Best All-Around EMTB?
- Thread starter chirosuisse
- Start date
Binzer
Member
I ride in Switzerland, Verbier area and behind nyon/jura area , I have a Levo 2019 which is great fun, But it only has a 500wh battery which has me watching my power setting from the beginning. As you know a lot of up in Switzerland, so make sure you get a big battery.
It sounds like you've spent your whole life being over forked.....
Marchordie
New Member
Orbea Wild Fs team with the extra batt option will give you quite some autonomy 625+500 wh
100k and 2500hm is no problem in Tour modus
Bosch engine is very good but has also some sofisticated anti tuning software, as your trail will must of the time descent or ascent, the speed limit will be no problem.
Geometrie and suspension setup is Enduro, just put an Maxxis Assegai tyre in front and you will have plenty grip on the downhill.
Enjoy your ride
100k and 2500hm is no problem in Tour modus
Bosch engine is very good but has also some sofisticated anti tuning software, as your trail will must of the time descent or ascent, the speed limit will be no problem.
Geometrie and suspension setup is Enduro, just put an Maxxis Assegai tyre in front and you will have plenty grip on the downhill.
Enjoy your ride
remosito
Member
Swiss Alps (and hills) get steep fast. And it's really easy to accumulate height meters like crazy.
Depending on your fitness level and affinity to suffering. Motor power for the steepness and
battery size and/or ease of installing replacement battery (or fast charging speeds) for height meters
is something that can very much impact your enjoyment.
Saying this a swiss bloke who ain't that cardio fit, has stork legs and gets no enjoyment out of suffering....
Try to testride as many bikes with different motors as you can while still in the US.
Depending on your fitness level and affinity to suffering. Motor power for the steepness and
battery size and/or ease of installing replacement battery (or fast charging speeds) for height meters
is something that can very much impact your enjoyment.
Saying this a swiss bloke who ain't that cardio fit, has stork legs and gets no enjoyment out of suffering....
Try to testride as many bikes with different motors as you can while still in the US.
CBSTD
E*POWAH Master
If you've sold your Aprilla you'll be used to Italian boutique brands, I don't know anything about them apart from are awfully pretty and expensive
nB2000
Member
There’s a scary thread I. Here about Decoy water / motor connection System death issues.
That's an interesting looking bike ... not sure about the name on the international scene though .. if you combine it to English and French it's called a "Boob Here" - are they saying it's a handful ?
Velociraptor
Member
I have been riding a Santa Cruz Heckler for about 6 months and riding with friends on the Levo. I like my Heckler but have Levo envy a lot. When doing big climbs I have to carry a spare battery. I weigh 87 kilos. The Heckler is a 27.5 and it's weak point is steep rooty downhills. I put a 29 on the front and the Heckler was better and handling was still good. At the moment I am planning on adding a Specialized Kenevo Expert when and if they become available again. I am hoping they go 29 front on the new Kenevo but who knows. Overall one bike only maybe the Levo because of that big battery and sweet Brose motor.
nB2000
Member
My seriously skilled off-road motorcycle riding mate (Paris Dakar/ trials etc) won’t buy an e-mtb, sticks to his pedal bike but might feel different if pedalling the Alps.
I am older - he told me he rode and rated the Kenevo. Good geometry (super important) and pretty good spec I wish it had mixed wheelsizes As it really does help agility (but definitely not bouncy tyres wider than 2.6). You call that Mullet. As a 70’s kid I can’t use that naff word to describe a bike. ‘;~}
Specialized 4 year motor warranty means the bike still has value at 2 years old when you want a new one. Not so for poor old Bosch owners.
Knowing a few ebike owners (I’m still pedalling) and reading here they can be awfully unreliable so you definitely need a good friendly helpful dealer. One of my journo mates has 4/5 motors replacements a year on average.
prepare to be stranded and pedalling occasionally.
Kenevo is the most motorcycle like in feel when standing on the bike as it has decent reach and a slack head angle. That’s what I’d buy if it had a 27.5 rear and cane in size S6. (I’m 6’2” and much appreciate a long low slack bike).
nB2000
Member
Oops I should have written if it came with a 29” front end!!
The 4 year warranty is only for MY19 and 20 bikes... otherwise it’s 2 years.
chirosuisse
New Member
- Thread starter
- #43
Great advice!
chirosuisse
New Member
- Thread starter
- #44
Good to know!
chirosuisse
New Member
- Thread starter
- #45
I'm in pretty good shape, but I'm not 29 anymore... so will opt for having a solid motor and power as I know I'll be glad I did
Range will also be important for sure. Sadly, you can't find a decent e-mountain bike in the US if your life depended on it. A patient of mine is the wife of the CEO of Specialized in Morgan Hill and there is NO WAY for me to get a bike, even with connections. Any bike produced is already spoken for dealers months in advance. It's pretty crazy. You can't even find bikes on the used market. So I'll be most likely looking at trying out bikes once I arrive in Switzerland after the snow melts... Ugh, that'll be a shift in weather coming from CA after 22 years...Velociraptor
Member
I'm in pretty good shape, but I'm not 29 anymore... so will opt for having a solid motor and power as I know I'll be glad I did
Oh no! OK I won't get my hopes up for a Kenevo anytime soon. I can't even order one at my local Specialized dealer. I am hoping things will normalize during the winter but who knows.
chirosuisse
New Member
- Thread starter
- #47
Yeah, the US market is NUTS for sure. Europe seems a little less crazy, albeit bikes are back-ordered everywhere. Thanks, COVID!
chirosuisse
New Member
- Thread starter
- #48
Nice! Never heard of Titici Everso. Beautiful. Probably don't wanna know what it costs!
Haha... Yeah, Aprilia makes nice bikes!
Rusty
E*POWAH BOSS
Meh - why not put my 2 cents worth in this thread .... after all @Zimmerframe has cracked at least 1 funny and not referred to which bike crashes the best....
Switzerland .... hmm, a few Swiss brands to choose from but the BMC Speedfox AMP and Scott eGenius are two I have rode and while I am on the eGenius Tuned right now I really liked the BMC.
I guess the first thing to do is to go ride a few and decide which motor you prefer. Being new to this it is like a painter with a blank canvas - anything can happen from there. I guess the first decision is the motor type - one of the lower powered but lighter systems such as the Specialized SL 1.1 or Fazua Evation (which limits you to a very small range of bikes) or one of the 'conventional' eMTB motors - Bosch, Brose, Shimano (2 models) or Yamaha - then you have the Bafang and the TQ.
Motor Review
Having owned a Bosch, Brose and Shimano in the past year and tested a couple Giants with the Yamaha and played on an absolutely stupid Asian bike with a 1000W Bafang I have the following opinion. The Yamaha is best for over-weight or non cyclists that don't ride with any cadence as they work better at a much lower cadence than the others. The Shimano e8000 is to me the more natural feeling and gave an experience closest to a non motorized ride. I love my Bosch motor, but would give the best motor title to the Brose as in the Specialized by a quim hair on 1 thing alone - the Bosch has an annoying to some clank when going through rough terrain and not on the power. Me, I don't notice it so is not an issue, but others do. The Brose is a tad quieter due to its internal belt drive, but that is also a weak point IMHO for those of us in the 100Kg and up range.
Go ride a few to get a feel of the motors then select something you will have good local support for.
Switzerland .... hmm, a few Swiss brands to choose from but the BMC Speedfox AMP and Scott eGenius are two I have rode and while I am on the eGenius Tuned right now I really liked the BMC.
I guess the first thing to do is to go ride a few and decide which motor you prefer. Being new to this it is like a painter with a blank canvas - anything can happen from there. I guess the first decision is the motor type - one of the lower powered but lighter systems such as the Specialized SL 1.1 or Fazua Evation (which limits you to a very small range of bikes) or one of the 'conventional' eMTB motors - Bosch, Brose, Shimano (2 models) or Yamaha - then you have the Bafang and the TQ.
Motor Review
Having owned a Bosch, Brose and Shimano in the past year and tested a couple Giants with the Yamaha and played on an absolutely stupid Asian bike with a 1000W Bafang I have the following opinion. The Yamaha is best for over-weight or non cyclists that don't ride with any cadence as they work better at a much lower cadence than the others. The Shimano e8000 is to me the more natural feeling and gave an experience closest to a non motorized ride. I love my Bosch motor, but would give the best motor title to the Brose as in the Specialized by a quim hair on 1 thing alone - the Bosch has an annoying to some clank when going through rough terrain and not on the power. Me, I don't notice it so is not an issue, but others do. The Brose is a tad quieter due to its internal belt drive, but that is also a weak point IMHO for those of us in the 100Kg and up range.
Go ride a few to get a feel of the motors then select something you will have good local support for.
whiterabbit
Member
Oh so many thoughts.
#1, all rounder? I think Levo SL. I’d have gotten one except I didn’t care for 29” wheels. The range is superb, you can get extenders easily, the power is plenty. Your budget can get the bike and mod it. And they are everywhere in every model.
#2. No demos and can’t get a kenevo. Did you say you have a patient in Morgan Hill and are thus in the Bay Area for now?
Go to scotts valley cycle sport. First, to rent a levo SL. Rent with the extender. You can rent a levo too.
if you want a kenevo, get on their list. Thats where I got my 2020 kenevo, and recently.
if you want an SL after the rental, go yo wheelaway or trailhead cyclery. They both have piles of levo SL’s.
If you want to demo a kenevo, call me. We can go on a ride and swap bikes. But make sure you’re on a rental ebike or else I’ll never keep up!
#1, all rounder? I think Levo SL. I’d have gotten one except I didn’t care for 29” wheels. The range is superb, you can get extenders easily, the power is plenty. Your budget can get the bike and mod it. And they are everywhere in every model.
#2. No demos and can’t get a kenevo. Did you say you have a patient in Morgan Hill and are thus in the Bay Area for now?
Go to scotts valley cycle sport. First, to rent a levo SL. Rent with the extender. You can rent a levo too.
if you want a kenevo, get on their list. Thats where I got my 2020 kenevo, and recently.
if you want an SL after the rental, go yo wheelaway or trailhead cyclery. They both have piles of levo SL’s.
If you want to demo a kenevo, call me. We can go on a ride and swap bikes. But make sure you’re on a rental ebike or else I’ll never keep up!
I have a Trek Powerfly 5 hardtail, my son has a Decathlon Stilus, which as you may know has FS. Even though the Stilus was about £250 cheaper, it has better components, including a faster battery charger than my Trek. I tried to put him off buying a 'no-label' bike from a stack 'em high shop, but I have to say that it's a great bike.
Martinintirol
Well-known member
I ride in the Austrian Alps. I have a Specialized TL FSR Comp with 700wh battery. You will find on mega days that is not enough even running eco most of the time. The batteries are huge and heavy. I just carry my charging cable and find a almhutte or bauernhof, you can find external electrical charging points to plug into...... Anyway, tried KTM's and Giants, 27.5 Specialized Fatty. For me 29'er is far superior for the Alps....
veryoldfart
Member
I am an "oldie" ie 70+. Ridden a lot of super bikes over the past 40 years ( early days Merlin titanium HT then mostly Santa Cruz carbon frames- Blur, Bronson, Nomad).
In 2019, after a couple of trial e-bike days with Specialized and Trek and a few other brands , I parted with cash for a Turbo Levo Comp carbon ( just the rear triangle is alloy, rest carbon). This came with 500wh battery, but since acquired 700wh for use in the Alps ( no range anxiety now).
Also, bike is quite heavily modded with new Fox 36 Factory Kashima 160mm forks and 2021 Fox DPX2 rear shock and Fox transfer post. Plus SC Reserve carbon rims on Chris King Hubs and carbon bars and carbon chainset.(Selling bike dealer did swaps for me when bike was new and offered trade-in for the non-required parts, so nothing like as expensive as you might think). Effectively ended up with an S- Works minus the carbon rear triangle.
With 500 wh battery weighs a tad over 20kg but rides beautifully. Had two summers use in the Swiss Alps ( Grimentz/Zinal etc) and with the 700 wh battery and motor ensured that I could climb tracks that I had only ever previously pushed/walked. Made for a really much better experience and much much more fun. We climbed more, we rode farther, we descended more technical as extra weight gives greater stability
But, as others have said finding the best local dealer is a really important thing.
I can service and fettle my own shifters, brakes, change pads, do brake bleeds etc etc.
But electrics require access to a service network. Our motors both required a firmware update (dealer required to do this, although I believe they may over the air/internet in future?). Also dealer replaced cracked frame bump stop and fitted new wiring harness.
So, choose your dealer well - look after them and get them to look after you. Focus is also a brand I would consider plus Orbea and Cube.
BTW, I have supported this same dealer for almost 30 years and it pays - their service /support is fantastic.
God luck and safe happy riding
Geoff
veryoldfart
Member
I concur. The 29" rim is one of the major reasons we find riding our TLs so good, they just roll over rocks, steps etc in a way that my old 27.5" rims never did.
jeroen
Active member
I'm in pretty good shape, but I'm not 29 anymore... so will opt for having a solid motor and power as I know I'll be glad I did
In my little part of Switzerland, where we are already at 900m+ and where the end of the street (~15 mins) means you are at 1500m and a wee bit further to the 2500m++ range, a lot of folks are riding Trek Rail; which might have to do with the LBS selling those and doing great support (for the few times you need them), they have a bunch in stock/in-store, 2021 models since this June already as they sold through their 2020s
I also see Flyer and Scott though, everybody has their personal preference of course and there are a few good LBS that each have their own set of brands, but Trek seems to be heavily preferred in this region, dunno why, though it might have to do with many prefering to go properly offroad, even at minimum because there is no trail...
Battery range can only be solved by doing more of the work...... which needs training, or by taking a second battery along in a backpack or somehow mounted separately; that or go for Riese & Muller bikes that have dual-battery options, but those are heavy tanks and not really MTB anymore (and the extra weight counters.
That said, on my 2021 Trek Rail 9 with Bosch I easily make it up to 2500m ... and then glide back down again with spare battery left with the bike doing about 60% of the work. Thus as usual YMMV.
As for fresh snow... that is there already for a few weeks at 1500m++, the proper quantities are coming soon with temps having dropped from for-swiss balmy ~25C a few weeks back down to 4C during the day...
Two shots from last week:
hello,
My recommendation is to head down to you’re local shops and every shop you can find around you and talk to everyone. I bought my bike off e bay and love it. I had never ridden in before and just took a shot. It’s a Cannondale monterra Neo 2, there has been a learning curve but it’s been awesome. $2k off was also a big help. Only issue I have is the weight of the bike at 25kilos. Look for the Bosch performance cx.
also you can get great bikes for a lot less than what you want to spend.
techm8n
Member
Try as many eMTB as you can. There's so many great bikes out there. Below just to name a few. Also, buy your eMTB in the US since our motor assist goes up to 20mph vs Europe 16mph limit.
Cube Stereo Hybrid 160 Action Team (I have one)
Specialized Turbo Levo
Orbea Wild FS
Norco Sight or Range VLT
Trek Rail 9.8 or 9.9
YT Decoy
Canyon Spectral:ON CF 7.0
Cube Stereo Hybrid 160 Action Team (I have one)
Specialized Turbo Levo
Orbea Wild FS
Norco Sight or Range VLT
Trek Rail 9.8 or 9.9
YT Decoy
Canyon Spectral:ON CF 7.0
Having thought on it for a few minutes, for the Alps I'd suggest something with the biggest battery you can get, so a Scott, Orbea, Haibike or any of the other brands with the ability to fit a second battery.
This doesn't necessarily answer the original question of what is the best all round eMTB.
This doesn't necessarily answer the original question of what is the best all round eMTB.
whiterabbit
Member
So, another vote for Levo SL then, where the motor is enough and extenders are light, easily packed, and reasonably priced
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