Can the Bosch Performance SX 55 Nm compete with full-power motors?

The small and light Bosch Performance SX is rated at 55 Nm of torque. It’s obviously been designed to be less powerful than the Performance CX. The SX is made for the mild and lightweight embs, often referred to as Super Light emtbs. Still, Bosch claims it has a peak power output of 600 W. That’s the same as many other full-power motors with more torque. How strong is the SX really?


How can a weaker motor have high power output?​

A small motorcycle engine can have a surprisingly high power output considering its size and torque. Even though it might have less torque than the Bosch SX, the high motor rotation speed makes up for it. Many motorcycle engines will go well beyond 10.000 rpm. That means the engine will have much more power than a way bigger tractor engine. Still, the tractor will pull a much heavier load up a hill.

The 55 Nm Bosch SX too needs high motor rotation speed to unleash its power potential. A common full-power ebike motor can be very strong from the get go, but the power can start tapering off well before 100 rpm. The Bosch SX needs to go beyond 100 rpm to deliver 600 W. Does that mean the Bosch SX can compete with the stronger motors in some situations?

What Bosch has to say about the Performance SX.


About the test​

There are two sides to testing motor power, peak power and power amplification. If we ride uphill in a low gear while pedaling slowly, we’re very likely not getting maximum power. This is a test of power amplification. If we push hard, we’ll be limited by the peak power. It’s interesting testing both. Before we start, we make sure the motors are set to the highest power settings in the app, that means +5 for the Bosch SX. The test is ridden in the highest assistance mode.

The bike must have a setup that matches a 29er rear wheel and a gear ratio of around 34/51. The hill is about 100 m long with 20 m of elevation, and it’s ridden at 65, 80 and 100 cadence. We measure how hard the rider pedals using Garmin Rally pedals. If the rider puts less force to the pedals, we know the motor has done more of the work as the bikes will have completed the segment in the same amount of time with similar cadence. We intended to do a 60 cadence test, but it was difficult riding that slow and all aour results were above 60 rpm, so it ended up being the 65 cadence test.

c02_vlcsnap-2024-06-14-13h33m22s038.jpg


We also ride a short trail loop of just under one kilometer. The loop starts with a section of smooth surface where we briefly go above cut-off speed, before entering rocky and rooty trails. There is little elevation difference in elevation, and we are riding all-out. There are so many variables in this test. Weather will affect speed, and the rider shape will vary throughout the season. Bikes have different tyres, suspension properties and geometry. We will be riding different lines on pretty much every run. Comparing results set the same day eliminates a few variables. This test is done to say something about ride feel and to determine if there are any huge, obvious differences in motor performance.

We’re comparing the Bosch SX to the 85 Nm Shimano EP801 and Bosch Performance CX. All tests were done on the same day by the same rider. You may already have seen some of these results in our EP8 vs Performance CX article.

We also rely on Garmin for regestering the watt data.


Uphill test​


65 cadence​

The Bosch SX is noticeably weaker at low cadence. But pushing 161 W isn’t that hard for most people weighing 80-90 kg. The full power motors require much less than 100 W of rider input, making the climb feel easy.

80 cadence​

Pedaling at 80 rpm is still a noticeably lower cadence than 100+, but the SX performs well. Sure, pedaling 184 W is noticeably more than on the full power motors. But we only pushed 23 W harder than on the 65 cadence run. The Bosch SX offers much more support at 80 rpm and there is little reason pedaling slower.

100 cadence​

Expectations were high for the 100 cadence test. We hoped to find the difference in rider input would continue dropping. But it didn’t, the test pilot had to pedal 239 W on average, that’s 55 W more than the 80 rpm run. The two other motors required 154 W of rider input.

As the Bosch SX is said to peak at above 100 rpm, we decided to do a run with even higher cadence. The run ended up being 126 rpm, and we couldn’t go much higher. The rider averaged 347 W, which is 108 W more than the 100 rpm test. But it’s also much faster, at 34 seconds. Unfortunately, we didn’t do this test with the other motors. It's possible the SX might have beaten them.


final wattdata sx-cx-ep801.JPG

Climbing at some cadence or other.


Short trail loop results​

The SX performed well on the trail loop. We tried to keep the pedals spinning and play to its strengths. That was a bit difficult as we had to shift a lot and predict which gear we needed after having coasted for a bit. Out of all the three test bikes, this was the one most suited for the test trail. The Schwalbe Nobby Nic rear tyre rolls faster than the Maxxis Minions, and it’s at no disadvantage on this flat and dry trail.

Clocking in at 1 min 47 seconds means the SX is around 4 seconds slower than the full-power CX and EP801. That’s not a whole lot and one could argue it's insignificant. This is totally acceptable for me to get a lighter bike on a gentle trail like this. The SX did well, but if you ride in a group with full-power emtbs, you will be working noticeably harder.

Riding the trail loop


Conclusion​

The SX didn't win in any of our tests., but it’s not far behind on flat terrain. The term “mid-power” is used to describe the SX, and it seems fitting. The SX is surprisingly strong for a small 2 kg motor. You can ride the bike uphill and arrive well rested if you play to its strengths. Picking a lighter gear and pedaling faster than you might be used to will yield better support. The motor characteristics inspires me to pedal faster. It’s an exhilarating ride

I always appreciated having a motor that can shuttle me uphill, it allows for some mid-ride rest. The Bosch SX will do this. Sure, the shuttling is a bit slower than I’m used to, but it doesn’t matter to me. When pedaling hard and fast, there is little downside riding the SX. And when going faster, above motor-cut speed, the small Bosch has the advantage. It feels easier pedaling without motor support.
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knut7
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Comments

That was the trial and info I was waiting for about SX and its „need“ for high cadence.(y)
 
It's a bias test (tendency for SX motor shine).

Full power ebikes, are heavier due to blurier tires, brakes and suspension (travel & rigidity). Testing these kind of bikes against a SL ebike on mellow, soft trails, will not show the reality on trails that are harder and requires more skill to complete.
Basically it's comparing Enduro ebikes with Trail ebikes.
On harder trails, fat ebikes (aka Enduro Ebikes) will shine and these SL Ebikes, with Trail components (suspension/tires/brakes), won't be enought to cut the mostard.

If, you had the opportunity to compare similar class bikes, meaning Full Power Enduro Ebikes vs SL Enduro Ebikes, you would be limit on torque, ond harder climbs, and also limited on range due to smaller batteries.
 
It's a bias test (tendency for SX motor shine).

Full power ebikes, are heavier due to blurier tires, brakes and suspension (travel & rigidity). Testing these kind of bikes against a SL ebike on mellow, soft trails, will not show the reality on trails that are harder and requires more skill to complete.
Basically it's comparing Enduro ebikes with Trail ebikes.
On harder trails, fat ebikes (aka Enduro Ebikes) will shine and these SL Ebikes, with Trail components (suspension/tires/brakes), won't be enought to cut the mostard.

If, you had the opportunity to compare similar class bikes, meaning Full Power Enduro Ebikes vs SL Enduro Ebikes, you would be limit on torque, ond harder climbs, and also limited on range due to smaller batteries.
„This test is done to say something about ride feel and to determine if there are any huge, obvious differences in motor performance.“
 
Can totally answer on the title alone. No. But I appreciate the effort for those that for some reason feel guilty about full powered ebikes.
 
„This test is done to say something about ride feel and to determine if there are any huge, obvious differences in motor performance.“

„This test is done to say something about ride feel and to determine if there are any huge, obvious differences in motor performance.“
"The SX didn't win in any of our tests., but it’s not far behind on flat terrain."

LOL!

Sorry IF I wasn't more direct!

Feel/Performance is Mountains apart, with the same rider, independently, what testers want to shove.

As I wrote before, is a BIAS test, to which leads riders think it's only one or two notchs down on the full power 85Nm.
On average (according to Bosch Flow App - which includes climbs/freewheeling), I pedal between 80 and 85 rpm.
A 55Nm engine will be making 35% less power than a 85Nm, or better still... I would have to pedal 35% more to make same power - which on some climbs is not possible.

A rider with SX motor, won't have a "harder time" following a group (similar physical training) with full fat... because it will be left behind!
 
"The SX didn't win in any of our tests., but it’s not far behind on flat terrain."

LOL!

Sorry IF I wasn't more direct!

Feel/Performance is Mountains apart, with the same rider, independently, what testers want to shove.

As I wrote before, is a BIAS test, to which leads riders think it's only one or two notchs down on the full power 85Nm.
On average (according to Bosch Flow App - which includes climbs/freewheeling), I pedal between 80 and 85 rpm.
A 55Nm engine will be making 35% less power than a 85Nm, or better still... I would have to pedal 35% more to make same power - which on some climbs is not possible.

A rider with SX motor, won't have a "harder time" following a group (similar physical training) with full fat... because it will be left behind!
The whole point of a SL bike is for a rider that has a good physical fitness can have some extra assistance without the extra weight of a full powered bike. The test did clearly states the extra effort that the rider had to provide to match the full powered bikes.
I think too much emphasis is placed on the power and it leads people to believe that they will be the fastest because they have the most power. In the real world, there's never a perfect level of fitness and skill across a group of riders, so regardless of what they ride they can be left behind or be the ones out in front.
I have done many group rides with a full spread of Ebike motors, and I have found that because I am pretty fit from the amount of riding and racing I do on my non-Ebike, that I can beat or at worst keep up with all the full powered bikes in my group. As soon as the trail becomes technical the power makes little difference, and this is on a measly 35Nm of my old Levo SL motor. It's only on the smoother fire trails that the full powered bikes have the advantage.
 
The whole point of a SL bike is for a rider that has a good physical fitness can have some extra assistance without the extra weight of a full powered bike. The test did clearly states the extra effort that the rider had to provide to match the full powered bikes.
I think too much emphasis is placed on the power and it leads people to believe that they will be the fastest because they have the most power. In the real world, there's never a perfect level of fitness and skill across a group of riders, so regardless of what they ride they can be left behind or be the ones out in front.
I have done many group rides with a full spread of Ebike motors, and I have found that because I am pretty fit from the amount of riding and racing I do on my non-Ebike, that I can beat or at worst keep up with all the full powered bikes in my group. As soon as the trail becomes technical the power makes little difference, and this is on a measly 35Nm of my old Levo SL motor. It's only on the smoother fire trails that the full powered bikes have the advantage.
How many SL ebikes do you spot on E-EDR?

Ebikes are no where close to moto, where you can question the use of a 450 vs 250/300 (4 stroke)
 
@knut nes

One thing I've forgotten to include on previous posts:

Could you verify the needed Watts, to turn the pedals (drag) with the motor shutdown?
Meaning, at different speeds, with the motor shut down, are there any differences between SX and CX motor?

To make things ± even, equal tires and wheels would need to be used, transmission and suspension design make difference, but this is more difficult to make equal.

If there was a real difference (+50% difference) this, would make SL bikes morr suitable for longer rides, because the CX motor is really a PITA to pedal, once the assistance is over, or battery is depleated.
 
How many SL ebikes do you spot on E-EDR?

Ebikes are no where close to moto, where you can question the use of a 450 vs 250/300 (4 stroke)
Well, in an EDR race everyone is at a high level of fitness so having the most powerful bike matters. If you are just social riding with friends being first to the top isn't such of an issue, so if you have reasonable fitness, riding a SL with other full powered bikes isn't big deal. How do you think people go on normal bikes when everyone has a different fitness level?
 
The rated Nm isn't as straight forward as it might seem. At a Shimano launch last year I asked about the standard for rating motors. I was told there wasn't any. I still don't think they just make up a number, but it seems there isn't a standard that all manufacturers use.

My assumption is, depending on how the coil is wired and the internal gear reduction, the motors have peak torque at different pedaling frequencies. It felt like the early Yamaha motors peaked at 60 rpm. The Bosch SX appears to have a wider torque curve outputting a high force at above "normal" cadences. The 70 Nm Yamaha will most likely feel more powerful when starting up, but riding at say 75 rpm and above, I would guess the Bosch SX feels stronger. Depending on your riding style, you might get more power out of the SX.
It's no surprise the SX was beaten in this test, but it was interesting trying to quantify the difference. The subjective tests was just as much about trying to describe how they compared for actual trail riding.

@Mario Antony
Yeah, we should try doing that test! I'm not sure we're able to measure a consistent, significant difference. But it's worth a try, as you say, using the same tyre/pressure. I guess we'll just use the same rear wheel and lock out the rear suspension on a steady, paved incline.
 
Well, in an EDR race everyone is at a high level of fitness so having the most powerful bike matters. If you are just social riding with friends being first to the top isn't such of an issue, so if you have reasonable fitness, riding a SL with other full powered bikes isn't big deal. How do you think people go on normal bikes when everyone has a different fitness level?
Well, I undetstand people think SL bikes with a fit rider can come alone on a group of full power.

My though about that, is that is true on some groups, not so, if the group is fit.
We pass (carefully) group of ebikers that climb relaxed (slow?), but no way I would ride like that.

Ebike is to go flatout (max trails for a certain time), or go the distance (max km/discovery for 1 charge of battery.

Because pictures are more than 1000 words, I leave you with a print screen from Flow App.
The ride was performed using eMTB mode, avg speed was 21km/h/75km/1300m.

Notice the rpm used, and imagine the speed climbing things.

Just to end:

With the new crop of ebikes (light full power), SL bikes are just a trend that has began, but already has it's end
 

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The rated Nm isn't as straight forward as it might seem. At a Shimano launch last year I asked about the standard for rating motors. I was told there wasn't any. I still don't think they just make up a number, but it seems there isn't a standard that all manufacturers use.

My assumption is, depending on how the coil is wired and the internal gear reduction, the motors have peak torque at different pedaling frequencies. It felt like the early Yamaha motors peaked at 60 rpm. The Bosch SX appears to have a wider torque curve outputting a high force at above "normal" cadences. The 70 Nm Yamaha will most likely feel more powerful when starting up, but riding at say 75 rpm and above, I would guess the Bosch SX feels stronger. Depending on your riding style, you might get more power out of the SX.
It's no surprise the SX was beaten in this test, but it was interesting trying to quantify the difference. The subjective tests was just as much about trying to describe how they compared for actual trail riding.

@Mario Antony
Yeah, we should try doing that test! I'm not sure we're able to measure a consistent, significant difference. But it's worth a try, as you say, using the same tyre/pressure. I guess we'll just use the same rear wheel and lock out the rear suspension on a steady, paved incline.
That would be very interesting test!
Personally, I think it's a huge drag once motor is disconected.
If possible, compare between other engines.

Yes, the torque seems too much on paper compared to reality
 
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