Crank arm change

[Domj1234]

Hello all. I'm new to the forum following me getting a 2019 E-Sommet VR, which I absolutely love. I'm getting a lot of pedal strikes and since seeing Rob Hancills excellent you tube video where he tests some 152mm Mirandas I'm looking to make the change. The existing arms look like 170mm but I haven't removed them to accurately measure. Anyone know if they are 170's? Also, does anyone know which Crank interface is used.... Is it simply a steps 8000 interface or does the system use a more common standard. I'm struggling to find stock anywhere but fingers crossed. Thanks in advance. Dom

 

[nicklej]

The 2019 comes standard with 165mm cranks - I've got a Levo but will shorten the cranks because I'm in the same boat as you (it's been a long time coming!).

Can't help with the other question though! It uses the same motor as Focus and Canyon if that is any help at all?

 

[R120]

Your only current option for shorter cranks are the Miranda Delta SH:

Delta SH - Miranda Bike Parts

They can be bought in the UK Direct from the importers, Dillglove. Email Bryan

[email protected]

There are rumours of other brands bringing shorter cranks to the market, but nothing yet. I would say 165mm are quite short anyway, I ride 160mm, part of riding the Vitus is adjusting how you ride to take into account the terrain you can climb

 

[nicklej]

Your only current option for shorter cranks are the Miranda Delta SH:

Delta SH - Miranda Bike Parts

They can be bought in the UK Direct from the importers, Dillgrove. Email Bryan

[email protected]

There are rumours of other brands bringing shorter cranks to the market, but nothing yet. I would say 165mm are quite short anyway, I ride 160mm, part of riding the Vitus is adjusting how you ride to take into account the terrain you can climb

Hi R120, just double check the email address. I'm not sure if it should be "@dillglove" if his name is "Dillgrove". Just noticed that so worth updating in case OP wants to email in

 

[R120]

No I got the company name wrong, Its Dillglove.

 

[Domj1234]

The 2019 comes standard with 165mm cranks - I've got a Levo but will shorten the cranks because I'm in the same boat as you (it's been a long time coming!).

Can't help with the other question though! It uses the same motor as Focus and Canyon if that is any help at all?

Shorter than I thought at 165 ??cheers

 

[nicklej]

Shorter than I thought at 165 ??cheers

No problemo pal

 

[Domj1234]

Your only current option for shorter cranks are the Miranda Delta SH:

Delta SH - Miranda Bike Parts

They can be bought in the UK Direct from the importers, Dillglove. Email Bryan

[email protected]

There are rumours of other brands bringing shorter cranks to the market, but nothing yet. I would say 165mm are quite short anyway, I ride 160mm, part of riding the Vitus is adjusting how you ride to take into account the terrain you can climb

I did a loop of my local trail today @cannock chase and had no pedal strikes. It was a slower ride than yesterday, maybe its that, maybe I'm more mindful of strikes. Probably a combination. How do you find the 160's?. I'm 6 foot so wouldn't want to go shorter than that. Thanks for the info ??

 

[R120]

I have been riding them for about 6 months now, and have had the bike for roughly 9 months. I don't really notice them, not much of an answer but whilst I have had the odd pedal strike over that time, riding wise I don't really think about it. The E-Sommett has (I think) the lowest BB of any EMTB out there, so irrespective of crank size you have to adjust your riding style to get used to it.

From my experience its when doing short sharp technical climbs up stuff you wouldn't attempt on a normal MTB that you get the pedal strike issue, or on technical climbs that you can do faster due to the motor, so spinning the cranks faster meaning you hit stuff you might not normally.

I did notice on my Hardtail EMTB that I have just built back up, which had the OEM Shimano 175mm crank arms, that I was getting a lot more pedal strikes, and when riding it this shook my confidence as I had got used to not having them on the Sommett, so have put the 160mm on that too.

You spin at a higher cadence with the shorter cranks, but its not really noticeable, but is suspect would be if going shorter than 160mm crank arm.

I am same height as you - one knock on of shorter cranks is you have to raise the saddle height as you sit a bit higher due to the shorter crank.

 

[Domj1234]

I have been riding them for about 6 months now, and have had the bike for roughly 9 months. I don't really notice them, not much of an answer but whilst I have had the odd pedal strike over that time, riding wise I don't really think about it. The E-Sommett has (I think) the lowest BB of any EMTB out there, so irrespective of crank size you have to adjust your riding style to get used to it.

From my experience its when doing short sharp technical climbs up stuff you wouldn't attempt on a normal MTB that you get the pedal strike issue, or on technical climbs that you can do faster due to the motor, so spinning the cranks faster meaning you hit stuff you might not normally.

I did notice on my Hardtail EMTB that I have just built back up, which had the OEM Shimano 175mm crank arms, that I was getting a lot more pedal strikes, and when riding it this shook my confidence as I had got used to not having them on the Sommett, so have put the 160mm on that too.

You spin at a higher cadence with the shorter cranks, but its not really noticeable, but is suspect would be if going shorter than 160mm crank arm.

I am same height as you - one knock on of shorter cranks is you have to raise the saddle height as you sit a bit higher due to the shorter crank.

OK then, I'm thinking 160mm Crank arms and an adjustment in riding style will be the best approach. I'll get them ordered tomorrow. Can't thank you enough for the information. Top man ?. I'll post some feedback once I've tested in case it might help others. Cheers ??

 

[Domj1234]

Following the advice from the guys above I ordered the Delta 160mm from dill glove. Bryan was fantastic and the pedals arrived the day after. I've ridden a lot since and wanted to give some feedback. I've ridden mainly at Cannock chase both on the main monkey trail and the hidden off piste trails which are now way beyond what I expected. I've also ridden Llandegla a couple of times. The results were a combination of pedal arm change and being more mindful of my riding style. In a nutshell I've been blown away. On the monkey trail and Llandegla I'm not experiencing any strikes, which is a big improvement on what I was experiencing prior to the pedal arm change and change in style. The off piste riding was more technical and by its nature was more likely to get strikes. I only got 2 last time I rode last Saturday but again that was early on and a quick change of style meant the rest was flowing and strike free. There was no Noticeable change in cadence or battery consumption. Overall, in my opinion a great mod with no downside. Thanks again to you guys who provided the information. If you can, get over Cannock chase and ride the hidden trails. Yes they are hidden but good people always find a way ?. Happy riding

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Here is a curve ball for you all to ponder.....

When I got my first ebike last year I was able to ride quite a lot of the terrain on my ‘local’ forest trails at a much faster pace than I could ever do riding my ‘non assisted’ bike. I can only presume most of you have experienced the same? I also found riding the ebike up hill at a fast pace (In Turbo mode) on very steep, tight, lumpy single track, off camber corners, tight switchbacks and rock gardens a really enjoyable new challenge which for me personally required a new/adapted skill set due to the much increased speed of the accent.

The problem I had with this new found challenge was multiple pedal strikes due to the need of having to pedal continuously though the above described terrain in Turbo mode. The usual process of looking well ahead and timing pedal strokes or half pedal strokes did not work that well and I ended up in a few situations where the speed (in Turbo mode) and steepness of the terrain caught me out and caused me to either multiple pedal strike, topple over or both......

Initially I changed from 170mm to 150mm cranks and although it did not completely resolve the problem it was a huge improvement over what I was experiencing. Going to 150mm cranks required me to adjust my dropper post height up by 15 to 20mm but apart from that for me personally, it was a very easy transition.

As I am a compulsive tinkerer and love trying new things out..... after 6 months of using the 150s I decided to go shorter and put on some Kris Holm 138mm cranks. For me personally and the terrain I ride (in Turbo mode), a 138mm to 140mm length crank is spot on for me. Again a slight adjustment (20mm) of the dropper height and again a very easy transition.

Please note: My current average cadence is around 70-80 my maximum is between 130-145. These figures are courtesy of Blevo. I have not noticed any reduction in speed and I am continually beating my Personal Best times set on Strava when I had the 170mm cranks on. Your terrain may not require shorter cranks. However for me personally, my terrain requires shorter cranks.

It may be a OMG ‘No Way’ ‘You need to learn how to ride mate’ moment for you.....but hey, if you have never tried it, how can you possibly comment? In fact, I made a very similar comment when I saw my very first ebike 4 years ago and I now have 2 ebikes and I am in the process of selling all my non assisted bike frames (Carbon Nomad mk3, SWorks Enduro and SWork Epic) as I do not ride them anymore

 

[Gary]

Do whatever you want. it's your bike and your local terrain. To be fair Kiwi after 6 months in turbo on short cranks your visual/spacial/muscle memory/physical motor control/collision awareness/pedal positioning skills will now all be massively reduced so you're now in a far worse position than you were before you ever got an Ebike mtb foot positioning/timing wise.
but STRAVA PRs are important Especially on local trails regular length cranks can't be pedalled through.

I don't even have an Ebike just now but am absolutely loving riding my other bikes again and this week I've actually been riding them more, longer, further and in different places than I was riding the E-Sommet. Hopefully i'll regain some of the cardio/pedalling fitness lost and lose some of the weight gained from riding the Ebike and neglecting them.

TBF if you've bought a bike with as nicely low a BB as the Vitus and you really need shorter than 160mm cranks you've probably bought the wrong bike. By sticking 25mm shorter (32mm shorter than mine) cranks on it you're actually reducing it's cornering ability (grip, control and stability). The fact you mention Blevo only increaes this as Levos/Kenevos don't even have particularly low BB heights in the first place.

Oh... Before you assume I've no experience of short cranks. I've been riding 165s for over 15 years on my DH, roadbike and mtbs and have ridden litterally thousands of bikes over the years. (work and play) Most of the bikes with shorter than 165mm cranks were kids or womens bikes though. My daughters race BMX has 145mm cranks and her 24" wheel mtb has 155s I tend to ride them both pretty much every time she rides with me. (I'm just like that).
I'll be riding her 24" wheel mtb again on Sunday as i'm teaching her to jump at a local spot.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Very interesting comments Gary

Do whatever you want. it's your bike and your local terrain.
Exactly, and I agree with you

To be fair Kiwi after 6 months in turbo on short cranks your visual/spacial/muscle memory/physical motor control/collision awareness/pedal positioning skills will now all be massively reduced so you're now in a far worse position than you were before you ever got an Ebike mtb foot positioning/timing wise.
I only shift into Turbo when I ride the specific section of the trail I detailed in my above post which makes up about 10-15% of my actual ride as the trail is so steep that it is ‘almost’ unridable for me in my lowest gear and on anything lower than Turbo.

I still have to time some of my pedal strokes and do this quite comfortably but nowhere near as much as I used to so I am not sure why you think I am in a far worse position than I was before as I can climb up these particular steep technical trails as detailed in my above post now with ease with my short cranks which I could not do before with my longer cranks on.

but STRAVA PRs are important
Wow, this is an interesting statement and it finishes with a rolled eyes emoji?
When did I say Strava PRs were important? You have obviously not read my other posts mentioning Strava where I state Strava is not accurate and should really be used as a guide only. If you want accurate times you need to use point to point equipment as used in racing. The statement in my above post was using Strava as Guide to say I could see that since putting my shorter cranks on my PB times were continually getting better.

Especially on local trails regular length cranks can't be pedalled through.
Another interesting comment this time with a Laugh out Loud emoji.
I never said you could not pedal through the trails I detailed in my above post with regular length cranks. I said when I did I experienced multiple pedal strikes. Since changing to shorter cranks this experience has dramatically reduced. Like I said in my above post. ‘Your terrain may not require shorter cranks’ However for me personally, 10-15% of my terrain requires shorter cranks. Also, the handling of my ebike on the other 85-90% of the terrain I ride does not appear to have been affected. If it did, the short cranks would have been removed fairly quickly.

I don't even have an Ebike just now but am absolutely loving riding my other bikes again and this week I've actually been riding them more, longer, further and in different places than I was riding the E-Sommet.
Good for you Gary I am happy for you, but this is of no interest to me as I am more than happy in my new ebike world and can’t see that changing anytime soon. The reason for this is I am very time constrained and most of the time I have a 1-2 hour window to play with. Do I use my ebike which enables me to ride from home, faster, further and session my uphill and downhill sections a number of times or do I use my acoustic, have to drive to my trail head and not do even half of the above in my 1-2 hour time period? For me it’s a no brainier which is why I am selling my acoustic bikes and will probably buy either a third ebike or a few 700wh batteries

Hopefully i'll regain some of the cardio/pedalling fitness lost and lose some of the weight gained from riding the Ebike and neglecting them.
Since purchasing my ebike my fitness has definitely improved I have lost 4 kgs and now weigh 70kgs. This is probably down to me covering 3500km last year compared to 1200 the year before.

TBF if you've bought a bike with as nicely low a BB as the Vitus and you really need shorter than 160mm cranks you've probably bought the wrong bike. By sticking 25mm shorter (32mm shorter than mine) cranks on it you're actually reducing it's cornering ability (grip, control and stability). The fact you mention Blevo only increaes this as Levos/Kenevos don't even have particularly low BB heights in the first place.
If my cornering ability has been reduced I certainly haven’t noticed it. I haven’t had an increase in scary moments where I have felt out of control or the bike has spat me off without warning and like I said my times are continually improving so the way I see it having shorter cranks has done nothing but improve my skill set especially on the very steep climbs


Oh... Before you assume I've no experience of short cranks. I've been riding 165s for over 15 years on my DH, roadbike and mtbs and have ridden litterally thousands of bikes over the years. (work and play) Most of the bikes with shorter than 165mm cranks were kids or womens bikes though. My daughters race BMX has 145mm cranks and her 24" wheel mtb has 155s I tend to ride them both pretty much every time she rides with me. (I'm just like that).
I'll be riding her 24" wheel mtb again on Sunday as i'm teaching her to jump at a local spot.
I try my best not assume anything Gary. I have ridden shorter cranks on DH bikes and other acoustic bikes as well. However, riding with shorter 138mm to 140mm cranks on my ebike in the terrain described in my above post works for me. Why would I go back to multiple pedal strikes? I do not need to learn how to time my pedal strokes, I already know how to do that. I have been doing that quite successfully on my acoustic bikes for the past 20 years. Last year I changed to an ebike which changed the terrain I now like to ride. I changed a component on my bike that improves my ride experience. What works for me obviously doesn’t work for you or others. Thanks for the advice but I am happy where I am thanks.

 

[Dee Scee]

end of thred