so well now. you say about how much they charge for a bike, but you are not thinking about the supply chain of all the parts getting to one point, the people who are putting these bikes together, pricing added on incase of warranty claims as all business's do this not just bike manufacturers, what about the bike shops independents and your small local shops trying hard to stay in business, or the large chains. everybody needs to take wage and pay their own bills. business rates, electricity.its never ending, again some one said earlier, if you cant afford but a cheaper bike or dont buy at all. it may sound cruel but its right.
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