Bosch Smart motor 2022 - walk assist problems

[Nejc]

I recently bought a new Trek Rail 9.8 XT electric bike which has a new Bosch 2022 smart motor, a 750 Wh battery and a new Kiox 300. On my first ride I tried the walk assist and found it to be useless as it is. When you activate the walk assist with the - button, the bike moves 2-3 metres, then comes to a complete stop and starts to move again a second later. This cyclical action is completely contrary to all the walk assist that my previous bikes had. When my dealer-servicer contacted Bosch in Germany, he was told that it is a new smart system which works different. Well now I don't know whether my bike is not working properly or whether I am crazy. The Bosch technician remotely connected to the bike and made a new setting. The diagnostics were OK. After this operation the walk function is still unusable. The bike behaves similarly in all types of inclines; be it a trail with drops or a paved road. Walk assist works discontinuously and when you walk alongside the bike you feel miserable. I don't know if anyone has had a similar experience?

 

[Bomble]

What gear are you in?

 

[Nejc]

To be honest, I've never watched it. Does this matter?

 

[Jag009]

Not had any problems with mine ,and does not seem to matter what gear its in

 

[Nejc]

Do you have the same model/year?

 

[Jag009]

Do you have the same model/year?

Whytes 160rsx the new one ,so i think it has exactly the same motor as yours

 

[JP-NZ]

Do you have the same model/year?

Ive got the exact same bike, its currently getting its first service. When I get it back this weekend I'll have a play around with the walk mode (I've never used it yet) and see how it behaves. I'll report back here soon

 

[Clean]

Works fine for me and I have used it a fair bit.

 

[Bomble]

Mine seems to work better in a higher gear.

 

[Kingerz]

Giant and Specialized ones barely work for me so you are in good company!

 

[Nejc]

I've added a link to a video where you can see how the bike stops every few metres. Maybe the video is not the most illustrative but you can see that it is a discontinuous operation. I don't know if this is "normal" operation or is it a SW fault of Bosch?

 

[JP-NZ]

Ive got the exact same bike, its currently getting its first service. When I get it back this weekend I'll have a play around with the walk mode (I've never used it yet) and see how it behaves. I'll report back here soon

@Nejc mine does exactly the same. It goes for about 2-3m then stops for a second then goes again.

I’ve never used walk assist on the trail, I swear to god EMTB mode makes me feel like I could climb a vertical wall.

 

[Nejc]

@JP-NZ
I'm from the old MTB generation when we used to ride bikes without suspension and often carried them to the top of certain mountains .
There are still many trails (at least in the area where I live and there are a lot of old WW1 mule trails) where there are sections on the climbs that are unrideable even for the greatest masters. I know that electric bikes can do things that were unthinkable not so long ago, but the problem is that the current Bosch walk assist is funny rather than smart, or that may be an issue on my system. The only way to use this function is to press the - button every 2-3 seconds. I don't believe this is something what makes Bosch users happy??

 

[JP-NZ]

Agree. If you wanted to use it to walk the bike up the hill you could still push it along. I’ve never used another walking system so unsure what it’s supposed to feel like. But if it’s supposed to be a constant drive from the motor my smart system
Definitely is not like that.

 

[jono878]

mine does not stop but does slow down a bit after a while or on the flat.

 

[Yoak]

I found the Walk mode in the gen 3 Rails to be utter shit. It hardly pushes the bike forward at all. It’s way to slow compared to my 2021 Rail. I think it stops because you out run the assistance as you start to push. At least that happens to me

 

[stratosa]

I recently bought a new Trek Rail 9.8 XT electric bike which has a new Bosch 2022 smart motor, a 750 Wh battery and a new Kiox 300. On my first ride I tried the walk assist and found it to be useless as it is. When you activate the walk assist with the - button, the bike moves 2-3 metres, then comes to a complete stop and starts to move again a second later. This cyclical action is completely contrary to all the walk assist that my previous bikes had. When my dealer-servicer contacted Bosch in Germany, he was told that it is a new smart system which works different. Well now I don't know whether my bike is not working properly or whether I am crazy. The Bosch technician remotely connected to the bike and made a new setting. The diagnostics were OK. After this operation the walk function is still unusable. The bike behaves similarly in all types of inclines; be it a trail with drops or a paved road. Walk assist works discontinuously and when you walk alongside the bike you feel miserable. I don't know if anyone has had a similar experience?

walk assist works up to 6km/h

 

[a1phonic]

My 2022 Trek Rail does this - 3 seconds of walk then slows then 3 seconds of walk. I just use the pause to catch up with the bike pushing up hill so not a major issue for me. I would prefer a constant pull though,

 

[Silver fox]

I know with the Shimano E8000, you get the least assistance when you are in granny, and the most (fastest) when you’re in your smallest cog. This is counter intuitive as you are usually in granny just before turning on walk. Shifting 10 - 11 gears when stopped on a 35 degree slope is not easy! Shimano missed the mark on this one.

 

[Paul Mac]

I recently bought a new Trek Rail 9.8 XT electric bike which has a new Bosch 2022 smart motor, a 750 Wh battery and a new Kiox 300. On my first ride I tried the walk assist and found it to be useless as it is. When you activate the walk assist with the - button, the bike moves 2-3 metres, then comes to a complete stop and starts to move again a second later. This cyclical action is completely contrary to all the walk assist that my previous bikes had. When my dealer-servicer contacted Bosch in Germany, he was told that it is a new smart system which works different. Well now I don't know whether my bike is not working properly or whether I am crazy. The Bosch technician remotely connected to the bike and made a new setting. The diagnostics were OK. After this operation the walk function is still unusable. The bike behaves similarly in all types of inclines; be it a trail with drops or a paved road. Walk assist works discontinuously and when you walk alongside the bike you feel miserable. I don't know if anyone has had a similar experience?

Both mine and my mates are the same as yours, and yes it's rubbish, my 2020 Rail actually worked!

 

[a1phonic]

I guess this is something that could be changed via a software upgrade so I guess if enough people complain then Bosch may do something. What would be even better would be the option to choose the type of assistance preferred via the app.

 

[Paul Mac]

I think Trek have designed the new walk mode for more Alpine riding, where it's so steep that you literally have to let the bike walk up a metre of so and then you walk up to it and repeat. That's why it's also got the hill hold feature.
Unfortunately if you just want to walk beside the bike on mellower hills, it's frustrating.

 

[Doug Stampfer]

I think it would work best if you could just say "Siri walk my bike" & you could walk beside it normally & not contorting your hand trying to keep the button pushed in.

 

[nandewar]

Both mine and my mates are the same as yours, and yes it's rubbish, my 2020 Rail actually worked!

My Focus Thron is exactly the same too. Next to useless in my opinion. The dealer I got it from is trying to sort it through Bosch. I've needed it several times on steep slippery trails and am not happy.
My old Gen 2 Trek was great. Especially up stairs. Surely there must be something wrong with the new smart system cause it damn well stinks as it is.

 

[Mikerb]

Can't say I noticed any issue with my Whyte E160 RSX on the odd occasion I have used walk assist. I have only ever used it if I fail a steep climb which on this bike is rare.
So just out of curiosity I tried it on my driveway which has a gentle slope.
What I noticed was the motor is constantly working and there is drive all the time but it alternates between 2 speeds. Gear selection did not make any difference on a smooth surface with only a gentle gradient.
I think the reason I had not noticed before is that when stuck on a steep gradient the use of walk assist pushes the bike forward a little way and then I have to catch up.....then repeat.
So my verdict is that the way it works in conjunction with the "hold" function is perfect as a "failed climb" assist.........or for climbing stairs or a steep ramp whilst not riding. Not sure why you would use it where it is easy to just walk beside it and push.

 

[Nejc]

Can't say I noticed any issue with my Whyte E160 RSX on the odd occasion I have used walk assist. I have only ever used it if I fail a steep climb which on this bike is rare.
So just out of curiosity I tried it on my driveway which has a gentle slope.
What I noticed was the motor is constantly working and there is drive all the time but it alternates between 2 speeds. Gear selection did not make any difference on a smooth surface with only a gentle gradient.
I think the reason I had not noticed before is that when stuck on a steep gradient the use of walk assist pushes the bike forward a little way and then I have to catch up.....then repeat.
So my verdict is that the way it works in conjunction with the "hold" function is perfect as a "failed climb" assist.........or for climbing stairs or a steep ramp whilst not riding. Not sure why you would use it where it is easy to just walk beside it and push.

The fact about pushing the mtb e-bike is that we don't need this function on unproblematic slopes. An electric bike really goes up crazy hills. But anyone who really cycles in the mountains (I don't mean bike parks) is often faced with pushing the bike up absolutely unrideable sections when climbing. Sometimes it is necessary to push the bike for 15, 30... min. We used to do it with regular bikes and we do it with electric bikes too. A few metres is not a problem, 30 min is a problem. The predecessor of the Kiox 300 was a disaster in the basic version. The button on the top of the remote (pressing with index finger ????) and every slight shake of the handlebar the contact was lost and the bike slid backwards. Later with the SW upgrade the issue was solved quite well. When I saw the new Kiox 300 I thought; finally the right position of the knob and the hillstop function is there. Well when I tried the walk assist the disappointment I have already described followed and the function as such is useless. I can say this quite competently, having ridden MTB for several decades. I hope that our criticisms reach Bosch and that they will fix the SW, because as it is at the moment it does not belong on a bike for which you have to pay EUR 8 000,00+.

 

[Mikerb]

The fact about pushing the mtb e-bike is that we don't need this function on unproblematic slopes. An electric bike really goes up crazy hills. But anyone who really cycles in the mountains (I don't mean bike parks) is often faced with pushing the bike up absolutely unrideable sections when climbing. Sometimes it is necessary to push the bike for 15, 30... min. We used to do it with regular bikes and we do it with electric bikes too. A few metres is not a problem, 30 min is a problem. The predecessor of the Kiox 300 was a disaster in the basic version. The button on the top of the remote (pressing with index finger ????) and every slight shake of the handlebar the contact was lost and the bike slid backwards. Later with the SW upgrade the issue was solved quite well. When I saw the new Kiox 300 I thought; finally the right position of the knob and the hillstop function is there. Well when I tried the walk assist the disappointment I have already described followed and the function as such is useless. I can say this quite competently, having ridden MTB for several decades. I hope that our criticisms reach Bosch and that they will fix the SW, because as it is at the moment it does not belong on a bike for which you have to pay EUR 8 000,00+.

For those scenarios surely it is easier to carry the bike, in the same way you would if using an analogue bike. A back pack helps if you need to do that. I doubt walk assist was ever intended to be used for extended uphill trudges like you describe.

 

[nandewar]

For those scenarios surely it is easier to carry the bike, in the same way you would if using an analogue bike. A back pack helps if you need to do that. I doubt walk assist was ever intended to be used for extended uphill trudges like you describe.

I often do long uphill trudges. When our fire trails get too wet, or for that matter too dry, traction is the issue. Once traction is lost it is hard to start up again. Much easier to walk it. Unless you have a shitty walk assist like on the Bosch. With "hill hold" it would be much better to just release the button if you need to catch up with the bike instead of the bike deciding it needs to slow to a crawl every 2 metres. At least have a setting in Flow to let the rider decide.
It's very annoying.

 

[Nejc]

For those scenarios surely it is easier to carry the bike, in the same way you would if using an analogue bike. A back pack helps if you need to do that. I doubt walk assist was ever intended to be used for extended uphill trudges like you describe.

The purpose of this topic was not to exchange views on pushing, but to evaluate walk assist - Bosch's new smart feature. My assessment was that, whatever the issues of its predecessor, it is inferior and as such almost useless for the purpose it should serve. My assessment is that the KIOX 300 system is inferior to the KIOX I had on the previous Scott bike.
How one rides and how one pushes the bike on different terrains is up to each individual and has no correlation with the purpose of my post. However....

15 years ago

Same mountain 2 years ago.

Despite the design flaw (button in the wrong place on the remot), I could easily walk alongside the bike for 30 mins where colleagues were carrying or pushing bikes. This bike is 25 kg and it is a bit ridiculous to carry such a load when it has a walk and hillstop function?

 

[Nejc]

.... and let me add that a friend bought the same bike and his comment on walk assist was: from bad to worst.