By EMTB Forums News
News
64 Comments

Here is the new 2020 Bosch motor

All new lighter, smaller motor for 2020

After a long wait and many rumours, here is the new 2020 motor from Bosch.

  • 2.9KG (down from 4KG in the old Performance CX line)
  • Regular chainring (no small sprocket like the outgoing model)
  • New chassis
  • Almost all resistance removed after motor cut off
  • All new 600Wh power tube battery
`The new 600Wh PowerTube internal battery

Spotted first on the French website Le Marché Du Vélo there area also some rumours that Bosch have developed a Bluetooth suspension integration, allowing the rider to change all of the suspension settings via the Bosch Nyon display.

We’re sure that more will be coming soon so stay tuned for all the news as we get it.

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Posting all the latest news and rumours for everything EMTB related.

64 Comments

  1. Be all nice and tested with plenty of reviews once I’m ready for a new one in 2021……..

  4. [QUOTE=”drjarvis2003, post: 74192, member: 640″]Think they are aware that by the time these bikes are actually available to buy, it will be next year.[/QUOTE]
    A decent proportion of new 2020 bikes will be available this Autumn, same as every year. My dealer told me the Whytes will be amongst those.

  5. I’m sure it will be great, but personally I prefer less tech in the cockpit, that display is too intrusive for my personal taste – hopefully there will be other options.

    Electronically adjustable suspension will be interesting. It’s not really been a game changer in the motorcycle world, it solved a problem that was never really there, while significantly increased prices. I prefer the set and forget approach, but I’m sure there will be plenty of people wanting it – those high end ebikes are going to be a similar cost a high end motorbike soon!

  6. [QUOTE=”Rob Hancill, post: 74200, member: 1″]Wonder how much power it has?[/QUOTE]
    It doesn’t [I]need [/I]any more than the current motor. What is does need is minimal drag when switched off/over the assist limit and high efficiency when in use.

  7. That display is the current Kiox model – not a new one, what the article says is that it will be a similar display

  9. Someone reckons a dealer told him it would be 92nm. Big announcement June 18th apparently

  10. It was about time… almost down to Shimano weight. Personally, I prefer ebikes without any bells and whistles just give me some assist power. I don’t need Bluetooth suspension settings and cinema display just keep the tech minimal.

  12. [QUOTE=”Dodgy, post: 74252, member: 67″]Can you swap the old cx line motor out for the nice new motor[/QUOTE]

    I would be amazed if you could, very doubtful I would think

  13. [QUOTE=”Dodgy, post: 74252, member: 67″]Can you swap the old cx line motor out for the nice new motor[/QUOTE]
    Judging by this I doubt it;
    [quote]New Engine Attachment[/quote]

  16. Interesting development. Not interested in adjusting suspension on the fly, but with no motor drag, it will make a big difference, I think? Certainly to me as I can’t seem to get above 32KPH on the flat, with the current motor drag!!

  18. It will be interesting to see what Shimano comes up with – Brose is pretty much the pinnacle at the moment I think, the older Bosch CX I have ridden in comparison seemed out of the Ark.

    What they all have to create I think is a user serviceable/interchangeable ‘BB’ unit as we have had on regular bikes for ever and a day.

  19. What we all have to remember is that it’s not just the motor, but the software that controls it that is important. The Brose May be the most powerful motor at the moment, but it’s the Specialized software that gives it the riding “sensation”. Same with Giant and the Yamaha motor they use. If you ride a Fantic the Brose feels quite different.

    Bosch has been able to stick with the current motor for so long because their software is so good.

    The software creates the natural pedal feeling we all want.

  21. odd how there is no picture of the wire connections, i suspect that the main power/speed sensor/ Controller + 2 light sockets will be different.

  22. [QUOTE=”Wiltshire Warrior, post: 74418, member: 628″]odd how there is no picture of the wire connections, i suspect that the main power/speed sensor/ Controller + 2 light sockets will be different.[/QUOTE]

    I think it’s a bit silly not keeping the mounts and plugs the same, ok plugs are easily changed but the amount of lost sales if it was a bolt in upgrade would be in the millions.

  23. By switching to a normal chain ring there is no way to make it retro compatible, its a whole new design.

  24. [QUOTE=”R120, post: 74463, member: 291″]By switching to a normal chain ring there is no way to make it retro compatible[/QUOTE]

    I don’t see why that would have to be the case. If the mounting points were in the same place relative to the centreline of the BB it should work. There’s no incentive for Bosch to do that though and it may make the new motor bigger than necessary.
    I’d be interested to see the form factor of the Active Line motor that uses a normal size chainring.

  26. I still think there’s an aftermarket for bolt in adapters to fit newer motors or other brands. Pretty simple as the newer motors are smaller. Aftermarket batteries as well to fit different bikes

  27. Lots of great improvements! can’t wait to test one out

    But seeing the large base of POMs on this forum, I’ll have a go at recreational whinging

    >Anyone else not a fan of big displays or any display for that matter?

    > longer battery length- wouldn’t that higher the center gravity? thought the goal would be to get the dead weight as low as possible

    >suspenion integration?? who’s that pedantic about the suspension?

  28. [QUOTE=”The Flying Dutchman, post: 74522, member: 2519″]>Anyone else not a fan of big displays or any display for that matter?[/QUOTE]Bosch’s displays have historically been swappable with any one being able to be used with (almost) any motor. I suspect you will see at least one minimal option released with the new motor.
    [QUOTE=”The Flying Dutchman, post: 74522, member: 2519″]> longer battery length- wouldn’t that higher the center gravity? thought the goal would be to get the dead weight as low as possible[/QUOTE]Yes it will, but since all the competition are doing it to get that integrated look they are just following the herd. Lower CG is just one of the practical reasons to prefer an “ugly” external battery, but sadly they are being “focus-group-researched” out of existence…
    [QUOTE=”The Flying Dutchman, post: 74522, member: 2519″]>suspension integration?? who’s that pedantic about the suspension?[/QUOTE]It’s just a sales led differentiating feature over the competition for those who absolutely must have “the best”. Nowadays most of the truly premium (£8k+) bikes seen to use Brose or Shimano rather than Bosch; they probably want their slice back of those (higher profit margin) sales.

  30. Why was the Focus post removed from the site ? The one showing the new bike with a gen4 motor ?

  31. [USER=1]@Rob Hancill[/USER] have you got a pic of the battery plating label showing the voltage and capacity?

  32. [QUOTE=”Sijmes, post: 76480, member: 1234″]Why was the Focus post removed from the site ? The one showing the new bike with a gen4 motor ?[/QUOTE]
    Focus went nuts about it

  33. [QUOTE=”Doomanic, post: 76485, member: 52″][USER=1]@Rob Hancill[/USER] have you got a pic of the battery plating label showing the voltage and capacity?[/QUOTE]
    Nothing until 18th ?

  35. 25% Lighter at 2.9kg
    48% smaller
    75nm torque so no change – improved power curve
    Turbo mode up from 300% to 340% assistance
    Battery 625wh with a rumoured 725wh coming – range likely the same as old gen with increased assistance.
    Virtually zero resistance from the motor
    The display is whatever manufacture prefer so Kiox or Purion
    Announcement coming 18th June 2019
    New fitment so no cannot retro fitted to replace older gen motors.

  36. [QUOTE=”Doomanic, post: 74268, member: 52″]Judging by this I doubt it;[/QUOTE]

    It will be easy to fabricate an adapter fixing for it especially as it is smaller – infact the shiny steel plate shown in the photo is probably a retro fit plate. Then all we need to do is splice the wires onto any new plug sockets they might change – so long as it works with old batteries it will be easy peasy.

  37. [QUOTE=”RW, post: 77626″]25% Lighter at 2.9kg
    48% smaller
    75nm torque so no change – improved power curve
    Turbo mode up from 300% to 340% assistance
    Battery 625wh with a rumoured 725wh coming – range likely the same as old gen with increased assistance.
    Virtually zero resistance from the motor
    The display is whatever manufacture prefer so Kiox or Purion
    Announcement coming 18th June 2019
    New fitment so no cannot retro fitted to replace older gen motors.[/QUOTE]

    So basicly a E8000 motor, with probably less noise? And maybe a bit better powerband. (hopefully able to assist more at higher cadence)

    Which explains why it doesnt look like Shimano has something new coming soon (they probably dont see it as a big enough competitor, for them having to step it up yet), sort of confirmed by seing brands like YT using the E8000 in the brand new Decoy instead of waiting for something new.

  38. [QUOTE=”OlaGB, post: 77973, member: 3211″]Which explains why it doesnt look like Shimano has something new coming soon[/QUOTE]

    The E8000 is a goo dmotor but it could do with an iteration. Too many weird error codes, fussy about the torque sensor, etc. It’s good, but it feels a bit v1.0 right now. A minor refresh based on lessons learned would be great.Bosch have been doing this for ages. The Perf Line CX wasnt perfect, but they got a lot right. Hopefully the new motor will build on that heritage.

  39. The real test is in how companies can make sure the software is regularly developed.

    The secret sauce for the Brose in the Levo 2019 is really Specialized’s software stack. I have no idea if Shimano or Bosch are open to OEMs developing their own fork of the control software.

  40. [QUOTE=”Fivetones, post: 77987, member: 2838″]I have no idea if Shimano or Bosch are open to OEMs developing their own fork of the control software.[/QUOTE]
    I suspect that this was one of the determining factors for Brose in Specialized’s motor choice. As far as I know Bosch / Shimano all require OEM displays and software.

  41. [QUOTE=”Rob Hancill, post: 77994, member: 1″]I suspect that this was one of the determining factors for Brose in Specialized’s motor choice. As far as I know Bosch / Shimano all require OEM displays and software.[/QUOTE]

    I suspected as much Rob. I wonder if Fazua et al are more like Brose?

  42. [QUOTE=”OlaGB, post: 77973, member: 3211″]So basicly a E8000 motor, with probably less noise? And maybe a bit better powerband. (hopefully able to assist more at higher cadence)

    Which explains why it doesnt look like Shimano has something new coming soon (they probably dont see it as a big enough competitor, for them having to step it up yet), sort of confirmed by seing brands like YT using the E8000 in the brand new Decoy instead of waiting for something new.[/QUOTE]

    Whyte has gone for the new Bosch motor in all 3 of their new EMTBs and Scott have dropped Shimano from all but 2 models for 2020 instead using Bosch.

  43. [QUOTE=”DEADHEAD, post: 78295, member: 4357″]Whyte has gone for the new Bosch motor in all 3 of their new EMTBs and Scott have dropped Shimano from all but 2 models for 2020 instead using Bosch.[/QUOTE]

    And, judging by the leaked Focus Jam2 photos that was briefly on the forum, they’ve also switched at least some models from Shimano to Bosch 2020.

    I wonder why bike manufacturers are moving from Shimano to Bosch? Size/weight is similar, so it can’t be for the physical benefits. It’s probably all supply chain or servicing, but it’s kinda nice to hope the Bosch has some other killa feature like silence or even better decoupling past 16mph…

  44. [QUOTE=”SquireRides, post: 78670, member: 1050″]I wonder why bike manufacturers are moving from Shimano to Bosch? Size/weight is similar, so it can’t be for the physical benefits. It’s probably all supply chain or servicing, but it’s kinda nice to hope the Bosch has some other killa feature like silence or even better decoupling past 16mph…[/QUOTE]
    Market demand for bigger battery ?

  45. [QUOTE=”Stray cat, post: 78703, member: 956″]Yep,but according the info leaked here, capacity for new Bosch bat could be 600-650Wh[/QUOTE]
    Yep. I’d take the average of those 2 numbers 😉

  46. [QUOTE=”Stray cat, post: 78703, member: 956″]Yep,but according the info leaked here, capacity for new Bosch bat could be 600-650Wh and Shimano already has 630Wh with Simplo and other companies[/QUOTE]

    Using other suppliers for batteries gives the bike manufacturers choice. But I guess that’s not always a good thing. They probably prefer to buy the whole kit from one place, and Bosch may be a better long-term partner to have.

    Shimano have a good motor, but they’re falling behind on being able to offer battery choice…

  47. I have seen the new Bosch motor and battery. The battery is 625wh with a rumoured 725wh coming. When I felt the motor the resistance there was no more than a standard sealed bottom bracket.
    I Never got to test ride one 🙁

  48. Today’s the day – I will be watching the Whyte site and FB page with interest…

    [ATTACH=full]15025[/ATTACH]

  49. [QUOTE=”SquireRides, post: 78670, member: 1050″]And, judging by the leaked Focus Jam2 photos that was briefly on the forum, they’ve also switched at least some models from Shimano to Bosch 2020.

    I wonder why bike manufacturers are moving from Shimano to Bosch? Size/weight is similar, so it can’t be for the physical benefits. It’s probably all supply chain or servicing, but it’s kinda nice to hope the Bosch has some other killa feature like silence or even better decoupling past 16mph…[/QUOTE]
    The most likely answer is commercial. Remember Bosch were the market leader by a long way a few years ago, but have since been surpassed by new motors from the likes of Brose, Shimano and (a bit more debatable) Yamaha. I guess they want to get back to the top of the tree (and be perceived to be the best by potential buyers), so I am sure they have been very aggressive in the way they have priced their motors for the 2020 models from key brands like Whyte, Cube, Focus etc.

  55. [QUOTE=”Rob Hancill, post: 78920, member: 1″]Stay tuned on my youtube and here :)[/QUOTE]
    Oh, and my Youtube. (: Do you get the chance to publish my Kindernay-piece today btw?

    [MEDIA=youtube]vSgO4jsALaA[/MEDIA]

  56. [QUOTE=”featherplucker, post: 78918, member: 3908″]Anyone speak German?

    [MEDIA=youtube]YEhvUczfPn8[/MEDIA][/QUOTE]

    Mein Deutsch ist nicht gut

  57. It does seem odd that they are sticking with the unsuitable displays after designing a motor specifically for eMTBs.

  58. [QUOTE=”MattyB, post: 78908, member: 692″]The most likely answer is commercial. Remember Bosch were the market leader by a long way a few years ago, but have since been surpassed by new motors from the likes of Brose, Shimano and (a bit more debatable) Yamaha. I guess they want to get back to the top of the tree (and be perceived to be the best by potential buyers), so I am sure they have been very aggressive in the way they have priced their motors for the 2020 models from key brands like Whyte, Cube, Focus etc.[/QUOTE]

    Exactly that! Shimano have been cleaning up so they will be ultra aggressive in reclaiming that market share. We’ve already seen Shimano will allow bigger batteries. It’s all about the moneys.

    Frankly, if they had not prepped a load of manufacturers to go with them at launch it would have been a big oversight.

  59. The oversight on the displays is bizarre. Surely one of their focus (Focus?! ;)) groups would have told them that mountain bikers want something small and resilient that hides under the bars? Why they did not just copy the position of the Steps controller is beyond me, it’s pretty clearly the best spot for the display. Open goal missed!

  60. The Propane and Whyte look like the most interesting aggressive/enduro bikes coming to market, but that Bosh display on a long travel jump/enduro bike is so stupid…

    I think the problem with the eBike market is the amount of unnecessary hype. Sure the motors and battery are key components, but after riding a few, it’s the standard MTB stuff (geometry, spec and value) that tend to make the best bikes. My thoughts anyway.

  61. It would have been nice to see an updated display, we may yet see the Kiox built into some stems or crossbar? The new 6A faster charger can charge that 625wh battery from 0-100% in just 3.7hrs. Funny how no one has mentioned that.

  62. All the Trek and Giant 2019 emtbs are on firesale End of Line in NZ, hopefully that’s a good indication of new models due to hit in the very near future.

  63. Thread continued here:

    [URL=”https://www.emtbforums.com/community/threads/2020-bosch-update-new-motors-625wh-battery-and-more.6016/”]2020 Bosch Update: New motors, 625Wh battery and more – EMTB Forums[/URL]

  64. “All the Trek and Giant 2019 emtbs are on firesale End of Line in NZ”

    Not really, in fact it appears T7 have INCREASED the Trek FS7 prices! What gives I wonder? In fact why would I buy a Trek ebike at the moment until they’ve released the latest Bosch 2020 motor as part of the bike?

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