Charging Shimano battery more rapidly

[dirt huffer]

I have a Cycle Satiator charger and would like to splice off the Shimano charger’s connector, and splice it into the my Cycle Satiator so that I can adjust the amp rate the battery charges at. The normal charge rate doesn’t bother me, but I plan on doing some road trips this summer and would like the ability to fast-charge when I need to quick top things off on the road.

Does anyone know if this will brick the battery, if the BMS senses a higher amp rate? Does anyone have a bypass worked out? This is a BT-E8010 battery if that matters.

 

[chasmyfld]

I have a Cycle Satiator charger and would like to splice off the Shimano charger’s connector, and splice it into the my Cycle Satiator so that I can adjust the amp rate the battery charges at. The normal charge rate doesn’t bother me, but I plan on doing some road trips this summer and would like the ability to fast-charge when I need to quick top things off on the road.

Does anyone know if this will brick the battery, if the BMS senses a higher amp rate? Does anyone have a bypass worked out? This is a BT-E8010 battery if that matters.

I would like to do the same thing with my Cycle Satiator. Did you find anything out about your question?

 

[jimbob]

My thoughts (please note that I dont 'know' any of this for definite, I'm basing it on my expectations of the design and knowledge of other systems).

Having had a quick look at the charger, the output current seems low relative to the battery capacity, so wouldn't expect any damage to the cells themselves from the increased current. So, as you say, it should just be down to the ability of the BMS to handle that increase in current / decrease in charge time.

From what I can see, the battery connections are very basic. There are simply 2 terminals which connect to the battery pack for charge and discharge. I would therefore expect the BMS to be able to do cell balancing agnostic of the charger type. As the OEM chargers are a very low current output, I would expect this to be a slow process, and so cell balancing may not be properly acheived with a faster charge rate, but I would not expect this to be an issue if only fast charging occasionaly. It can often take a while for cells to go out of ballance anyway (number of charge cycles) and so risk could me reduced by leaving the battey to float charge prior to using the fast charger.

I would not expect there to be a method to measure charge / discharge rate (I dont see what benefit it would bring, and would decrease efficiency given the same connectors for charge and discharge) and so would not expect the BMS to know you were using the higher charge rate.

In summary, I wouldnt expect it to be an issue for occasional use, but dont know for sure!

 

[steve_sordy]

In the wider interests of the emtb community, I think that you should do it and let us know how you get on.

 

[wepn]

I have Cycle Satiators though I'm not familiar with the battery. What plugs & connectors do you have? You shouldn't
need to splice anything unless I'm missing something.

+ of course I realise now why you need to splice but instead of splicing it may be better to make up a small converter lead - XLR to whatever plug you need - that's probably easier and you still use it with other connectors if you ever need to.

It's highly advisable to use Grintech's Charge Simulator to create the Profile and transfer it to the charger but maybe you've already done that.

When you say Fast charge, how fast? Do you still have warranty remaining that you don't mind zapping with a bunch of Amps?

Cycle Satiator Lithium Battery Charge Simulator

 

[Timochka69]

I think Shimano batteries may have self destruct circuit, that kills the BMS if there is no (or not enough) voltage (or maybe if there is too much voltage too). I'd be very careful messing with the original batteries. I'd go with adapter cable route.

 

[steve_sordy]

Is it just me or is most of this just techno-babble?

 

[jimbob]

I've just had a better look at the charger, and I was wrong that there are no control lines. There are three going into the bike charging port, but from memory only 2 going into the battery which I dont quite understand.

Anyway, based on the above, I would be very wary of trying to charge on the bike. You may be OK charging the battery directly still, but it does look like the system is more complex that I thought, which increases the risk of damaging somthing.

 

[jimbob]

Is it just me or is most of this just techno-babble?

Possibly ?

But then I'm an Engineer, so love this stuff. I'm suprised the bike isnt in bits yet to see how it works.

 

[Timochka69]

Possibly ?

But then I'm an Engineer, so love this stuff. I'm suprised the bike isnt in bits yet to see how it works.

I'm also an engineer

Been breaking stuff to pieces since the 1960's, often even managing to assemble them back to working order after that.

 

[steve_sordy]

@jimbob Just joshing with you.
I used to be an engineer, but it is 39 years since my last engineering job.
Apprentice trained mechanical engineer, then graduated with an hons degree in mech eng. I covered a lot of electrical stuff, but that was 45 years ago since qualifying, so nothing to compare with what's out there now. Bloody hell, we all used a slide-rule when I was at Uni!
When you are fully expert and fluent in a technical topic, it's easy to forget that most others are not.

 

[Warekiwi]

I keep hoping that one of you might "get brave " and figure out how to charge a Shimano battery with the Satiator. For me it's not that I want to charge any faster but I like the ability of the Satiator to store variou charging profiles. (e.g. I have a custom 48V 21 ah pack on the e-assisted velomobile and mostly just charge it to 80% with occasional slow 100% charges to cell balance) I guess there are two main problems- 1, Faking the data handshake to tell the Shimano battery to accept the Satiator and 2. Obtaining the Shimano cell specification in order to create a suitable profile (without cutting open the battery pack!!)